WRX not as good as Focus RS
13 August 2002, 11:45 PM
#1
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 428
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not claiming that but Autocar seem to think the Focus RS is the best thing since sliced bread, and that includes surprisingly good wet weather performance.
Interesting to note they limit torque to 177lb/ft in first and second gear, full torque (228lb/ft if I recall) only being available from third gear upwards. So even with the Quaife diff they are playing it safe. Wouldn't mind a shot in one.
Hope its better than the ST170, drove one of them and it was slow as hell. Felt more like 130bhp.
Prospective WRX owners - will you test drive this car or reject it out of hand even though it appears to rewrite the FWD rulebook?
[Edited by TurboBoost - 8/14/2002 7:34:28 AM]
Interesting to note they limit torque to 177lb/ft in first and second gear, full torque (228lb/ft if I recall) only being available from third gear upwards. So even with the Quaife diff they are playing it safe. Wouldn't mind a shot in one.
Hope its better than the ST170, drove one of them and it was slow as hell. Felt more like 130bhp.
Prospective WRX owners - will you test drive this car or reject it out of hand even though it appears to rewrite the FWD rulebook?
[Edited by TurboBoost - 8/14/2002 7:34:28 AM]
14 August 2002, 04:56 AM
#3
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Notts, UK
Posts: 4,935
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Scappy.
You will be waiting until at least 2005 then.
4x4 version will not be available until the next generation Focus and Ford will not commit time until the mini MPV varient is complete.
Lee
You will be waiting until at least 2005 then.
4x4 version will not be available until the next generation Focus and Ford will not commit time until the mini MPV varient is complete.
Lee
14 August 2002, 07:24 AM
#4
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,129
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Anyone considering buying a £20k 'sportscar' (WRX, CooperS, CTR etc) would be an idiot to dismiss this car out of hand just because it's FWD. The ITR was an awesome FWD car, and the Focus may be too.
C
C
14 August 2002, 08:09 AM
#5
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 946
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It may be nice buts its a focus. Fwd must seriously limit potential for mods. Alot of scoob owners upgrade and PPP their cars and you wont be as easily able to do that with the ford.
14 August 2002, 08:22 AM
#6
Scooby Senior
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 8,204
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Chucksters right
Dismissing the RS because its a ford and FWD is just plain blinkered.
I have no doubt the RS will be a storming drive as its taken enough time in development to get right.
I welcome any competition to Subaru, because it forces Subaru to up their game for subsequent models.
I'm just pleased there are so many car makers making 20K or under performance cars. A few years ago it was just Subaru and a few others.
We've never had it so good.
Dismissing the RS because its a ford and FWD is just plain blinkered.
I have no doubt the RS will be a storming drive as its taken enough time in development to get right.
I welcome any competition to Subaru, because it forces Subaru to up their game for subsequent models.
I'm just pleased there are so many car makers making 20K or under performance cars. A few years ago it was just Subaru and a few others.
We've never had it so good.
14 August 2002, 08:24 AM
#7
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Some country and western
Posts: 13,488
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think you could buy a Focus run it for a year, and make a very small loss too as they are only producing a certain amount a year.
Think how well the first Puma's held their value and recently the Civis type R.
Think how well the first Puma's held their value and recently the Civis type R.
Trending Topics
14 August 2002, 08:28 AM
#8
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Wales
Posts: 1,201
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My thoughts exactly! Its a bl**dy Ford. Service and aftersales with Ford are downright appaling where i live. Even travelling about 30 miles to another main dealer gets you yet again rubbish backwards customer care. I speak from experience having owned 2 brand new Fords both with major problems. The ecu was broken in my new Escort GTI as i drove it off the forecourt for petes sake!! Not mentioning the water leaks brakes and all the other crap that seems to happen while owning a Ford. I was even told that "nothing is perfect on a new car", what the hell....excuse me but isn't it like "BRAND NEW", Customer Services hung up on me on a number of occasions too....dumbasses!!
As you can see i've really got it in for them and to be honest i'd never ever buy another Ford car even if it carried the Cosworth badge and had 500hp. For 24k i'd rather an S3 quattro/S2000/Type R Civic etc etc (had two S3's already) very nice car and very reliable although expensive!
As you can see i've really got it in for them and to be honest i'd never ever buy another Ford car even if it carried the Cosworth badge and had 500hp. For 24k i'd rather an S3 quattro/S2000/Type R Civic etc etc (had two S3's already) very nice car and very reliable although expensive!
14 August 2002, 08:36 AM
#9
Scooby Regular
I seriously hope the RS *is* better - and it appears to be the case according to Autocar - lets bring on the whingers....."but it's a Ford"/but it's only FWD/blah blah (oh sorry, that's already been said 
)
Seems some people on here are only truly happy when they have something to whinge about - it's only a lump of steel....
[Edited by Dave T-S - 8/14/2002 8:38:40 AM]
)Seems some people on here are only truly happy when they have something to whinge about
- it's only a lump of steel....[Edited by Dave T-S - 8/14/2002 8:38:40 AM]
14 August 2002, 08:44 AM
#10
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,129
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wilf, getting more power is a tedious obsession of many scoob owners - it really is the new cossie. I don't care how much more power a WRX has got, a better handling, more involving car will be more *fun* (ask any WRX STI owner who moved from a PPP'd or decatted WRX - the STI is a better car fundementally).
C
[Edited by chuckster - 8/14/2002 8:47:06 AM]
C
[Edited by chuckster - 8/14/2002 8:47:06 AM]
14 August 2002, 08:56 AM
#11
Scooby Regular
Just to add, i've driven a number of Focuses, and they are a cracking car to drive, also saw a Focus RS in the flesh a couple of weeks ago and it looked really nice - but then I don't wear Subaru blinkers and can respect any performance car in its own right....
14 August 2002, 09:18 AM
#12
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 119
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Didn't Autocar say the same things about the Alfa 156GTA until they drove it on a road with a bump in it?
Personally I prefer the golf R32 a couple of pages further down the magazine. Its on the german VW site where you can download the sounds of the engine, It sounds fantastic!
Rich B
Personally I prefer the golf R32 a couple of pages further down the magazine. Its on the german VW site where you can download the sounds of the engine, It sounds fantastic!
Rich B
14 August 2002, 09:23 AM
#14
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,440
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am going to have a test drive to see what it is like compared to my MY01 WRX. Will it only be available as a 3 door? If so that rules it out for me as I have kids and need 4 doors, hatchbacks are a real pain to get kids seats & kids in.
14 August 2002, 09:30 AM
#15
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 8,021
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was going to test drive it but have bought an STI instead. Liked the idea of a limited prodn run, and being a ford every boy racer and his mate is likely to want one second hand, keeps residuals up.
14 August 2002, 09:40 AM
#16
Scooby Regular
being a ford every boy racer and his mate is likely to want one second hand, keeps residuals up.
14 August 2002, 09:46 AM
#17
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 481
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well try this on for size: My mate is (allegedly) one of the (alleged) engineers on the project, and when Autocar (allegedly) came to test it back to back with the WRX (it should be in Autocar in a couple of weeks) around Goodwood, with the same driver, the Focus RS took 2.5 secs off the WRX PER LAP!!! (allegedly)
Methinks thats pretty definitive.
Sorry guys, but what with the Focus and the Golf R32, which Autocar reckon is as good as the WRX in most respects (better in cabin quality at least), the Impreza will seriously need to make a few changes for the MY03 more than just cosmetic to stay on top. Plus i do think that Golf looks impressively hard...
I'd soil myself if i saw that in my rear view mirror.
(allegedly)
[Edited by beefola - 8/14/2002 10:40:23 AM]
Methinks thats pretty definitive.
Sorry guys, but what with the Focus and the Golf R32, which Autocar reckon is as good as the WRX in most respects (better in cabin quality at least), the Impreza will seriously need to make a few changes for the MY03 more than just cosmetic to stay on top. Plus i do think that Golf looks impressively hard...
I'd soil myself if i saw that in my rear view mirror.
(allegedly)
[Edited by beefola - 8/14/2002 10:40:23 AM]
14 August 2002, 09:57 AM
#18
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 8,021
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dave TS - Very true. The problem Subaru has is that your average man in the street when looking at a small fast family car goes Astra SRI, Golf GTI, Focus ST170...hang on a minute whats that RS thingy... cor I'll have one of them.
Subaru need to get Mr Average in the show room. Unfortunately faced with the Impreza GX vs an Astra SRi, most people would go for the Astra(no offence to GX drivers), when you consider insurance, mpg, servicing costs, avialbility of dealers etc.
My dad recently changed his car, he wanted an estate that could lug round bags of cement (while he was doing up his garden). He wnet to look at a Forester, and really liked it. In the end he got a Scenic, 'cos it was 4 grand less, came with aircon, leather as standard. The Subaru dealer wasnt falling over himself trying to sell a car either.
Subaru need to get Mr Average in the show room. Unfortunately faced with the Impreza GX vs an Astra SRi, most people would go for the Astra(no offence to GX drivers), when you consider insurance, mpg, servicing costs, avialbility of dealers etc.
My dad recently changed his car, he wanted an estate that could lug round bags of cement (while he was doing up his garden). He wnet to look at a Forester, and really liked it. In the end he got a Scenic, 'cos it was 4 grand less, came with aircon, leather as standard. The Subaru dealer wasnt falling over himself trying to sell a car either.
14 August 2002, 09:59 AM
#19
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 25,080
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Please don't tell me Ford are actually releasing the Focus RS? blimey, never thought I'd see the day!
I do kinda like it, and I know the focus handles pretty well, and for once, I can comment as I've driven an ickle one from Manchester to Edinburgh along the A47, and must say it did handle rather well, and as it was a hire car I was giving it serious stick
Would I swap the blackbeast for a Focus RS? hmm, nope sorry.
I would say I'd wait for the Focus Cossie, but I'll be waiting an eternity for that. Ford's really dropped the ball on this one, they should have had the RS and Cossie out a few months after the launch of the Focus. Not slagging of existing cossie powered cars, I do have a big soft spot for Esc Cossies, but ford needs a NEW car to rival the WRX and needs it NOW.
The RS might tempt potential WRX buyers, but potential STi Type UK buyers? hmm, i don't think so.
I do kinda like it, and I know the focus handles pretty well, and for once, I can comment as I've driven an ickle one from Manchester to Edinburgh along the A47, and must say it did handle rather well, and as it was a hire car I was giving it serious stick
Would I swap the blackbeast for a Focus RS? hmm, nope sorry.
I would say I'd wait for the Focus Cossie, but I'll be waiting an eternity for that. Ford's really dropped the ball on this one, they should have had the RS and Cossie out a few months after the launch of the Focus. Not slagging of existing cossie powered cars, I do have a big soft spot for Esc Cossies, but ford needs a NEW car to rival the WRX and needs it NOW.
The RS might tempt potential WRX buyers, but potential STi Type UK buyers? hmm, i don't think so.
14 August 2002, 10:03 AM
#20
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,129
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The R32 will have to be something very special to tempt a Focus RS or WRX buyer. Last 'hot'(?) golf I drove was a V6 4motion thing and it was dreadfull - heavy, uncommunicative and uninspiring. Got a S3(225bhp) and that's a fine all round car - but have to say I preferred my old MY99PPP as a pure 'drivers car'.
Still saying that, the sub-£25k new car market is getting better and the choice broader all the time - which is a very fine thing.
C
Still saying that, the sub-£25k new car market is getting better and the choice broader all the time - which is a very fine thing.
C
14 August 2002, 10:11 AM
#21
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: £1.785m reasons not to be here :)
Posts: 6,095
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OK, so this is Scoobynet 
BUT I'd be very tempted with that Focus as opposed to a (slightly more expensive) WRX.
Looking in detail
Brakes - Focus has Brembo's IIRC. WRX doesn't
Handling
Focus was developed with help from Delacour. Its acknowledged that Ford have some of the best chassis engineers in the business. Shame they can't fix the Jaguar R3 F1 car....
OK, so its FWD. So was my IntegraR and that handled better than my MY99 Turbo. My money says an out the box focus will be more fun and handle better than an out the box WRX.
Performance.
Hmm...close call. Once rolling the Focus will probably have the legs on a WRX. Remember 0 to 60 standing starts are for the timed quarter mile, oh, and the traffic lights GP
Build.
Ford v Subaru. Both will have good and bad points. Neither is an Audi...LOL.... And remember the Focus won the German reliability survey.
And I wouldn't expect any of the niggles that affect Scoobs - you know, windows, paint, underseal, hesitation, det, etc, etc, etc...
Looks.
No contest....Focus has it 100%. Maybe the MY03 facelift will change that.
Dealer service.
This is what hits the Ford. Subaru dealers generally will be better. To compare problems with an Escort Gti (WTF????) with a 2002 ford is not realistic however.
Cost.
Focus will be MUCH cheaper to run (and a bit cheaper to buy)and will hold its value better.
Conclusion?
For me, if it drives as good as it should, it will be a blast to own, will be faster (ultimately) accross country (and cerainly on the track) as standard than a UK WRX will be.
I'd have one, no doubt.
Unless an STI7 was an option but thats not a fair comparison.
D
BUT I'd be very tempted with that Focus as opposed to a (slightly more expensive) WRX.
Looking in detail
Brakes - Focus has Brembo's IIRC. WRX doesn't
Handling
Focus was developed with help from Delacour. Its acknowledged that Ford have some of the best chassis engineers in the business. Shame they can't fix the Jaguar R3 F1 car....
OK, so its FWD. So was my IntegraR and that handled better than my MY99 Turbo. My money says an out the box focus will be more fun and handle better than an out the box WRX.
Performance.
Hmm...close call. Once rolling the Focus will probably have the legs on a WRX. Remember 0 to 60 standing starts are for the timed quarter mile, oh, and the traffic lights GP
Build.
Ford v Subaru. Both will have good and bad points. Neither is an Audi...LOL.... And remember the Focus won the German reliability survey.
And I wouldn't expect any of the niggles that affect Scoobs - you know, windows, paint, underseal, hesitation, det, etc, etc, etc...
Looks.
No contest....Focus has it 100%. Maybe the MY03 facelift will change that.
Dealer service.
This is what hits the Ford. Subaru dealers generally will be better. To compare problems with an Escort Gti (WTF????) with a 2002 ford is not realistic however.
Cost.
Focus will be MUCH cheaper to run (and a bit cheaper to buy)and will hold its value better.
Conclusion?
For me, if it drives as good as it should, it will be a blast to own, will be faster (ultimately) accross country (and cerainly on the track) as standard than a UK WRX will be.
I'd have one, no doubt.
Unless an STI7 was an option
but thats not a fair comparison.D
14 August 2002, 10:16 AM
#22
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 481
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Er, i could be wrong, but i actually remember being told that it was a STi7 Uk that it wupped at Goodwood. I'll confirm when i can get hold of him.
165bhp/tonne, whats the STi got?
Just trying to think whether its possible thats all. I think with that power/weight ratio, and the superior handling, its more than possible.
165bhp/tonne, whats the STi got?
Just trying to think whether its possible thats all. I think with that power/weight ratio, and the superior handling, its more than possible.
14 August 2002, 10:32 AM
#23
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 523
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Having had a MY99 and not liking the 'bug eye' regardless of headlamp mod I would buy an RS over a MY01/MY02/MY03 providing it is good fun. I think the RS takes the biscuit visually (having looked at the photos on this BB) and to be honest FWD can be a shed load more 'fun' then an extremely competant and flattering AWD set up. I think that sometimes a car that gets out of shape more easily is more 'fun' than an absolutely sorted car - what ever floats your boat.
14 August 2002, 10:57 AM
#24
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 946
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Gosh my reply got a right roasting on the first page.
Couple of points:-
1. I love fords - used to be Capri 2.8 fanatic.
2. I rate the Focus - its a great car to drive nearly bought one as a run about a while back.
3. I also dont disagree the new Focus RS may be better off the shelf than the bug eye WRX.
My point was that I dont think alot of scoob owners will move to the Ford. I reckon for a few extra K the WRX PPP/STI will still probably be a better buy or even an old shape impreza for that matter.
I also think that at 20k the Focus will cause hot hatch buyers to think twice before taking the plunge.
ps You dont think badge snobbery matters - tell that to every Audi/Merc owner
pps I have no hang ups about fwd its just that it does limit the potential to mod which alot of people on here seem to want. If torque has to be reduced in 1st and 2nd to cope with present outputs it doesnt bode well for seriously upping the game.
Couple of points:-
1. I love fords - used to be Capri 2.8 fanatic.
2. I rate the Focus - its a great car to drive nearly bought one as a run about a while back.
3. I also dont disagree the new Focus RS may be better off the shelf than the bug eye WRX.
My point was that I dont think alot of scoob owners will move to the Ford. I reckon for a few extra K the WRX PPP/STI will still probably be a better buy or even an old shape impreza for that matter.
I also think that at 20k the Focus will cause hot hatch buyers to think twice before taking the plunge.
ps You dont think badge snobbery matters - tell that to every Audi/Merc owner
pps I have no hang ups about fwd its just that it does limit the potential to mod which alot of people on here seem to want. If torque has to be reduced in 1st and 2nd to cope with present outputs it doesnt bode well for seriously upping the game.
14 August 2002, 11:27 AM
#25
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 481
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have just confirmed that it was an STi7 UK that the RS beat round Goodwood by 2.5 secs per lap.
Now you scooby nutters can't deny that that's damn impressive.
Beef (putting on flame retardant suit as he types...)
Now you scooby nutters can't deny that that's damn impressive.
Beef (putting on flame retardant suit as he types...)
14 August 2002, 11:32 AM
#26
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Hull. East Yorkshire.
Posts: 239
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
PRIOR TO BUYING UK300 PPP,I HAD PREVIOUSLY OWNED 14 "HOT" FORDS RANGING FROM MK1 RS TURBO ESCORT THROUGH TO THE COSWORTH RANGE.ONLY JUMPED SHIP BECAUSE I GOT FED UP WAITING FOR THE FOCUS RS TO APPEAR,ORIGINALLY DUE 18 MONTHS AGO!!!SAW THE CAR AT RS OWNERS NATIONAL DAY 2001 DOING DEMONSTRATION LAPS AND IT LOOKED VERY QUICK.I THINK THE CAR WOULD BE EXCELLENT VALUE AT £20,000 BUT I THINK FORD MAY HAVE MISSED BOAT WITH THE LIKES OF SUBARU AND MITSUBISHI TAKING THEIR CUSTOMERS.I ALSO AGREE WITH A PREVIOS REPLY THAT FORD DON`T GIVE TWO S***S ABOUT THEIR CUSTOMERS ONCE THEY HAVE SOLD THEM A CAR! THIS IS SOMETHING I HAVE NOT FOUND SINCE OWNING A SUBARU.