paulr

I work with a guy on a 4 on 4 off shift rota. On his days off he is a retained firefighter. He is allowed into their pension scheme. He pays £100 a month, they match it. This is a part time job on his days off (mainly).

Judge yourself if that is generous or not, when many full time private sector workers, in good jobs get anywhere near such a generous scheme.

I also know 4 retired firefighters in their 50's who now have full time jobs to "supplement" their pension.

ScoobyDoo555

I was under the impression that due to the job they are *potentially* required to do (ie going into burning buildings etc etc), they're pensioned off "young" as it's a young-man's game.
Yes, it's a good pension. But they're also thrown on the scrap-heap at a relatively young age. And by the looks of it, firefighting requires having 2 jobs to make a living.

Which in my mind, does ask the question - IF "we" don't agree with this pensionable young age of 50, when faced with that nightmare scenario of having to be rescued from a fire, or a A.N.OTHER disaster, would the public be as reassured and comforted being rescued by a 60-something (or even 70-something) Fireman?

No offence to the elder generation (I'm nearly 40 myself), but it certainly makes me stop and pause for thought.

moneys

iTrader: (5)

Each to their own, it was part of their original contract so why shouldnt they get it?If your company offered you the same terms then would you reject it? People need to stand up for themselves in this country, firefighters do a good job and a dangerous job. The reason for the cuts are lack of money then maybe they want to cut it from the slackers who dont work or the imigrants who send money back home

paulr

One friend of mine retired at 55, that is the retirement age for firemen to get the full pension. He now drives a hgv for a living. Why can he not drive a fire engine or be retrained to do an office job.

paulr

I know lots of agency workers who get no pension. Exactly how do they stand up for themselves.

moneys

iTrader: (5)

I work at JLR, its the same here, lads retired earlier with full pensions, good luck to them I say, if your not geared up or allowed to retire at that age then tough, if however you were offered it i think everyone of you would jump at it and then probably take on a part time job to stop the boredom

ScoobyDoo555

good point Paulr @ post#4. My (again, limited) understanding is that the engine drivers don't just drive. They've got to haul a lot of heavy goods and machinery at the incident, and also be called upon to go and assist if required.
Again, perhaps it's ageist, but ask yourself the question - at that age, are you going to be physically able to do that?
With respect to the office job/admin/management...... totally agree. BUT taking into account the employee's aspirations, would they:-
1. want to go into a desk job?
2. are they academically able to move into this type of role? Some people aren't able to do that.

Also, again, I was under the impression that all who work in the service can be called upon to assist at an incident....... regardless of rank or stature.


IMHO, it's all about capability. And in a physically-demanding role, that can be age-related. This applies to a great many jobs. Not just the Fire Service.

ScoobyDoo555

moneys - I agree with you: in most respects, its a simple case of jealousy and sour-grapes.
A sign of modern times, where society has got so used to having what it wants, that when it can't have something, it throws it's toys out of the pram.

Simple fact of the matter is that if you want the perks of a particular job, go and do that job.

Felix.

Firefighters only get their full pension if they get their 30 years service in - or retire at 55, which ever is sooner. The drivers of the fire engines are ordinary firefighters who have been trained to drive, they will be needed at the scene the same as any other.

The fire brigade is getting really squeezed at the moment and the pensions is just one thorn in their sides. Job cuts are now sweeping across the country under the guise of "... well people are more fire safety aware now..." and smaller stations are beginning to close which is having a major impact on response times.

Still, at least the energy companies are doing well....

daveyj

iTrader: (1)

Not to mention overpaid NHS Trust Chiefs, middle management, failed financial institutions, yada yada yada.

daveyj

iTrader: (1)

Hear hear! I enjoy being a Chef and I do laugh when people kick off about their perks. Ours are of our own making. I'd be well happy with a decent pension. Won't stop me working for a living though.

shooter007

these guys pay for there pension (more than most ) contracts work both ways

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11446831

Shooter007

NHS employees would love to have the Firefighters pension scheme........

Shaun

SJ_Skyline

Edit: should have read Midlife's link as it answered my question

On the surface it looks quite a generous contribution compared to many private sector pensions.

mart360

Basic starts at £28K

Watch commander £35k PA

Why would they need 2 jobs?


Mart

warrenm2

OK so thats what is paid in, now what about what he gets on retirement (and for how long and any index linking)?

ScoobyDoo555

Dunno. Someone said it in a previous post.i assumed they'd got their fact right I've got more productive things to do than look up people's salaries

shooter007

shaun all i mean is if that was the contract you signed up for and paid for then thats what you get when you retire

pslewis

We would ALL love a Firemans Pension!

Most of us have had our Pensions changed - years ago!

Not many of us do a job which is so easy going that we can also do 2 other jobs at the same time!

It's unusual for a fireman to have to put himself in danger, there simply isn't a Bunsfield regularly enough - thank god.

Granted, they are very good at playing with their hoses at the village fete and showing off to the ladies with their be-bah be-bah .......... and, of course, advising granny Ethal on which smoke alarm to buy.

Maybe they are worth their £35,000 a year and fat pensions at just 55 then?

G.Mac

iTrader: (2)

IMHO I recon firefighters deserve their conditions. Having done live fire firefighting training in full suits and BA I would never want to have to do what they do on a regular basis.

There are some decent pension schemes still on the go, I work for a shipping company and last month I paid £198.37 into the company scheme and the company contributed £799.43 according to my payslip .

Gogs

Alright folks, I am a whole time firefighter , I am also a driver so I do both drive and go into house fires, also cut people out off cars, rescue people from the sea, rivers and flooding, attend chemical incidents, dealing with suicides, removing bodies from trapped machinery, gas explosions and the list goes on, our pay is £28500 minus tax national insurance and we pay 13.2 percent to our pensions and that is going up also. On my signing up I signed to a 30 year job career for a full pension, now they are movin the goalposts to what I signed up to, wanting me to work until 60, reducing my lump sum by 25 thousand, reducing my annual by £2200 a year. On top of that I will have an extra 6 years of 13.2 percent of my salary to pay to my pension. So work longer and get a lot less at the end off it, not what the service offered me when I signed up!!. They are also making it easier to put you out off the job on capability ( not being able to perform your job physically) up until the age of 60!!!. This is why we are fighting for our pensions, its only right I get what I signed up for and what I am working for and what I have planned my life and family's life around

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

..........strangely enough that's what they did to the NHS pension.

It's not the pension I signed up for when I joined the NHS in 1982 which was 31 years ago.

At my last appraisal I asked what would happen to me if I couldn't do my job because of my age and they said they would get rid of me.

That's how it is.......................

Shaun

Lisawrx

iTrader: (1)

Shaun, are you saying because it's how it is, that it's ok that people have had their terms changed (presumably with no consultation-by that I mean it was just told, not discussed and agreed) and they should just suck it up and not try to fight against changes? I don't mean just firefighters, but NHS staff etc.

It would be easy for me to wade in as a private sector wage slave and bang on about how lucky public sector workers are even despite changes blah blah as many do, but regardless of how good I might think other people have it, I am sympathetic to people just having their terms changed from what they signed up to.

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Lisa

I think I pay about 13.6% of my salary into my pension and basically I work for 40 years and get half of my final salary as a pension plus some sort of lump sum............which I think is unbeatable value and would not get the same if I was in a private scheme.

The "work for 40 years and get half your salary as a pension" is what we in the NHS have signed up for for as long as I can remember. It has changed for new members and this is on the net but for us old timers that was it..........Ok we have to pay in more and get less but for the vast majority of staff currently in the NHS it's a 40 year plus slog.

Which is why we look on the other public service professions that can work for 30 years with some envy...

Shaun

cster

Indeed.
I am always a little surprised when people in the private sector on PAYE defend the public sector right to strike and pension entitlements and so on.
Who do they think actually pays for these generous pension deals and other public sector T&Cs?
Me thinks the public sector PR machine is doing a pretty damn fine job in this country.

Leslie

Seems to me that if the bloke is prepared to risk his life to save others then such criticism is unnecessary and unfair.

Les

Lisawrx

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't say I am defending people in the private sector, I'm just not condemning them either. Like I said, I could bang on about how good some have it compared to others, but I suppose the counter people would give to that, is go and do it then..... All I am saying is that I do have a degree of sympathy for people who signed up for one thing only to have it significantly changed.

ScoobP1

iTrader: (1)

Firefighters do a dangerous job and get paid not a lot for doing it. The pension is/was good and the retirement age is attractive.

If you think it's a good deal, get a job as one. If not, don't! Simples!!