Integra DC2 Type R test drive thoughts
15 August 2004, 06:25 PM
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Integra DC2 Type R test drive thoughts
As some of you may have seen, I am currently deciding on a car to replace the scoob.
I won't go into the requirements here, but ideally it needs to be a turbo diesel. However,for 7-8k for a 2nd hand golf tdi, my attentions cannot help but be swayed by a integra type r (with the plan of driving sensibly most of the time to get 35mpg) but then having something to have fun with at the occasional track day / b roads.
Finally tested one this afternoon, one middle aged male family-man owner from new, FHSH, always garaged etc.
The car is utterly mint. Even having done 60,000 mi. in it, the guy obviously hasn't ever really driven it, even with me driving at 6 tenths and being super careful he was crapping himself and when I pushed up to about 7/8 tenths for the very last bit of the test he actually begged me to slow down.
Put it this way, it's just had its first set of new brake pads, and even still has a small amount of warranty outstanding.
The only complaint is the usual seat bolsters problem. Anyone know what it will cost to get this rectified? needs full right side bolsters and retrim.
Some thoughts:
Looks: the front end in my opinion is one of the best looking cars ever, but I still can't convince myself about the rear end. Coming from the Subaru I was kind of looking forward to a bit of anonymity, but it was plain to see from people's reaction to me that that wouldn't be the case with this car. Couldn't decide from people's faces if it was a good image or a bad one.
Engine: I have to say it is much slower than I thought it would be, and under the vtec zone I honestly thought there was something wrong with the engine, it was like driving a 1.2 fiesta. But ohh, that noise. Utterly beautiful. However, coming from the Subaru again, I think I would have to do something about the power even if only a full exhaust system and intake, and I was kind of hoping the standard car would be enough as I am sick of modding.
Brakes: top-notch. Very impressive.
Steering: much heavier than I expected, and coming from the 2.2 quick rack in my current car, I was slightly surprised at how slow the steering was. That said, the feedback was quite fantastic, particularly when the diff was working hard.
Handling: you could really feel the weight difference compared with the Subaru heading into medium fast bends. Amazing grip levels, and the little play I had with lift off oversteer towards the end of the test seemed like there was a lot to play with when you get used to the car.
Motorway: this is really the crunch for me. I do Bristol to London and back every week and I generally don't ever travel at less than 100mph on the motorway (usually 100-110) but I just don't feel I could do that in this car. It was bearable at 80 mph, but at 100mph it started to get quite wearing even in the short time I was driving it, and unlike the Subaru (which itself isn't exactly great accelerating in 5th on motorway) you can't just put your foot down to overtake, you need to come down a cog and rev it to 8 or 9k.
Overall: I think it's very hard to judge these cars on a short test run, and I think I would be taking a stab in the dark buying this car. I can see that you really have to wring its neck to get the best of it, which obviously you cannot do with somebody else's car on a test.
However, this particular car is so mint and unabused, and at such a good price, I am seriously tempted to take the plunge because if I don't like it in 3 months, I can pretty much guarantee I could sell it on for a profit.
I think the deciding factor will be how cheap I can get the insurance down to tomorrow, and how much it costs to get the seats sorted out.
I won't go into the requirements here, but ideally it needs to be a turbo diesel. However,for 7-8k for a 2nd hand golf tdi, my attentions cannot help but be swayed by a integra type r (with the plan of driving sensibly most of the time to get 35mpg) but then having something to have fun with at the occasional track day / b roads.
Finally tested one this afternoon, one middle aged male family-man owner from new, FHSH, always garaged etc.
The car is utterly mint. Even having done 60,000 mi. in it, the guy obviously hasn't ever really driven it, even with me driving at 6 tenths and being super careful he was crapping himself and when I pushed up to about 7/8 tenths for the very last bit of the test he actually begged me to slow down.
Put it this way, it's just had its first set of new brake pads, and even still has a small amount of warranty outstanding.
The only complaint is the usual seat bolsters problem. Anyone know what it will cost to get this rectified? needs full right side bolsters and retrim.
Some thoughts:
Looks: the front end in my opinion is one of the best looking cars ever, but I still can't convince myself about the rear end. Coming from the Subaru I was kind of looking forward to a bit of anonymity, but it was plain to see from people's reaction to me that that wouldn't be the case with this car. Couldn't decide from people's faces if it was a good image or a bad one.
Engine: I have to say it is much slower than I thought it would be, and under the vtec zone I honestly thought there was something wrong with the engine, it was like driving a 1.2 fiesta. But ohh, that noise. Utterly beautiful. However, coming from the Subaru again, I think I would have to do something about the power even if only a full exhaust system and intake, and I was kind of hoping the standard car would be enough as I am sick of modding.
Brakes: top-notch. Very impressive.
Steering: much heavier than I expected, and coming from the 2.2 quick rack in my current car, I was slightly surprised at how slow the steering was. That said, the feedback was quite fantastic, particularly when the diff was working hard.
Handling: you could really feel the weight difference compared with the Subaru heading into medium fast bends. Amazing grip levels, and the little play I had with lift off oversteer towards the end of the test seemed like there was a lot to play with when you get used to the car.
Motorway: this is really the crunch for me. I do Bristol to London and back every week and I generally don't ever travel at less than 100mph on the motorway (usually 100-110) but I just don't feel I could do that in this car. It was bearable at 80 mph, but at 100mph it started to get quite wearing even in the short time I was driving it, and unlike the Subaru (which itself isn't exactly great accelerating in 5th on motorway) you can't just put your foot down to overtake, you need to come down a cog and rev it to 8 or 9k.
Overall: I think it's very hard to judge these cars on a short test run, and I think I would be taking a stab in the dark buying this car. I can see that you really have to wring its neck to get the best of it, which obviously you cannot do with somebody else's car on a test.
However, this particular car is so mint and unabused, and at such a good price, I am seriously tempted to take the plunge because if I don't like it in 3 months, I can pretty much guarantee I could sell it on for a profit.
I think the deciding factor will be how cheap I can get the insurance down to tomorrow, and how much it costs to get the seats sorted out.
15 August 2004, 06:36 PM
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Sounds like it could be very interesting, I'm planning on getting one of these when i get rid of the scoob so if you do have it and look at moving it on next year...... 
15 August 2004, 06:48 PM
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I told you not to test one didn't I?
You can't have an Integra and a Scooby before me, it's not fair, and I'll spit out my dummy and have a hissy fit!
Although, if you look after it, I might take it off your hands when you've finished with it
You can't have an Integra and a Scooby before me, it's not fair, and I'll spit out my dummy and have a hissy fit!
Although, if you look after it, I might take it off your hands when you've finished with it
15 August 2004, 08:04 PM
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Ed, I agree with all you said apart from the power.
Pop down and ill take you out in mine. I thought it was a bit slow until I really started to get used to it. Trouble is, you can't drive it hard when the owner is in the other seat and therefore it will seem slow (as you said). If I hold mine at 6 k and boot it to 8.5, it seriously flies
Ive been in a mildy modded 210 bhp one and I was bricking it
Straight line can be a bit frustrating, but as Ed says you cant compare anything to a forced induction engine...
MB
ps. The looks you get are because its quite a rare car - I got much more in the scoob though
Pop down and ill take you out in mine. I thought it was a bit slow until I really started to get used to it. Trouble is, you can't drive it hard when the owner is in the other seat and therefore it will seem slow (as you said). If I hold mine at 6 k and boot it to 8.5, it seriously flies
Ive been in a mildy modded 210 bhp one and I was bricking it
Straight line can be a bit frustrating, but as Ed says you cant compare anything to a forced induction engine...
MB
ps. The looks you get are because its quite a rare car - I got much more in the scoob though
15 August 2004, 08:07 PM
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Soemone was selling some Recaro bolsters on DC2 a while back - think you can get hold of them ok.
Insurance is the same as a UK scoob from my research. Honda's are never cheap. Try www.confused.com The best insurance site ive seen.
One more point, drive one with the lid off the air box
MB
Insurance is the same as a UK scoob from my research. Honda's are never cheap. Try www.confused.com The best insurance site ive seen.
One more point, drive one with the lid off the air box
MB
15 August 2004, 08:10 PM
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LOL @ nick
I thought about it earlier, and I thought a) I'm coming on for 30, I'm not likely to ever get the chance to own one of these again, esp if the business keeps going so well, and b) I could have a heart attack or get run over tomorrow, do I really want a golf diesel???
Mark, yes, I'm sure you are right about the power. What kind of money am I looking at
a) for a second set of wheels (to shod with semi slicks )
b) for a decent exhaust and intake setup
c) to get the seat bolsters sorted and retrimmed
d) to go for the final year manufacturer warranty option?
I thought about it earlier, and I thought a) I'm coming on for 30, I'm not likely to ever get the chance to own one of these again, esp if the business keeps going so well, and b) I could have a heart attack or get run over tomorrow, do I really want a golf diesel???
Mark, yes, I'm sure you are right about the power. What kind of money am I looking at
a) for a second set of wheels (to shod with semi slicks
)b) for a decent exhaust and intake setup
c) to get the seat bolsters sorted and retrimmed
d) to go for the final year manufacturer warranty option?
15 August 2004, 08:18 PM
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The only exhaust mods that weild any good gains are the manifold and decat pipe.
They will fatten out the curve below the VTEC point and give some better response . top end gain. I got a 4-1 manifold for under £200 from the states, DC Sports one. They're over £350 here. Supersprint are good too, and will do a decat for £80.
ITG Maxogen air box is pricey at £300 but has been proven to give 7 bhp.
A setup unichip is £550 and will change the VTEC point if you require it. 5k rpm seems favourable. This will see you around 205 / 210 bhp and make it bloody lively.
I have a spare set of white track wheels if you want them
Not sure on bolster price.
MB
They will fatten out the curve below the VTEC point and give some better response . top end gain. I got a 4-1 manifold for under £200 from the states, DC Sports one. They're over £350 here. Supersprint are good too, and will do a decat for £80.
ITG Maxogen air box is pricey at £300 but has been proven to give 7 bhp.
A setup unichip is £550 and will change the VTEC point if you require it. 5k rpm seems favourable. This will see you around 205 / 210 bhp and make it bloody lively.
I have a spare set of white track wheels if you want them
Not sure on bolster price.
MB
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15 August 2004, 08:30 PM
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Is it safe to do the decat and airbox without the unichip, or have I been modding scoobies for too long! 
15 August 2004, 09:05 PM
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I do Bristol to London and back every week and I generally don't ever travel at less than 100mph on the motorway (usually 100-110) but I just don't feel I could do that in this car. It was bearable at 80 mph
15 August 2004, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Dracoro
So think of it as a licence saver
Problem is I'm so used to travelling at that kind of speed that anything less feels so slow!
And before any of the PC brigade jump on me, I honestly feel I am safer at that speed than 70 simply because I am so aware of everything around me in my hunt for mr traffic cop
I always leave space, never tailgate, never intimidate people, am very courtious etc. Its all about using common sense. It amazes me anyone ever gets caught speeding unless you are very unlucky, half asleep or being very silly indeed.
15 August 2004, 10:57 PM
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edcase
like mark says you definately feel the power between 6k to 8.5k. In terms of mods on mine I have a spoon lagged manifold with a decatted hks system, running spoon cams and it seriously flies. The suspension has been tweaked with tein HA suspension. I always wanted to see what these cars are all about and after owning mine for 6 months and having great fun I would recomend it the handling is superb, and once you get used to the vtec its great fun.
like mark says you definately feel the power between 6k to 8.5k. In terms of mods on mine I have a spoon lagged manifold with a decatted hks system, running spoon cams and it seriously flies. The suspension has been tweaked with tein HA suspension. I always wanted to see what these cars are all about and after owning mine for 6 months and having great fun I would recomend it the handling is superb, and once you get used to the vtec its great fun.
16 August 2004, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Edcase
Ouch, £850 for insurance
thats more than the scoob. 7 years NCB, 28yrs old.
thats more than the scoob. 7 years NCB, 28yrs old.
Your scoob would probably of been more if they knew it had go-faster strips and the like (so to speak). I got quoted 1250 on ITR (No NCB).
Agree with Noz, I see mod's ahead
it will be turbo'd and running on jet fuel by the end of the year (still shaking head) When I tested one, I got to blat it quite hard, I thought it was very quick, but it is tricky to drive, it takes some getting used, even the salesman said all his customers came back afer a month loving it. It's bl00dy hard work trying to keep it in the hot spot all the time, especially in traffic, it's jackel and hyde. But when you get a chance to keep the revs up, it really shifts, and the high revs make it seem even faster because of the noise and speed of the revs - it's quite frantic.
I thought the cornering was amazing I tried turning in on and off power and it didn't understeer, when I lifted off on a round about I got a little sneaky view of the spoiler, much to the discomfort of the said greasy salesman!
If I had had 13k on my bank I would of been signing cheques...
Last edited by mynickers; 16 August 2004 at 09:24 AM.
16 August 2004, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Edcase
Ouch, £850 for insurance
thats more than the scoob. 7 years NCB, 28yrs old.
thats more than the scoob. 7 years NCB, 28yrs old.
It is group 19 and that is your problem - why it is group 19 is beyond me.
16 August 2004, 09:49 AM
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Nicker, I though when you criticised me for saying it wasn't that hot in a straight line in a recent post, you actually owned one?
You getting one?!
MB
You getting one?!
MB
16 August 2004, 10:03 AM
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http://www.carreview.com/Forced,Indu...2_2877crx.aspx
mmmmm..
I've talked about this with my (very sensible) missus, and decided that I could buy this car, option the final year warranty, get the seats retimmed, have some fun for 3-6 months and then make a tidy profit.
Anyone have any reccommendations for other insurers? The £850 came from confused.co.uk and included protected NCD. Does it make a big difference if they are unprotected to the price???
I promise you I (almost certainaly) wont be modding this car!!!
Probably.
mmmmm..
I've talked about this with my (very sensible) missus, and decided that I could buy this car, option the final year warranty, get the seats retimmed, have some fun for 3-6 months and then make a tidy profit.
Anyone have any reccommendations for other insurers? The £850 came from confused.co.uk and included protected NCD. Does it make a big difference if they are unprotected to the price???
I promise you I (almost certainaly) wont be modding this car!!!
Probably.
16 August 2004, 10:09 AM
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BELL DIRECT £854.70
CHURCHILL £1093.05
MASTERQUOTE/Sabre £1109.39
QUOTE-A-CAR £1131.85
PEOPLES CHOICE £1138.82
QUOTE-A-CAR £1177.54
INSURE IT ALL £1189.45
INSURE IT ALL £1189.45
QUOTE-A-CAR £1244.26
PEOPLES CHOICE £1250.33
AUTO DIRECT/Sabre £1257.40
AUTO DIRECT/Zenith £1262.93
ITS 4 ME/Zenith Insurance plc £1319.03
SWINTON/Zenith Insurance plc £1319.03
MASTERQUOTE/Zenith £1323.20
DIRECT CHOICE/Zenith £1392.92
PEOPLES CHOICE £1471.14
ENDSLEIGH £1675.51
INSURE IT ALL £1730.27
AUTO DIRECT/NIG Sovereign £2017.36
DIRECT CHOICE/Broker £2019.28
MASTERQUOTE/Norwich Union £2033.74
DIRECT CHOICE/Direct £2075.76
LOL, £2k for a 1800cc Honda, 28 yrs old with 7yrs NCD no accidents claims or convictions
Lots of big names missing there, anywhere else I should try? What about specialists like adrian flux etc?
CHURCHILL £1093.05
MASTERQUOTE/Sabre £1109.39
QUOTE-A-CAR £1131.85
PEOPLES CHOICE £1138.82
QUOTE-A-CAR £1177.54
INSURE IT ALL £1189.45
INSURE IT ALL £1189.45
QUOTE-A-CAR £1244.26
PEOPLES CHOICE £1250.33
AUTO DIRECT/Sabre £1257.40
AUTO DIRECT/Zenith £1262.93
ITS 4 ME/Zenith Insurance plc £1319.03
SWINTON/Zenith Insurance plc £1319.03
MASTERQUOTE/Zenith £1323.20
DIRECT CHOICE/Zenith £1392.92
PEOPLES CHOICE £1471.14
ENDSLEIGH £1675.51
INSURE IT ALL £1730.27
AUTO DIRECT/NIG Sovereign £2017.36
DIRECT CHOICE/Broker £2019.28
MASTERQUOTE/Norwich Union £2033.74
DIRECT CHOICE/Direct £2075.76
LOL, £2k for a 1800cc Honda, 28 yrs old with 7yrs NCD no accidents claims or convictions
Lots of big names missing there, anywhere else I should try? What about specialists like adrian flux etc?
16 August 2004, 11:43 AM
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i drive a different car but... for my my04 civic type-r at elephant.co.uk i pay £590. thats fully comp with ncb protection. im 28yrs, 6 yrs ncb, parked on a driveway. they were significantly cheaper than anyone else.
16 August 2004, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Dark Blue Mark
I might swap my ITR for a MY99/00 if anyone wants to...
MB
MB
16 August 2004, 06:28 PM
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Hold the front page.....
Just bought a 01 VW passat 130bhp tdi, driving lights, cd changer etc.
FVWSH, one owner from new, its like a new car. Not a scratch, a stonechip, a kerb mark, brand new brakes and tyres, gunmetal grey metallic.
Utterly amazing. Pulls in 6th gear, ASR seems to pull it around wet roundabouts in 2nd at silly speeds, rain sensitive wipers, amazingly nice steering.
£8500 with 2 years warranty, and 3 years invoice-cost insurance protection (gives me the difference between old and new if it gets nicked or written off).
Bargain of the year IMHO.
Just bought a 01 VW passat 130bhp tdi, driving lights, cd changer etc.
FVWSH, one owner from new, its like a new car. Not a scratch, a stonechip, a kerb mark, brand new brakes and tyres, gunmetal grey metallic.
Utterly amazing. Pulls in 6th gear, ASR seems to pull it around wet roundabouts in 2nd at silly speeds, rain sensitive wipers, amazingly nice steering.
£8500 with 2 years warranty, and 3 years invoice-cost insurance protection (gives me the difference between old and new if it gets nicked or written off).
Bargain of the year IMHO.
16 August 2004, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Edcase
Hold the front page.....
Just bought a 01 VW passat 130bhp tdi, driving lights, cd changer etc.
FVWSH, one owner from new, its like a new car. Not a scratch, a stonechip, a kerb mark, brand new brakes and tyres, gunmetal grey metallic.
Utterly amazing. Pulls in 6th gear, ASR seems to pull it around wet roundabouts in 2nd at silly speeds, rain sensitive wipers, amazingly nice steering.
£8500 with 2 years warranty, and 3 years invoice-cost insurance protection (gives me the difference between old and new if it gets nicked or written off).
Bargain of the year IMHO.
Just bought a 01 VW passat 130bhp tdi, driving lights, cd changer etc.
FVWSH, one owner from new, its like a new car. Not a scratch, a stonechip, a kerb mark, brand new brakes and tyres, gunmetal grey metallic.
Utterly amazing. Pulls in 6th gear, ASR seems to pull it around wet roundabouts in 2nd at silly speeds, rain sensitive wipers, amazingly nice steering.
£8500 with 2 years warranty, and 3 years invoice-cost insurance protection (gives me the difference between old and new if it gets nicked or written off).
Bargain of the year IMHO.
sounds like a very good deal. Send some piccies. Don't be putting your suit jacket in the rear seat hanger though DBM: I critised you? Argh, ignore me, I just like a good debate / argument - nothing would be personal!
Not an owner unfortunatley, just wanted one for a long time now, been a big fan, read everything ever written, spoken to countless people, so know a bit about them. But nothing can compare with owning one - so do feel free to ignore me! As with Ed insurance is pretty high - £1250 odd which is a lorra lorra money, been thinking about Westies or something equally impratical and FAST. V. Cheap to insure, and faster than most things... Teg's are wicked though - I love them...
16 August 2004, 08:57 PM
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Don't pick it up til friday, they are taxing it, valeting it, sorting the single scratch on the entire car on the rear quarter etc.
Looks surprisingly sexy in metallic gunmetal with the alloy wheels and the chrome trim etc.
Looks surprisingly sexy in metallic gunmetal with the alloy wheels and the chrome trim etc.
16 August 2004, 09:50 PM
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Sounds like a good deal mate - well done, pop by next time you're passing through my way...edit Bet the 'sensible misses' is happy! No more holding onto the dash board around round-a-bouts.
No more holding onto the dash board around round-a-bouts.
16 August 2004, 11:19 PM
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Nickers, no offence meant, I just wondered if you owned one. Think you put "because you dont know how to drive it"
No probs, ps, you can buy mine soon
Ed, I think you made the right choice for what you need, motorways etc. And you can still chip it.
MB
No probs, ps, you can buy mine soon
Ed, I think you made the right choice for what you need, motorways etc. And you can still chip it.
MB
16 August 2004, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Dark Blue Mark
Nickers, no offence meant, I just wondered if you owned one. Think you put "because you dont know how to drive it"
No probs, ps, you can buy mine soon
Ed, I think you made the right choice for what you need, motorways etc. And you can still chip it.
MB
No probs, ps, you can buy mine soon
Ed, I think you made the right choice for what you need, motorways etc. And you can still chip it.
MB
Woudn't mind a Teg, but like I said, I want RWD open top madness, and stupidly cheap insurnace.. I am just not prepared to pay over £1k on insurance - it's robbery!