Old M3's
27 October 2006, 11:19 PM
#1
Old M3's
As usual I have my 'Car of the week', i.e. the car that I would buy should I have the money to do so, still going to be next summer bewfore I do anything but I like to do my reasearch upfront !
I am torn between a diesel and something daft, this weeks diesel is a Volvo S60 and daft for the next few days is the old shape M3 (about R reg 98) which can be bought for 8 grand or therabouts.
Is that a road to bankruptcy and insanity or a reasonably priced way into a 300 + bhp car ?
I know they have Vanos issues but is there much else that breaks, I know Astraboy has had issues, with his M3 that is.
Probably best asking on a BMW forum but I thought I would start here.
I am torn between a diesel and something daft, this weeks diesel is a Volvo S60 and daft for the next few days is the old shape M3 (about R reg 98) which can be bought for 8 grand or therabouts.
Is that a road to bankruptcy and insanity or a reasonably priced way into a 300 + bhp car ?
I know they have Vanos issues but is there much else that breaks, I know Astraboy has had issues, with his M3 that is.
Probably best asking on a BMW forum but I thought I would start here.
09 November 2006, 02:15 PM
#5
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I'm no expert (far from it)
but i've heard that the pre-evo has less problems than the 320 odd bhp evo model.
even though the 286bhp model is down on power its not meant to be as peaky and the 286bhp is normally a lot higher when put on a rolling road (bmw put this figure quite low) more like 300bhp. ( i may be wrong)
Evo bought their Ring Track weapon M3 for that very reason
I'm sure some experts and owners will be along shortly to put me right 
but i've heard that the pre-evo has less problems than the 320 odd bhp evo model.
even though the 286bhp model is down on power its not meant to be as peaky and the 286bhp is normally a lot higher when put on a rolling road (bmw put this figure quite low) more like 300bhp. ( i may be wrong)
Evo bought their Ring Track weapon M3 for that very reason
I'm sure some experts and owners will be along shortly to put me right
09 November 2006, 02:59 PM
#6
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Damn right I've had issues
3k's worth of engine repairs to be precise
here's a pic of the old girl going into the workshop (on a back of a recovery lorry, natch)
However, there is light at the end of the tunnel, when she comes out, she'll be bulletproof, packing 300bhp and be armed with a nice 40% locking diff, perfect for a spot of supersideways drift action
astraboy.
3k's worth of engine repairs to be precise
here's a pic of the old girl going into the workshop (on a back of a recovery lorry, natch)
However, there is light at the end of the tunnel, when she comes out, she'll be bulletproof, packing 300bhp and be armed with a nice 40% locking diff, perfect for a spot of supersideways drift action
astraboy.
09 November 2006, 03:32 PM
#7
Damm fine cars have had 2 of them. Bullet proof and the vanos is about 2K if you do a deal with BMW who accept some responsibility for the Vanos.
Only thing I would add is they don't feel as quick as a scoob or a lot of other near . Most of them on a dyno hit only 300bhp at best. The power is very linear without any thump in the back. At least the E46 M3 picks up it skirt and goes for it at about 5.5K, which puts a smile on your face.
But the E36 is a little boring to be honest.
A 130TDI VW would give you more of a smile around town. The M3 is a motorway muncher.
Normal driving the 328I is much nicer, its not until you stretch its legs you begine to realise the power the E36 has.
Oh! and be careful these is a lot of CATC/D examples out there so make sure you do a HPI first.
Rock solid cars though if you can find a good one.
Only thing I would add is they don't feel as quick as a scoob or a lot of other near . Most of them on a dyno hit only 300bhp at best. The power is very linear without any thump in the back. At least the E46 M3 picks up it skirt and goes for it at about 5.5K, which puts a smile on your face.
But the E36 is a little boring to be honest.
A 130TDI VW would give you more of a smile around town. The M3 is a motorway muncher.
Normal driving the 328I is much nicer, its not until you stretch its legs you begine to realise the power the E36 has.
Oh! and be careful these is a lot of CATC/D examples out there so make sure you do a HPI first.
Rock solid cars though if you can find a good one.
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09 November 2006, 04:27 PM
#8
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Originally Posted by RobEvo5
Damm fine cars have had 2 of them. Bullet proof and the vanos is about 2K if you do a deal with BMW who accept some responsibility for the Vanos.
Only thing I would add is they don't feel as quick as a scoob or a lot of other near . Most of them on a dyno hit only 300bhp at best. The power is very linear without any thump in the back. At least the E46 M3 picks up it skirt and goes for it at about 5.5K, which puts a smile on your face.
But the E36 is a little boring to be honest.
A 130TDI VW would give you more of a smile around town. The M3 is a motorway muncher.
Normal driving the 328I is much nicer, its not until you stretch its legs you begine to realise the power the E36 has.
Oh! and be careful these is a lot of CATC/D examples out there so make sure you do a HPI first.
Rock solid cars though if you can find a good one.
Only thing I would add is they don't feel as quick as a scoob or a lot of other near . Most of them on a dyno hit only 300bhp at best. The power is very linear without any thump in the back. At least the E46 M3 picks up it skirt and goes for it at about 5.5K, which puts a smile on your face.
But the E36 is a little boring to be honest.
A 130TDI VW would give you more of a smile around town. The M3 is a motorway muncher.
Normal driving the 328I is much nicer, its not until you stretch its legs you begine to realise the power the E36 has.
Oh! and be careful these is a lot of CATC/D examples out there so make sure you do a HPI first.
Rock solid cars though if you can find a good one.
09 November 2006, 06:11 PM
#9
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I looked seriously at an older 3.0 (non-Evo) before settling on my 98 WRX wagon. Whoever said it doesn't feel like 300bhp or thereabouts is right. There's not a lot of drama going on there when you deploy the right foot. Which can be a good or bad thing.
They are quick, but in the end I just found the E36 really claustrophobic inside, everything was too tight. And I had driven Clios for some time.
The best option is the M3 GT with a slightly higher tune of the 3.0 lump and a better spoiler and front splitter. It's just a case of finding one.
TBH though I don't think I'd want an E36 M3 after having driven a few. I'd go for an M5 or an earlier E30 M3 instead.
They are quick, but in the end I just found the E36 really claustrophobic inside, everything was too tight. And I had driven Clios for some time.
The best option is the M3 GT with a slightly higher tune of the 3.0 lump and a better spoiler and front splitter. It's just a case of finding one.
TBH though I don't think I'd want an E36 M3 after having driven a few. I'd go for an M5 or an earlier E30 M3 instead.
09 November 2006, 07:14 PM
#10
p.s get and insurance quote as well. The M3 Evo was the second highest I have ever paid for insurance on a car. The Mitsi Evo5 was the highest. UK subaru at the time was £600 M3 Evo was £1200
10 November 2006, 07:47 AM
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astrabioy have you dont a conversion to that bmw of yours? im not good with bms but im sure isnt an M3 is it?
mate a new engine would have cost £1800 probably easier to have changed it? (i considered putting one in my 325 coupe, but didnt wanna muck abiout too much so sticking with another 2.5 engine
)
mate a new engine would have cost £1800 probably easier to have changed it? (i considered putting one in my 325 coupe, but didnt wanna muck abiout too much so sticking with another 2.5 engine
)
10 November 2006, 08:27 AM
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Ok, I know this is really a BMW forum question, but does anyone know what "E" number refers to what BMW over the last 10 years or so eg E36, made between ...............?
10 November 2006, 09:11 AM
#13
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"E" vehicle codes, quite up to date BMW World - BMW Codes
Engine codes - BMW World - BMW Codes
The "E" code will v soon be dropped and "F" will be used instead for new models.
Engine codes - BMW World - BMW Codes
The "E" code will v soon be dropped and "F" will be used instead for new models.
Last edited by Nat; 10 November 2006 at 09:13 AM.
10 November 2006, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by The Chief
Evo bought their Ring Track weapon M3 for that very reason
Spend a little less on a non-Evo and mod the F out of it!
11 November 2006, 01:17 PM
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Jacko, Ive had three c.98 M3 evos and four pre evo 3.0 M3s, lovely cars IMHO.
Decent power, good comfort, good build quality. The E36 shape is now looking a little dated but this is compensated for with the falling prices, Ive seen 3.0s selling for around the £4.5k> mark.
Best not to think of the M3 as a sports car, more of a GT. Motorway crusing is great and fast A roads is wheres its most at home, they can get a little skittish on the rear when pushing hard though, esp if the roads are damp and the corners are tight.
Not alot of differance between the 3.0 and the 3.2s really, I would personaly lean toward the 3.0 as the engine seems a little more willing to rev, adds to the driving exp.
I've never had any mechanical issues with any of my cars, but then again I never tend to keep cars for a long time! Good buy IMHO, I would have another all day long!
Decent power, good comfort, good build quality. The E36 shape is now looking a little dated but this is compensated for with the falling prices, Ive seen 3.0s selling for around the £4.5k> mark.
Best not to think of the M3 as a sports car, more of a GT. Motorway crusing is great and fast A roads is wheres its most at home, they can get a little skittish on the rear when pushing hard though, esp if the roads are damp and the corners are tight.
Not alot of differance between the 3.0 and the 3.2s really, I would personaly lean toward the 3.0 as the engine seems a little more willing to rev, adds to the driving exp.
I've never had any mechanical issues with any of my cars, but then again I never tend to keep cars for a long time! Good buy IMHO, I would have another all day long!
11 November 2006, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by type.r
astrabioy have you dont a conversion to that bmw of yours? im not good with bms but im sure isnt an M3 is it?
mate a new engine would have cost £1800 probably easier to have changed it? (i considered putting one in my 325 coupe, but didnt wanna muck abiout too much so sticking with another 2.5 engine )
mate a new engine would have cost £1800 probably easier to have changed it? (i considered putting one in my 325 coupe, but didnt wanna muck abiout too much so sticking with another 2.5 engine
) Its running an 3L non evo lump, mated to a 325 greabox and running gear.
I had a lot of options when putting in a new engine, but even with the best "guarantee" in the world, there is always the chance of the engine being another bad one.
becuase of that I decided to bite the bullet and get the engine in there rebuilt, more expensive yes, but at least I would know 100% for definite that the engine is bulletproof.
astrabo
11 November 2006, 08:15 PM
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I had a 96 Evo -nice car after i had eibachs super sprint all round and bilstein absorbers.
Upside:
nice handling thereafter - great sounding engine full on- and after 12500 miles of motoring averaged 28.1 mpg ( ok a fairamount of motorway miles)
servicing costs are quite resonable if you can find a non Franchised service.
plrenty about ex bmw trained gone solo.quality build
downside- looks like any other e36 series, plus everyother road user hates bmw drivers, i found plenty of t*ssers( lorry drivers swerving to avoid me overtaking) with a chip on their shoulder against the M3.plus an abstract feel on the road -too remote steering response.
diabolical handling in the snow -spun on the M180 doing 15 mph!!!!!!!
the sti i have now- gets more respect, sounds better handles better all year `round -
Upside:
nice handling thereafter - great sounding engine full on- and after 12500 miles of motoring averaged 28.1 mpg ( ok a fairamount of motorway miles)
servicing costs are quite resonable if you can find a non Franchised service.
plrenty about ex bmw trained gone solo.quality build
downside- looks like any other e36 series, plus everyother road user hates bmw drivers, i found plenty of t*ssers( lorry drivers swerving to avoid me overtaking) with a chip on their shoulder against the M3.plus an abstract feel on the road -too remote steering response.
diabolical handling in the snow -spun on the M180 doing 15 mph!!!!!!!
the sti i have now- gets more respect, sounds better handles better all year `round -
11 November 2006, 08:19 PM
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oh yeah - forgot to add- extra power is quite limited- apart from supercharging ( cost the earth ) - just panel filters and exhaust.
a remap adds about 15 bhp. better with a scoob
a remap adds about 15 bhp. better with a scoob
11 November 2006, 08:22 PM
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it'me again.
the car i had prior to the M3 was a chipped SX200 - this was a better drivers car until i wrapped it around a lamp post on stocksbridge bypass.
the car i had prior to the M3 was a chipped SX200 - this was a better drivers car until i wrapped it around a lamp post on stocksbridge bypass.
12 November 2006, 12:01 AM
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I bought a BMW M3 Evo 7 weeks ago yesterday. It is on an R Plate, techno violet and has done just over 75,000 miles. It is quickest car i have driven, however i havent driven a Scooby or Evo before i get slagged off. It is a lovely car, i really cannot fault it so far. I havent pushed it too hard as i beleive they lose the back end pretty easy and as my missus wrote our other car off 3 weeks back i dont really want the same happening to this 1!
Amazing cars in my opinion
Amazing cars in my opinion
12 November 2006, 07:53 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by J4CKO
As usual I have my 'Car of the week', i.e. the car that I would buy should I have the money to do so, still going to be next summer bewfore I do anything but I like to do my reasearch upfront !
I am torn between a diesel and something daft, this weeks diesel is a Volvo S60 and daft for the next few days is the old shape M3 (about R reg 98) which can be bought for 8 grand or therabouts.
Is that a road to bankruptcy and insanity or a reasonably priced way into a 300 + bhp car ?
I know they have Vanos issues but is there much else that breaks, I know Astraboy has had issues, with his M3 that is.
Probably best asking on a BMW forum but I thought I would start here.
I am torn between a diesel and something daft, this weeks diesel is a Volvo S60 and daft for the next few days is the old shape M3 (about R reg 98) which can be bought for 8 grand or therabouts.
Is that a road to bankruptcy and insanity or a reasonably priced way into a 300 + bhp car ?
I know they have Vanos issues but is there much else that breaks, I know Astraboy has had issues, with his M3 that is.
Probably best asking on a BMW forum but I thought I would start here.
14 November 2006, 10:15 AM
#24
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[quote=silent running]
They are quick, but in the end I just found the E36 really claustrophobic inside, everything was too tight. And I had driven Clios for some time.
quote]
I have to disagree with this comment, i have just bought a 328i sport coupe having sold my MY00 uk turbo. Having driven it down to the mrs house (about 60 miles each way mainly motorway) every weekend, it is a very comfortable drive and space inside is not an issue at all (unless you're a walrus i'm guessing
)
As much as i loved my scoob, the bm is by far a better cruiser and not a slug as you would expect. Granted around town and b-road blasts the scoob was much, much, more fun.
I deal with a lot of BMW independants day-to-day and they all tell me that the vanos is a serious worry on the M3 EVO's. Also the 3.0 M3 is not a great deal quicker than the 328 (so i'm told) and the parts are much more money just because they have an ///M badge.
They are quick, but in the end I just found the E36 really claustrophobic inside, everything was too tight. And I had driven Clios for some time.
quote]
I have to disagree with this comment, i have just bought a 328i sport coupe having sold my MY00 uk turbo. Having driven it down to the mrs house (about 60 miles each way mainly motorway) every weekend, it is a very comfortable drive and space inside is not an issue at all (unless you're a walrus i'm guessing
)As much as i loved my scoob, the bm is by far a better cruiser and not a slug as you would expect. Granted around town and b-road blasts the scoob was much, much, more fun.
I deal with a lot of BMW independants day-to-day and they all tell me that the vanos is a serious worry on the M3 EVO's. Also the 3.0 M3 is not a great deal quicker than the 328 (so i'm told) and the parts are much more money just because they have an ///M badge.
14 November 2006, 03:15 PM
#26
As Stated above the 328I is actually a very nice car and an altogether better proposition IMHO, put some wheels on one, and buy a sport version. And you have a very nice, reliable and quick car, that won't cost the earth to insure, run or maintain. Yet still be quick.
Don't be fooled by paper BHP. 328I = 200bhp, M3 = 300bhp. But in real world driving the 328I is still quick and actually feels quicker or as quick when driving hard but not red -lined. The M3 only comes into its own right at the top.
Don't be fooled by paper BHP. 328I = 200bhp, M3 = 300bhp. But in real world driving the 328I is still quick and actually feels quicker or as quick when driving hard but not red -lined. The M3 only comes into its own right at the top.
14 November 2006, 08:21 PM
#27
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Originally Posted by RobEvo5
As Stated above the 328I is actually a very nice car and an altogether better proposition IMHO, put some wheels on one, and buy a sport version. And you have a very nice, reliable and quick car, that won't cost the earth to insure, run or maintain. Yet still be quick.
Don't be fooled by paper BHP. 328I = 200bhp, M3 = 300bhp. But in real world driving the 328I is still quick and actually feels quicker or as quick when driving hard but not red -lined. The M3 only comes into its own right at the top.
Don't be fooled by paper BHP. 328I = 200bhp, M3 = 300bhp. But in real world driving the 328I is still quick and actually feels quicker or as quick when driving hard but not red -lined. The M3 only comes into its own right at the top.
27 August 2007, 10:05 AM
#28
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Ohh I also dont think a GT2 vers is worth a grand premium over a non GT2 vers for some bits of trim!
D
31 August 2007, 11:53 AM
#29
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this sounds right, my friend's totally standard E36 M3 3.0 was RR'd about 3 times, the lowest figure it ever made was 301bhp... which is pretty damn good, but like people have said, they dont feel as quick as they are, but I like the linear power delivery, never been a fan of peaky or boosted laggy engines.
31 August 2007, 02:37 PM
#30
I'd take the E34 M5 over the E36 M3 anyday... a lot cheaper too!
If you can stretch the extra £4k take the E39.....
I know it's a different car and slightly off topic but I just think they are much much better cars!
If you can stretch the extra £4k take the E39.....
I know it's a different car and slightly off topic but I just think they are much much better cars!