saxovts2000

Just took it out for a test drive very surprised I did like it alot!! Didn't feel alot quicker than my VTS but it pulled lower down and quicker than the VTS.

Very well built and safe but @ £16k a little expensive for a car that it so small.

Saying that would I buy one.....? It's very tempting only thing is that it's not a scooby which has first place in my heart other than that I'd buy for sure

GaryC

Not cheap at £16k - but as they only cost £14.5k it is a bargain when you consider what it is, what it has and what it does.

andrewdelvard

It'll be interesting to see what happens when the aftermarket boys modify this one...

Rokerlad

16K..they gotta be joking. You can get a CTR for that!

Chins

Rokerlad

But why would you get a CTR when the S is a superior car ?
CTR people like 172 people before them like refering to the Mags,
and the majority of the mags go with the S

Jonathan

Rokerlad

Granted..but the CTR is a good all rounder and as the original poster stated 16k for a car that small is a bit much. Give me a 200 bhp Vtech anyday.

GaryC

But as pointed out - this £16k car costs £14.5k, and still manages a WRX equalling PWR

P1Fanatic

Yes but it still looks utterly horrendous. And as for it being small - they look pretty phat to me compared to the average hot hatch.

Orwella

Unbias opinion (I own neither but have recently driven both on the same day).

The CTR has by far the better engine (both for sound and push in the back), but the Mini holds corners better. I prefered the CTR for its sound and racer feel. The missus prefered the Mini for cuteness and refinement.

lpitt

I've now driven both but own an MY01 CTR

Would have to say that I agree with the reviews where they say that the Cooper-S is a better all rounder, but this is simply because the CTR has been designed in the same mould as the ITR (albeit a little more family friendly) which is an out and out racer.

IMHO as a previous Scooby owner, the CTR is much closer to that ethos. The Scooby is a rally car on the road. The CTR is a track car on the road. The MINI on the other hand is not quite either of these but makes a good job of imitating both.

On saying that though, if I was making the decision of which to buy it would have to be whichever takes your fancy 'cos I can't see that in the real world you'd ever notice all that much difference!

Laurence

LG John

I think BMW missed an opportunity to make the Cooper S a monster. As soon as it hit the road I knew it wouldn't have the performance it promised and your test seems to confirm. I never feared embarrasment from any hot-hatch when I had the VTS with the exception of the CTR which I never had the chance to tussle with. The cooper S will be faster than a VTS but I think it should have been at least the measure of the CTR or more.

saxovts2000

like I said it didn't feel quicker but then I had the test drive is Chiswick on a saturday morning so I couldn't really but my foot down alot!!! It pull lower down and the saxo and given more time it probably is alot quicker.

As for the £16K that's with a few options chucked in like leather Aircon etc

I'm giving it a hard think really but the Impreza I love to bits. Anybody got any veiws on the future value of them?

LG John

Look at it like this: If you buy a 2-3 year old scooby it'll have done the bulk of its depreciation already. Buy a brand new Cooper S and you (as first owner) have to suffer that. Sure the scooby costs more to run but taking account of depreciation, etc you might find they will be closer over say 3 years than you think. Factor in that its the scooby you really want and I think the decision you have to make is plainly obvious

MattOz

Guess it depends on what you want from your car. I currently run a MINI Cooper and have test driven the Cooper S. I have to say that the performance gap between the two is quite significant. The Cooper S is much fruitier than my Cooper. It's no P1 or STI7, but then it's a damn site cheaper and on anything other than an arrow straight road would keep up with a WRX (and probably a P1 and STI7 )

My dilemma comes when i consider that I'd be spending approx. £17k on a MINI. That kinda puts me off initially, but there are a number of very important other considerations that people miss.

1- The Cooper S will be much easier and cheaper to insure than any Scoob
2- Arguably it's less nickable too
3- Unlimited mileage warranty for 3 years
4- £100 for 50,000 miles or 5 years servicing whichever comes first.

Factor in the costs above, and minimal depreciation in the forst 18 months or so, and you'd be laughing in an S, and IMHO kicking yourself in an equivalently priced Impreza. Plus, you'd have more fun in the Cooper S when you see the shocked expression on Subaru owners faces when you keep up with them!

My Cooper would retail currently for as much as I bought it for. Privately it could realise up to £500 more. The MINI market is great. It's just like Imprezas were about 4 years ago.

Cheers
Matt

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Thanks Matt for rubbing the depreciation thing in

When do I get a go in that Mini of yours????

F

MattOz

Floyd,

Hello Mate! Long time no see! How you doing? I really must make the effort and take a blat to MK to see you. Let me know when you're around and I'll come down. I'm thinking about going to the SIDC thing this weekend. Are you going? Be more than happy to let you have a go in the MINI then!

Cheers,

Matt

saxovts2000

that is what I thought about the market because it is in high demard at the moment maybe it might be "worth" going for it instead of an impreza.

But Impreza is just soo god damm sexy

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Hey Matt

I'll be there as I've agreed the play pass from Jane (even though it's my 10th wed anni!)so we can chat and drive etc.

I keep hearing about the curry nights (not to be confused with the Baron Nights)and I fancy a bit of that action too.

F

hades

One thing to throw in - my brother has a 6 month old cooper, some "minor" comments:-

Problems with electric windows. Both seats needed replacing and still not right after 2 "fixes". Instrument panel needed replacing. Power steering rack failed - "fix" leaves lights dimming if you turn the wheel, even at speed. (BMW say this is "normal"). One headlamp unit replaced. Boot lock mechanism replaced. Engine ECU problems. Gearbox disingtegrated after 12k miles.

On the upside, the chassis is fantastic, and the car is generally nice when not broken, although I think a normal cooper could do with more power to exploit the chassis.

I have tried to only state facts as it is not my intention to libel or slander or in any way abuse this forum. I'm sure many people have coopers which are fine, and I'm not criticising anyone for enjoying the test drive or buying one.

Draw your own conclusions

Phil

PS Matt - no offence m8, glad for you if your cooper is permanently healthy!

LG John

Saxo, the residuals are currently good on Mini Cooper S because of supply and demand, i.e more demand than BMW can build. They are not a particuarly special car compared to other hot-hatches so when the demand finally meets the supply and market equilibrium is met the second hand prices will begin to tumble. You could buy one keep it for 6 months and possibly sell it for a very good price. Alternatively, if you kept it longer, say a couple of years, I expect you'd pay depreciation in line with the 172, CTR, etc. Anyone else agree/disagree?

polarbearit

SB - Agree mostly with what you say, but I'd expect the mini to do slightly better (compared with CTR/172...) in the medium term, though talk of this model being replaced early due to high production costs may harm the longer term residuals if true...

Seems that the quality problems don't seem to effect the values though!

MattOz

Phil,

No offence taken m8!! Mine has had the odd electric window gremlin that's been cured with a turn off/on of the ignition. My seat squeaks if the lumbar support is fully extended and it pulls to the left a little under heavy braking and also in normal driving. Something to do with the wishbones, radius arms etc. BMW are replacing them as a matter of course.

My car was built in Feb 02, and has had many of the first batch of problems fixed in build. I know that they're not 100%, but as you say it's still a great car.

As for residuals, I'm sure that they will drop eventually, but not for a couple of years or so. Standard cars will lose much more than the slightly higher spec'd ones, but then anyone who has a standard One or Cooper or S is shooting themsleves in the foot. My Cooper was £14200 and has Chili pack, 17's A/C, Alarm, Metallic paint etc etc. Hopefully this'll help with resale.

A mate of mine sold a year old Cooper with similar spec to mine for £200 less than he paid for it. Not bad for 12 months motoring.

Matt

Stevie

Matt,

I drove a friends MINI Cooper, albeit not the S, last week, Wednesday I think.

I thought it nervous, a little bit girly, a little too tarty inside for me, like a pimps parlour, allegedly, but the owner did have a pleasant girlfriend

I know my mate was more than impressed with my vehicle offering for the swap. I think. Ha Ha. Sorry mate. See you tonight?

Joking aside, bloody good car, just not my thing.

Dave_UK300

When I was in my friends modifyed VTR it felt as if we were going backwards as well, when we chassed a brand new M3.
Bloody quick

MattOz

LOL @ Stevie!!! The C220 CDI I briefly drove instead was more wobbly that a blamange in a force 10 gale. No doubt see you later mate! Will be on the Busa if the weather gets any better!

Matt

saxovts2000

what sort of problems has the bug eyed Impreza had?

That way it will give me a better idea, I was thinking alone the lines of maybe getting the Cooper S keeping for a little while and then selling it hopefully getting my money back!! lol

Chins

Ive got an S, and am not overly impressed with the handling. I'm putting most of it down to the 17" wheels and plus suspension.

It feels a bit skittish and very nervous on bumpy B roads. Also not confidence inspiring braking on downhill bumpy B roads
To my mind 2nd gear is way too long and it needs more ooomph. Not sure if 200bhp will agree with it though without either smaller wheels or suspension mods.

Looks like it might be my shortest ownership to date. Might of created world war III on the Mini BBS though.

Jonathan

Matt Oz fan club

Matt

I've just got an image of you in your little Mini. I know you're about 7 ft tall, which means that your knees will be somewhere near your ears when driving it. LOL.

But for me, well I'll need a cushion and the seat as far forward as it will go.

zooey1234

Chins,

How about consumption. I have an STI7, but also thinking about a Cooper S for my girlfriend. Did you read the last issue of EVO?

Stevie

MattOz,

You are fantastic, you now have a fanclub

Mate, sorrl I was in the C, did you think I was in the S500?

Also, sorry I missed you last night, Jon said the bike was great and he is now corrupt!!

Had to go early, turn into a pumpkin you see