paulr

Every day, you read about Government mismanagement, bad policies and poor decision making. My sister is a teacher, and yesterday she was telling me about all the teachers that are leaving. They are sick to death of year on year changes. Yesterday also, there was a doctor on the radio, moaning about the same thing. Changes ever few years.
We need more stability. We need a system where our leaders learn to work together and make long term decisions.We need PR.

Thats my moan for the day. A bit dull, but there you go.

DYK

A guy used to make me laugh at a place I would regular visit,if anyone moaned about work they had to do he would shout out, IF YOU DON'T WANT THE JOB, **** OFF

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

You're right about stability.While the NHS and the education system are little more than poliitcal footballs used for scoring party policitical points you won't get any proper progress.

We also need whatever system will get rid of Cameron forever and prevent Milliband getting in

scooby87

iTrader: (5)

Unfortunately I think its all too far gone now, Cameron and the tea boy are useless but so are the rest. God help us if Milliband ever gets in.

A total reform needs to be done, but could that happen in weak country we now live in.....

David Lock

I don't think PR will achieve what you are after.

dl

warrenm2

Exactly

Martin2005

Totally agree.

We are forever proclaiming the vitues of democracy to other countries around the world, yet we barely practice it ourselves!

Leslie

How would PR improve things Paul?

Les

paulr

http://www.politicsresources.net/area/uk/uktable.htm

Look at that chart, then tell me FPTP is fair.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

A civil war?

Sorry, but I can't help thinking that whilst I'm in total agreeance, there are millions of people who vote for a party purely because that's the party who their parents/mates have historically always voted for, regardless of how shyte they really are. Which puts you, me and some other S'Netters in a minority.

Just from a simple look through a few constituencies and the past voting results of the past few decades show that regardless of the political or economical climate and regardless of who is in control, a majority always vote for same party, as they have always done on every single election for the past 30 odd years.

Combine that lot with those who can't be bothered to vote (rather that spoiling their vote) means this is hardly a democracy.

stilover

Proportional Representation just means nothing gets done.

1 party wants to stop paying Benefits to work shy Chavs. 2nd party wants to keep paying them, and the 3rd party isn't bothered either way. Result? Nothing gets done.

1 party wants wants to change immigration laws. 2nd Party doesn't want to, and the 3rd isn't bothered either way. Result? Nothing gets done.

You need one party leading the country and making decisions, whether they are right or wrong decisions, only us, the voter can decide in the next election.

Just look at Italy. They have punch-up's over what make of Coffee to have in their breaks.

warrenm2

This is it. Seemingly it is fair, however in reality nothing radical will ever get done, and right now we need radical solutions....

hodgy0_2

Unfortunatly radicalism and dogma got us here in the first place

warrenm2

Yeah the dogma of buying votes with other peoples money

paulr

We dont need radical solutions at all. Throughout history, success has always come down to the same things, hard work, good education and good decision making. Thats it, there is nothing else.
As for PR means nothing gets done. Germany seems to have done very well out of it.

In 2005 Tony Blair (then GB) became PM on 35% of the vote. That cannot be fair under any circumstances.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

That statistic has grated upon me since the day he was elected and everytime I read or heard some spin on his "overwhelming" "landslide" "victory" (quoted for sakes of sarcasm)

FFS John Major still stands as the last PM to ever receive such a high proportion of votes. 14million votes with a 33.6million turn out. And whilst his reign wasn't the most fruitful, to this day, nobody has bettered it. Nor have we had a better turnout since.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

We're £1.2trillion in debt and we have a government that are picking around the edges of it as would any of the main parties.... there has never been more need for a radical solution than now!!!

Even with a coallition we're screwed to some extent... even if Osborne was serious about cutting welfare the Lib Dems won't let him!!!! With PR that sort of thing would only be worse.

warrenm2

Exactly

paulr

Not completely true. The Lib Dems want to cut "benefits" to well off pensioners. Cameron says no.

Also, there is a large number of people who oppose the EU. Under FPTP they are denied any representation in Parliament. Totally wrong.

stilover

The Lib Dems only want the people who work hard to get themselves a better standard of living, to pay for those who can't be @rsed.

If I set up a Business, work all hours under the sun to make it succesful, employ local people, leading to less unemployment. Why should I then be Taxed to death to pay for people who want everything for nothing?

Martin2005

I do love your pragmatism when it comes to the electoral system and subsequent lack of representation in this country.

This is of course in stark contrast to your total intollerance to the EU democratic deficit

WarrenM - and hypocrisy... you decide

Miniman

iTrader: (2)

Now I don't know the numbers, but say Tory got 34% and LibDem 31% on the same day, then Tony would still be asked to form the government. However if the numbers of MP's reflected the % spread, he wouldn't have gotten much done.

While FPTP seems unfair on a micro scale on a macro level it gets things done.

paulr

This is one of my problems when people talk about governments "getting things done". Personally i'd rather they just took a back seat, and only did things when needed. It's people, families, companies and euntrepeneurs that "get things done". Politicians, in the end, do f*ck all. Set in place some stable, sensible laws then f*ck off.

cster

Well unless the PR system is going to give us a better standard of politician (and it most assuredly won't), I can't see any point in this proposal.
Re the above post, these guys aren't gonna vote themselves out of a job either way.