davy1

Vectra,regardless of model

ST 200,one of the best V6's about,nearly baught 1 B4 the CTR,no compromise IMHO.I know its a Ford,but its 1 of thier better efforts & very tunable,so Ive heard.

Not 1 but 2???

Edited for bad spelling

[Edited by davy1 - 6/1/2003 1:46:18 AM]

richmilly

I need a roomy/fast Hatch or Estate

My current 156 selespeed is brilliant but not big enough
for kids and luggage and no seats down versitility.

I have tried to buy a couple of Gsi's at auction but both made a grand over CAP trade.I know which dealer is buying them and he is asking £2000 on top!!!!!

St200 and vectra are top of my list

anyone with thoughts or experiences please comment

or any other cars I haven't even thought of.

dazc2

Hmm, not much of a help to be honest but I am not too keen on the quality of the Vectra, wiring is not the best. Inlet manifold off to change the rear 3 plugs as well.

logiclee

Driven both and I also own a Selespeed.

If you enjoy the sharp turn in and handling of the Alfa the there will be only one choice.... the ST200.

The Ford is far better to drive than the Vectra.

The Vectra has a max power bodykit.

The ST200's twin exit exhausts look and sound suberb.

Lee

richmilly

Thanks Lee

Do you agree the Selespeed is a cracker?

Mine has a Sportpack Which makes the a massive difference to the handling

F1 style Gearbox gets alot of stick in the press

but mine is smooth as a baby's ....

I challenge anyone to change a manual shift as quick!!

logiclee

Mines a Veloce so has the Sport pack stuff. Cosmos Blue with high wing spoiler.





It take's a couple of weeks to learn how to drive a Selespeed smoothly but I think they are great.

Lee

P 1 TUD

mondeo any day!, much better looking, built,etc.

CavT

From a purely personal perspective, a later model GSi Vectra is a better bet. Striking looks (not quite Max Power methinks!), more toys and better handling than the Mondeo.

ST200's smoother bodykit is appealing, GSi is slightly more chunky looking, depending on your preferences.

Value for money, well depends on your thinking. ST200 depreciates more than the GSi Vectra, but expect the GSi to take a small hit because of the new model Vectra, maybe something to consider when buying/looking for one.

0-60 on the ST200 isn't anything special, GSi is the right side of 7secs.

For the money though, both are a good bet, depreciation is savage when you consider how much they cost new.

fatherpierre

Duratec or leaky vauxhall V6? One is reveared by the motoring press, the other slagged since its release.

Not a hard choice.

logiclee

Not driven a one then?

The Vectra GSi is not in the same league as the ST200 in the handling department.

In fact I would go as far as to say a ST24 handles better than a Vectra GSi. The mods done to the GSi to make it far better than a standard Vectra but you can't hide the flawed chassis. The Vectra has far more understeer and far less turn in bite than the Mondeo.

The early Vectra's including the SRi were among the worst handling modern cars that I have driven and I get to drive a lot of cars. The Cavalier Sri handled better than the early Vectra sri and the Cav is nearly a 20 year old design.

Most of the motoring press rated the last mondeo as the best handling car in the sector. Most also rate the Vectra as the worst.

Lee

fatherpierre

And that's not even mentioning the engine!

The Zohan

Mondeo if you want a drivers car of the two, much better handling, power about the same but the mondeo wins it for me.

As far as the Vectra goes you cannot polish a turd.

Oh and my opinion is based on having driven a 2.0 SRI for 60K miles or there abouts, also a 2.6 SRI for a few 1000 miles and a GSI for a few days 100's miles, a mate of mine was a Vauhall sales manager and lent me the GSI for comparison when i was looking to buy the Scoob - The Vectra's handling is seriously suspect, even in GSI form pressing on is not good, i loved the engine, note and performance. Vectra is great for cruising up and down the motorway day in day out - what is was designed for really. Preferred the Vectras interior as well. Also my expperiences of Vectras is that they where not well screwed together and had a lot of problems, went through ft/r disks at 35K, they warped to buggery, squeaked and rattled like no other car i had ever owned, electrical problems - many and varied and dealers who treat you like sh*t. Had the manifold split and it took 6 weeks to get a replacement FFS!

The Mondeo is streets ahead in terms of handling/driveability

All IMHO of course



[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/1/2003 9:32:18 AM]

47 NAT

Definetly the Mondeo. I tried both a few years back and thought the Vectra was "soggy and missing something". Done a 105k miles in the Mondeo and apart from needing a starter motor (fiddly to fit) had no problems at all...

Nath

BOB.T

Mondingo, all day long

DanPhillips

Had an st200 for about 18 months...1 problem after another.

Ok to drive but the problems...even the big dealerships would
say "ooh we've never heard of that one before we've got no idea
how to fix it...are you sure it's doing that ???".

Then have a look at contour and mondeo bbs's...Loads of stuff
that goes wrong and in paticular the v6 engines

It was a shame I was looking for a cheap slightly powerful everyday
motor...

But now I'm back with a Scooby...


Wouldn't touch either of your choices...Sorry.

Dan

Jonto

Mondeo !

as if you even considered a vectra

richmilly

Useful comments everyone, Thanks

So most think Vectra is Pants !!!

Mondeo gets thumbs up on the whole
But finding a good one??? they are pretty rare

Octavia RS maybe?

under 10 grand at auction ?
Do they depreciate as badly as a rest of the range
If so possible bargin to be had?

dazc2

PMSL @ the Vectra slating!

I supose it is deserved really!

logiclee

Richmilly.

Octavia RS?

I test drove one before I bought the Alfa. The only reason I didn't buy it was the seats were too hard for my wife, she has a bad back and that was the main reason I sold my Scoob.

You will love the midrange grunt, maximum torque availble from only 1900rpm is a world away from the peaky vvt delivery of the 2.0 Twin Spark. Build quality is very good.
Down sides? Well the vRS steering will feel numb and slow compared to the Alfa and the car feels big were the 156 feels small and nimble.
Also remember that 200bhp+ is easy for a few hundred pounds in the vRS

My local dealer has a Y reg in for £10995 so you should pick one up private or at auction for under £10000.

On reliability the Mondeo V6 is not known to be a bad unit but Ford dealers turn small problems into nightmares, not unlike Alfa dealers really Skoda dealers are first class, I run a Skoda deisel as a second car nothing is a problem and things are dealt with quickly.

So if the Choice is now ST200 or Vectra GSi or Octavia RS I would go with the Octavia unless driving dynamics are the no1 priority then it would be the Mondeo.

Lee

CavT

I did stress a LATER model GSi folks!

Ash_O

I have a Vectra Gsi V6 2.6. And my neighbour has an ST200. I can tell you that the Gsi is a much better looking car.

As for performance. On the pick up it needs some encouraging, but once it's into it's stride, it is very fast. I was chasing a BMW 330 on the motorway, and althought I couldn't get past him, I was nailed 2 car lenghts behind him upto a silly speed.

But the ST200 is excellent. Just as fast, and handling is comparable. And yes I have been in my neighbours car. There isn't as much difference between the 2 as some of the folks say there is. They are comparing the models and not the specific GSi and ST200's in question.

I would say the quality is comparable too. It's no Merc or Audi, but it is a solid car, and you get what you are paying for. People shouldn't forget how old the design of the car is, in comparsion to more modern cars.

To answer, I would say Gsi, I think it looks alot more different from other Vectras, with the tastful kit on it. But although I think the St200 is a good looking car, It is sometime hard to define it from an St170 or a kitted out Zetec S.

All in all, good car that is capable of 150 mph plus. And it is a good handler. The Gsi is a more concentrated car. It is developed further by a company called MSD (Motor Sport Developments). They have uprated the cams. Put 310mm brakes on the front, and has a lovely Recaro interior, and a whole host of other parts that Vauxhall don't supply.

PG

Sold my Scoob wagon and went to a Mondeo Si V6 estate. Very content with it. A nice cruiser and quite quick and it is HUGE !! Was able to pick up a 3m length of kitchen worktop and slide it in the car !!
Had the chance of a Vectra CD but was not as happy with that.

Must admit, I really like the Octavia RS !

logiclee

Ash,

Its all in peoples own opinion of course. I was comparing the GSI to the ST200, I bought in the comparisons of the standard cars to show what base the engineers had to work on.

MDA did a good job with the GSi. It had a base car that had a chassis that flexed, suspension points that were flawed, geometry that promoted understeer, etc. etc.

Fords Special Vehicle Engineering department had a much easier life with the ST200, they only needed to tweak the suspension and steering, upgrade the brakes and drop in the more powerfull V6, their base car had a stiff chassis and an already balanced setup.

I still feel the ST200 is a better balanced car, more fluid than the GSi. The GSi is not far behind in outright grip and roadholding but is harsher than the ST200 which achieves the same results but with a better handling and a better balanced feel. Turn in bite is also better on the ST200 IMO.

One thing no one has mentioned is image, I don't class myself as a badge snob, my second car is a Skoda diesel. . I used to rally a Vauxhall in the late 80's and early 90's but the Vectra has a very poor image among the public and even worse among enthusiasts. When I was thinking of getting the RS Octavia only a few uneducated people made comments about getting it. When I had my V6 Mondeo only the Scooby crowd took the mick. A couple of weeks ago I drove the new 3.2V6 Vectra in Elite trim I thought it was a good car for what it was, the comments I got from all people were unbelievable, along the lines of "Your not thinking of getting a Vectra are you, " etc. and thats from my workmates who are not car mad. Thinking about it I would have trouble telling people that I owned anysort of Vauxhaull Vectra. Sorry!

PG,

The Octavia RS is now available as an Estate. Your next car perhaps?

Lee

richmilly

Have to agree very worried about Vectra Image!

Even my 9 yr old daughter said "I will never step in it"

Having had 5 previous Alfas, credibility and Image are a tad important.

richmilly

Can I throw another car in the Mix

MG ZT-T 190

logiclee

Hi Rich.

Can't help you much with this one, only ever sat inside a ZT. The interior is a step up from the Mondeo/Vectra, I rather like them.

I have driven a Rover 75 2.5V6 which is a very good comfort based car and seemed well built. The V6 offers good performance for the size of the car.

I'll have to blag myself a ride in one. I get the use of hire cars two to three times a month so I'm well in with the chap on the desk of our local Budget rentacar. I'm only supposed to be allowed Astra/Focus/Mondeo/Vectra band of cars but we have an agreement between us were I get bumped up if no other cars are available

Lee

TaviaRS

Octavia RS please

ianc

I seriously considered the ST200 last time I changed, needed a bigger car that was still fun to drive \ quick....

..but ultimately, as well as it handles, I found the ST200 always feels like a big car down tight twisty lanes, a good handling one but a lot to hussle!

You almost need a mondeo sized car that was based on a smaller floorpan, with shorter wheelbase to feel more "flickable" down the smaller roads. I found one.....

I bought an Octavia 4x4 estate


IC

RS Grant

Ash... Its easy to tell the ST200 from an ST170 cause the 200 is a Mondeo and the 170 is a Focus!!

Seriously though, I would go for the Mondeo after reading ALL the reviews when it was launched and put to the group test against the Vectra & Accord Type-R...

However, if you can live with the "Taxi" jokes then you should seriously consider the Octavia vRS because it is an extremely capable car and is unbelievable value for money!

Check out www.briskoda.net for more info on buying/owning and modifying...

Cheers
Grant

TurboBoost

The London Evening Standard ran an article on "stealth wealth" a couple of months back which did wonders for the Skoda vRS's image.