330d, auto or manual?
12 July 2003, 06:01 PM
#2
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I havent driven one, but a friend has a 530d auto. His thoughts were similar when I had my much older 525tds auto.
While the box is OK, it just doesnt let you use the torque of the engine to drive gently. Every time you touch the accelerator, it kicks down, so the engine is always revving.
It can be annoying.
Certainly on my car, they claimed max torwue at 2000rpm. The car never used it, as it was always up around 3000rpm + unless you were very gentle with the throttle, and then there was no power at all.
While the box is OK, it just doesnt let you use the torque of the engine to drive gently. Every time you touch the accelerator, it kicks down, so the engine is always revving.
It can be annoying.
Certainly on my car, they claimed max torwue at 2000rpm. The car never used it, as it was always up around 3000rpm + unless you were very gentle with the throttle, and then there was no power at all.
12 July 2003, 10:12 PM
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magazine tests have always rated the manual box over the auto on this car.
for reasons like stevie mentions, they say that its something to do with the shift point on the auto, it makes happens outside of the greatest torque range or something.....anyway...manual
p.s. my mate has a new shape 530d too, its an auto with tiptronic etc, is brilliant car, but would have manual anyday myself, he's not bothered as he only tootles it. however, when driven hard with a cruise too, it still returns 40mpg average
ian
for reasons like stevie mentions, they say that its something to do with the shift point on the auto, it makes happens outside of the greatest torque range or something.....anyway...manual
p.s. my mate has a new shape 530d too, its an auto with tiptronic etc, is brilliant car, but would have manual anyday myself, he's not bothered as he only tootles it. however, when driven hard with a cruise too, it still returns 40mpg average
ian
13 July 2003, 11:31 AM
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I think BMW just go overboard, trying to make it feel like a petrol or something. If the auto box was like some other cars I have driven, then Im sure it would be excellent. Mercedes are supposed to be superb autos.
Even an old Ford Granada auto is better IMO than the BMW, for shifting patterns anyway. I even have a scrapper Volvo 940 auto td, and its shifting patterns are better then the BMW I had before it.
Im sure there are people out there who can reprogram the auto box, but otherwise, go for a manual.
Even an old Ford Granada auto is better IMO than the BMW, for shifting patterns anyway. I even have a scrapper Volvo 940 auto td, and its shifting patterns are better then the BMW I had before it.
Im sure there are people out there who can reprogram the auto box, but otherwise, go for a manual.
13 July 2003, 06:52 PM
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I have to defend the 330d Auto, as I have just got one and it does not respond as described above.
I have gone from Scoobies to B4 RSK and wanted somthing more economical and eaiser to drive in London.
The box works very well, if left alone it will use the torque, not just drop a gear and rev. If you really want to ensure this just knock it into Steptronic and it will hold the gear and not shift down - You can get into top from about 30mph - now if thats not using the torque curve I do not know what is !
On the other hand if you want to hold the revs/drop gears etc just knock into sports mode (if a diesel can every be a true "sports car)
I did not try a manual - just drove the auto and did the deal !
Jon
Edited to add I did read some where there are better residuals on Auto diesel as 70% are Auto's - its what everyone wants
[Edited by Jonathan Witts - 7/13/2003 6:55:15 PM]
I have gone from Scoobies to B4 RSK and wanted somthing more economical and eaiser to drive in London.
The box works very well, if left alone it will use the torque, not just drop a gear and rev. If you really want to ensure this just knock it into Steptronic and it will hold the gear and not shift down - You can get into top from about 30mph - now if thats not using the torque curve I do not know what is !
On the other hand if you want to hold the revs/drop gears etc just knock into sports mode (if a diesel can every be a true "sports car)
I did not try a manual - just drove the auto and did the deal !
Jon
Edited to add I did read some where there are better residuals on Auto diesel as 70% are Auto's - its what everyone wants
[Edited by Jonathan Witts - 7/13/2003 6:55:15 PM]
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17 July 2003, 12:29 PM
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Steptronic auto box is excellent had one in a 328 and i have had a 530d auto loaner.
Good manual override function (knock lever to the side and just move back and forth) not much delay great in changes (quicker than many people can change in a manual
)I used it to drop down for overtaking with out using kickdown or to hold gear for greater control on windy roads. It also has a good sport mode which works well to holding lower gears on a bends gives gear box braking and holds them for acceleration, again very nice on winding roads when you want to go quick without hassle.
Great kickdown, light pressure at say 50 car will change down once harder pressure foot to the floor, goes right down to 2nd till red line then silky change ups. Very smmoth changes from these boxes.
The steptronic also has a higher top gear than the 5sp manuals giving more relaxed cruising I would get 32mpg+ from the 328auto at 90, its replacement a 330 petrol manual would only give 27.5 mpg :0 .
The extra torque of the 3 litre diesel makes the auto almost as fast as the manual in the book and the 530 d auto I drove was really quick in real world driving with very little effort (fuel gauge hardly moved as well
)
I've got a merc with the speedtronic box now and a porsche with tiptronic and neither have the very useful sport function, the merc is as smooth as the BMW box but doesn't change down in slower corners making you have to change manually on a winding road or kickdown between corners to maintain pace (makes it less smooth), the porsche is not quite as smooth on the changes and on a winding road is a wee bit better then the merc but not as good as the bmw was and in the porsche you are better changing manually on anything winding.
I would get the auto 330d, almost as much control as the manual when you need it with the override and sport function (very little delay in changes in the manual mode) and all the auto benefits and probably better economy on long trips.
as said above people do like to see auto boxes in the larger engined bms for resale.
Both are great cars though you can't lose
[Edited by Mmmmm - 7/17/2003 12:30:58 PM]
Good manual override function (knock lever to the side and just move back and forth) not much delay great in changes (quicker than many people can change in a manual
)I used it to drop down for overtaking with out using kickdown or to hold gear for greater control on windy roads. It also has a good sport mode which works well to holding lower gears on a bends gives gear box braking and holds them for acceleration, again very nice on winding roads when you want to go quick without hassle.Great kickdown, light pressure at say 50 car will change down once harder pressure foot to the floor, goes right down to 2nd till red line then silky change ups. Very smmoth changes from these boxes.
The steptronic also has a higher top gear than the 5sp manuals giving more relaxed cruising I would get 32mpg+ from the 328auto at 90, its replacement a 330 petrol manual would only give 27.5 mpg :0 .
The extra torque of the 3 litre diesel makes the auto almost as fast as the manual in the book and the 530 d auto I drove was really quick in real world driving with very little effort (fuel gauge hardly moved as well
)I've got a merc with the speedtronic box now and a porsche with tiptronic and neither have the very useful sport function, the merc is as smooth as the BMW box but doesn't change down in slower corners making you have to change manually on a winding road or kickdown between corners to maintain pace (makes it less smooth), the porsche is not quite as smooth on the changes and on a winding road is a wee bit better then the merc but not as good as the bmw was and in the porsche you are better changing manually on anything winding.
I would get the auto 330d, almost as much control as the manual when you need it with the override and sport function (very little delay in changes in the manual mode) and all the auto benefits and probably better economy on long trips.
as said above people do like to see auto boxes in the larger engined bms for resale.
Both are great cars though you can't lose
[Edited by Mmmmm - 7/17/2003 12:30:58 PM]
17 July 2003, 12:36 PM
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Not tried a manual 330D. Have always been a die-hard manual fan.
However......test drive of auto 330D changed my mind - first auto car I've everdriven that I thought worked well with the powerplant.
Pretty smooth and quick shifting, and no kickdown unless you activate it with yer clog.
As I say though - not tried a 330D manual, so may be even better.
As a kerazee idea, why not try both ?
However......test drive of auto 330D changed my mind - first auto car I've everdriven that I thought worked well with the powerplant.
Pretty smooth and quick shifting, and no kickdown unless you activate it with yer clog.
As I say though - not tried a 330D manual, so may be even better.
As a kerazee idea, why not try both ?
17 July 2003, 04:11 PM
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Autos work soooo much beter in cars with lots of torque e.g. 330D, 530d, 535 and up etc etc
Great kickdown, light pressure at say 50 car will change down once harder pressure foot to the floor, goes right down to 2nd till red line then silky change ups. Very smmoth changes from these boxes.
The box kicks down on WOT if it feels it needs it but if you want to basically force the car to kick down then you need to press it firmly to the floor so basically the driver is still pretty much in control.
As you say, after this, the car goes to the red line and then changes silky smooth all the way thru.
I wont go back to manual if I can help it TBH....
17 July 2003, 04:49 PM
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Gents,
Have had 2 330d Manuals and am awaiting delivery of a new 6-spd 204bhp 330d.
I tried the auto and whilst it is impressive, I'm still to young to be a two pedal man. You'll find that the 330d auto gives about 4mpg less than the manual in all types of driving, and if used hard will drop average fuel consumption to 30 mpg ish. My 330d manuals never dropped below 37.6mpg as an average.
It's horses for courses, but if you do lots of stop-start stuff, get the auto. If you like the occasional trackday and trip to the Ring, get the manual.
Matt
Have had 2 330d Manuals and am awaiting delivery of a new 6-spd 204bhp 330d.
I tried the auto and whilst it is impressive, I'm still to young to be a two pedal man.
You'll find that the 330d auto gives about 4mpg less than the manual in all types of driving, and if used hard will drop average fuel consumption to 30 mpg ish. My 330d manuals never dropped below 37.6mpg as an average. It's horses for courses, but if you do lots of stop-start stuff, get the auto. If you like the occasional trackday and trip to the Ring, get the manual.
Matt
17 July 2003, 05:21 PM
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On the subject of 330's mpg...
I took the 330 auto shed I've got a the moment for a 400 mile spirited motorway journey last weekend - decent speeds and managed 34.4mpg average.
Not bad for a petrol auto 3 litre I thought!
I took the 330 auto shed I've got a the moment for a 400 mile spirited motorway journey last weekend - decent speeds and managed 34.4mpg average.
Not bad for a petrol auto 3 litre I thought!
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