Dunc20

Alright Guys,

Picture the scene, sat at work, bored out of my mind...was having a chat with the lad sat by me, convo turned to cars, as usual.

Turns out he's the owner of a N-reg Williams Clio (81k, supercip, induction kit, dynoed at 165bhp at flywheel). Now i'm not a competetive guy when it comes to my "my cars faster than yours", because at the age of 20 and the owner of a T-reg UK Turbo, you can imagine i'm pretty made up and over content with the speed of the scooby!!!- just for the record, my estimate is that my car will be running at over 220bhp (induction kit, de-cat system).

Now the first comment this guy came out with when i said i had a scooby was "oh right, nice, yeh, i could beat that in my clio", as he claims he's beaten his mate who owns an STI.

Is this guy talking out of his back passage or could he be right over the whole 'weight to power ration' thing?!

Any of your views are appreciated as i'd quite like to fire some ammo back at him!!

Cheers, Dunc.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Well on average if your running a full decat system then your going to be pushing around 240bhp, your midrange will still be better than the clio's along with the ammout of torque your going to have and a near 200bhp per tonne, thats a little more than the clio's
I can say for a fact that a slightly modified clio williams is no match for an STi (unless its poorly) and even in original form the williams was only capable of hitting 100mph in approx 20 seconds, in standard form the uk turbo will do the same in around 15secs, an sti (depending on which one) will be around the 12 secs mark.... i think that speaks for itself

Tony

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Did i forget to mention that if you run super unleaded or optimax your going to get more power for nothing?

Tony

uxg

Well the on paper facts are as follows. Standard Clio Williams 0-60 in 7.8 sseconds. UK Turbo is officially 6.4 although most magazine tests have managed to get closer to the 6 mark so unless his mods have decreased his 0-60 more than 1.5 seconds he is gonna be struggling and the Scooby would probably be even quicker to 100, plus you have the advantage of 4WD traction off the lights while his fwd clio will be wheelspin city and this is just a straight line performance comparison. If you then involve corners, well we all know what a scoobie does best so I think you are right. He is talking b******s IMHO

chrisp

Power to weight does make a difference .

The clio standard is 150bhp giving about 133bhp/ton. If his is 165bhp then its 146bhp/ton. A standard UK turbo with 215bhp is 177bhp, yours totally decatted is probably close to 230+bhp which gives you 190bhp. His is 2wd so has less transmission losses but i wouldnt have thought he has much of a chance. If it was an old shape STI then the 276bhp had close to 220bhp/ton so even less of a chance and none in the wet .

Other point is torque clio only has 126lb/ft where as a standard scoob has well over 200lb/ft. Torque is thing that makes it feel quick .

Cheers

ChrisP

ChrisB

Less transmission losses for the Clio and lighter as well.

Depends how much you like you clutch and transmission to stay in one piece I guess...

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Ok, here are some facts taken off the Evo forum

Its make, year, engine size, BHP, torque, bhp per tonne, 0-60, max mph

Renault Clio Williams '93-'96 4/1988 150/6100 126/4500 155 7.6 121

Subaru Impreza Turbo '98-00 4/1994 215/5600 214/4000 177 5.4 144

Subaru Impreza P1 '00-'01 4/1994 276/6500 260/4000 219 4.9 150


Tony

[Edited by TonyBurns - 8/14/2002 1:01:34 PM]

chrisp

Tiff Needel tested an standard MY97 UK car with 208bhp in Nov 97 and did 0-60 in 5.2 most tests hover around 5.0 to 5.5 for a UK car and under 5 for an import

chrisp

According to my EVO mag here a clio williams weighes 1146kgs so it cant have 150bhp and 155bhp/ton

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Nahhhhh i think they weigh about 980kg , but if you have ever driven one (or any renault of that era, 16v clio/19 16v etc) you know that its a horrid gearbox and the clutch is very heavy..... they are quick little cars but not in Subaru territory really, it may think its giving you a run for your money but it isnt really

Tony

LG John

Take him on (quite straight road) and then just give a wee nod to say 'I told you so' afterwards. There will be modded williams out there, just as there are modded nova's, saxo's, etc that can eat scoobies but with 165 at the fly he won't have a hope IMO

Andy Hamilton

Interesting this one...
Went from a Williams to my first scoob (UK 97MY) back in Jan 97. Williams is a fantastic little car, I will remember it in years to come as one of my favourite ever cars but IMHO the Scoob is overall in a different class.

Tony, right about the heavy clutch!!

Andy

EvoBarry

If your talking about a straight line race then of course you'll win, but I've seen a Williams Clio go on the twisty stuff and I reckon in some cases it could certainly stay with you.

Its down to driver ability too remember.

All I'm saying is don't underestimate these hot hatches, they can be embarassingly quick sometimes.[]

Dave_UK300

My old saxo vtr would keep up with a 1.8 16v clio with out a problem.

At the end of the day its not going to have a chance

Mo

Try him and see

I think you'll be very surprised with how well it will keep up down the lanes.

I've spoken with someone who had the development superchip fitted to their Williams and they couldn't rate it high enough.

Mmmm...not as clear cut as it would seem - forget your magazine figures

bioforger

iTrader: (1)

yup i had a modded R1916v to about 170bhp. Ok its heavier than a clio, but my standard scoob is just in a different class at all speeds.

That lad needs a rectal examination, lots of mud coming out of him

Arron

It seem's you guys need to talk to the man in the know.

BRING ON IAIN ATKINS

He's had both don't you know and both modded too. woopy doo.

Arron.

Fast_Blue_Scooby

I had a Williams for quite a few years, modded with Magnex exhaust, K+N filter etc, and I went from that to my current MY99 Turbo. To me even though the Williams was a cracking little car, the Scooby is way ahead in terms of driving etc. Where I live there are loads of local country roads I know well. Driving the Scooby along these roads is a sheer joy, the Williams was good fun but there is no way if I was in my Williams now that I would be able to keep up with myself in my Scooby, if you know what I mean.

Plus when there is wet weather, I know which car I would rather me in. Yes in my opinion, the Subaru would beat a Williams easily if both drivers were to the same standard.

iain atkins

<Iain enters stage right>

Hello

Yes i have had both and i would say that the williams was almost on par down the lanes, but as soon as you get to the straights the Scoob would definately have the edge.

BTW mine was dyno'ed at 185 BHP at the flywheel, so it was no slouch.

Ask ARRON - geezer above, he's been a passenger in both.

Cheers



Iain

Scooby Dooby Blue

A friend of mine had a Clio Williams II and back in my <fond smile> boy racer days I used to continually show him up in my 306Rallye.
Now whilst the Pug was IMO a fast car, it's not even close to my UK Scoob.

Arron

I can confirm Iains thoughts on this most( ARH )interesting subject ( can I wake up yet ). I would agree but only if he takes his 400lb base box out the boot.

Arron.

iain atkins

Cheeky fekker!!!

LOL

sammyh

iTrader: (1)

I had a 250 bhp 205 and that was no match for a scoob

Attu

I had a Renault 19 16v and then a Clio Williams II with full decat Scorpion exhaust and a K&N induction, ive now got a 98 Turbo PPP and to be honest there is no comparison between the two.
Yes the Clio Williams is a very nice car but its no match for an Impreza turbo.

Andy