john banks

Anyone tried one? They seem a cracking buy used right now. I only do 7000 miles a year, so depreciation is a much greater cost than fuel.

The weight seems reasonable (1710kg although M5 is only 70kg more), and the toys are nice, I quite like the looks

I gather the brakes wilt, but can be improved with just a better pad.

I know it wouldn't be an Evo on wet B-roads, but I'm mainly on A-roads or really slow C roads these days, and I'm a bit tired of the Evo's image, noise etc.

I went through this before when going from tuned Scooby to M3. I didn't get on with it because of the bounciness, lack of torque, poor brakes, and to some degree the winter capabilities.

I gather the M5/M6 are more compliant with adjustable suspension, obviously more torque, and you can get winter tyres/wheels for them which might well make them as competent as a Subarishi in winter wearing summer tyres.

I quite fancy a GTR but they are a little way away.

Getting rid of the Evo in the present climate would be a pain, 400 BHP Evo IX, 20000 miles, 55 plate, thinking about £17k to shift it.

I suppose I should go and try an M6, but if I turn up in an Evo they will probably show me the way off their forecourt

LG John

incl 75kg driver

Eat more

Why an M6 over the M5? I just had a look and they seem to be pretty much the same in terms of value for money. My guess is that an M5 would always be a little easier to sell and is clearly the more practical choice. When I read the thread I was expecting to find the M6 a good £5-7k cheaper car-for-car against the M5 but that doesn't appear to be the case

I'm watching the e46 M3 post-2003 models with interest. Depreciate my little lovelies......depreciate...

john banks

M6 starts out at about £20k more and seems similar used. The attraction was the lower weight, but there is only about one passenger in it, more choice of M5s, easier to sell etc.

When I was looking for an E46 M3 I also considered the E39 M5, but didn't find a nice one. If you got a good one they are seriously well priced, but could be expensive to fix out of warranty with VANOS issues etc.

LG John

The warranty issue is the killer with the older M5s. Out of the e39 M5 and e46 M3 I think I'd rather take my chances with an out of warranty M3.

£20k! Wow, what were you getting for that money new over a new M5?

john banks

A bit less weight, carbon roof, slightly lower. Not worth the difference when new especially considering the depreciation that many expected right from the start.

RS Grant

Completely off topic, but JB were you heading over to Dundee last week.. I passed an Evo which I thought could have been yours on the Tay Bridge. Would have been mid-late afternoon I think.


Cheers,
Grant

LG John

LOL, so essentially when buying new you are paying for the 'looks' which are....meeeeh to be honest. I think all things considered I'd probably plump for the M5 if I had this choice. Either way, considering both can be had with low miles on a 55 plate for low £40s it's a lot of car for the dosh.

However, I have to ask: why not get the V8 RS4 which are roughly the same money for a slightly younger model with less miles (2006/7 with 10-20k for low £40s), 4wd for all weather performance, regarded as being as capable as e46 M3 in the dry, far nicer interior IMHO, very classy (which is what the Evo lacks), looks the nuts (especially in avant form) and better build quality than the BMW's.

Or, rumour has it the twin-turbo 3.0 straight fitted in the 335i is being tuned reliably to 400bhp (and possibly beyond). Get a one year old model with all the trimmings, fit an LSD and it'll romp an e46 csl and you can even get it badged up as a 2.0d

john banks

Yes, Grant you have email to yahoo.

Not tried the RS4 but think it might be a bit slow. They don't usually make quoted power on the dyno, quarter mile terminal is dull (M6 is 118mph) and I don't want a manual. They are also having the dreaded DRC troubles, otherwise I might consider one of the last model RS6 as I like how they drive even though some think they are boats. That auto and twin turbo V8 are lovely together

The new S4 will be a 3.0 supercharged. I do also fancy a look at a 335i or even the d.

The M6 is lighter, reading some comparisons the exhaust sounds a bit nicer, steering has more feel, and it feels more nimble.

For looks alone, I like the 335i, RS4 - as saloons. If they put that 4.0 twin turbo V8 and four wheel drive from the X6 into the 335i I would be in heaven.

I prefer the looks of the 335i/RS4 to the new GTR, but that has all the hardware and firepower from the sound of it.

LG John

I've not driven the cars in question but I have a feeling you might run into the same issues that you did with the M3. You seem to desire the quality, refinement and upmarket feel (and toys) of a BMW/Audi/Merc but some of the thrills that you get from chucking a scooby/evo around.

I fear any 1500kg+, rwd GT style car is going to frustrate you in the same way the M3 did. The RS4/6 are probably the best compromise as the 4wd takes you closer to the scooby/evo experience and allows more liberties in the terrible scottish weather. However, the rs6 is - at the end of the day - a heavy b@stard and the rs4 is manual only.

I suspect the GTR is probably the best step towards meeting these aspirations or alternatively it's the old game of deciding which compromises you are prepared to make the most.

You know me, I love the chucky around, manic, feel fast thing but in the last 1-2 years I've been really frustrated at the lack of refinement, quality, class and ease of driving from my recent chariots. I loved the S2000 but it was without question still a lot of work on a jaunt up the A9. I believe something like an SMG M3 will tick most of my boxes because I'm prepared to compromise and accept that it can't be threaded through tight twisty/bumpy roads like the scooby could (or probably even the Honda).

I see a lot of the same arguments/points in your original post that you aired when considering the modded scooby-M3 change but I'm still not sure you are willing to live with some of the short-comings of making the change. I hope you don't feel I'm being rude with all this; I'm just bouncing back some thoughts/ideas as I think I have a reasonable understanding of what makes you tick with a car.

Oh, oh, what about a tiptronic x50 996 911 turbo? With a DMS exhaust and remap you'll get 500-550bhp.

* 4wd - check
* fast - check (sh*t off a shovel)
* handles - check
* Value - check (done a lot of its depreciation)
* Looks - check
* Quality/image - check

As an added bonus you could probably still fanny around with it since it's turbo charged

john banks

The 996 X50 with a map might do nicely, often fancied one. Tried a non-X50 Turbo when I had the M3 and decided to buy an Evo instead, although I liked the way the 996 drove I didn't go home and dream about having one, I actually enjoyed the heavy RS6 just as much because it was so much better than I'd read about, and the sound of that V8 even on the standard exhaust was just fabulous.

The only car I ever really longed to get was my Scooby! Nothing since has got under my skin in the same way. For some reason though, the new ones don't seem to have the same magic any more, but I don't want an old one now.

LG John

I know exactly what you mean! I have no doubt the 911 would be better in nearly every way but I think if I had the cash I'd still pay that little more for a 360M.

I also know what you mean about the Impreza. Part of the problem is expectation I suspect. Like me when you were younger the Impreza was the iconic car and as you progressively tuned yours it continued to deliver on nearly all fronts. However, once you've had something that capable it almost seems that much harder to suitably raise the stakes. The fastest car I've owned is a 310bhp classic scooby and the other week I was in a 505hp vette that'll crack a ton in 8.5 seconds. As impressive as the vette was it just didn't thrill me in the way I was blown away by my first run in a 1996 208bhp wagon.

I mean think about it your turning your nose up at an RS4 for being too slow (believe me I have the same problem every time I play the pistonheads game and compare it to the M5 for the same money). WTF is that all about?? RS4s will decimate 99.9% of the cars you'll come across in any given day!

Life is cruel!

Ringpeas

My heart bleeds for both of you

I drive a 1.8 Honda Accord

R4LLY

iTrader: (1)

The M6 is now alot of car for the money.
This car is seriously rapid, granted it is only once you get into 3 figures that it really starts to motor, it is however nonetheless awesome.
The only problem is the SMG, once warranty is out this can be very expensive to fix, as it is not if but when....
Even with a few days hard driving it gave a transmission fault and had to be reset.
It is not really chuckable, however the levels of grip that can be achieved in long sweeping bends is awesome, you have to look twice at the speedo to actually believe the speed it is taking the corner at, however at the end of it all it still is a GT car, good for long drives and long bends, however not ideal for track or sharp/aggressive turns.

The RS4 doesn't make quoted power and is quite slow in real life conditions, it actually is very similar performance wise to a E46 M3, which is quite dissapointing. However the handling and balance of a RS4 is awesome and it is very well setup for track use and twisties, just needs more grunt...

The 335I/D are awesome especially when mapped. The 335I can get to 400hp relatively easily...
The 335D is amazingly quick when mapped and returns the MPG! Over a 3/4 mile tournament last year a mapped 335D was on par with a CSL M3 and was embarassing TVR's and E39 M5's.

For the price of an M6 there are a lot of variety, especially in today's market, however the M6 is a very unique beast and you would definitely not regret buying one.

Deep Singh

John as you know I have the M5. This is what I think

1) The M6 will be alot better than the M5 in handling terms. I had a 645 as a loan car for a few weeks and that felt alot nimbler than my M5. I'm not sure whether the extra weight of the 5 litre V10 would negate this effect though

2) I presume it has the same brakes as my M5 and they have never wilted

3) The engine is a little bit like a turbo, lacks a little torque below 3k but then takes off. The real sweet spot is 5k to redline, takes some getting used to. In some ways its not the best way to configure the engine of a road car. Its the only car I've ever had though where there is NO let up in power as you hit the red line

4) SMG is awkward for things like 3 point turns.

5) Please beware fuel economy. The M6 should be a little better than the M5 but from what I've heard its not. Expect 10-12mpg around town. I'm feeling the pain right now as you can imagine.

6) The toys are fantastic. The fully active seats are to die for, light years beyond cheap versions in the RS4.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

On of my kids mates dad has one, waiting for a go in it but he says its ruinous to run and though its fun its too fast for his talent and too easy to get him in trouble, he said that he can have more fun in lower powered cars and that its total overkill and too conspicuous .

He did say it does low teens mpg, a set of tyres was £1200, this is why they are cracking value !