Alcohol Ban ?
23 March 2012, 12:18 PM
#1
Alcohol Ban ?
Ok, its been proven in the past to not work and will never happen but do you think we would be better off as a society without alcohol ?
The government are talking about introducing minimum unit prices and I think its a pretty good idea, cut down on the scuffers drinking Frosty Jacks in the park, wont make any odds to my fairly moderate drinking of normal Beer and Wine and it may be cue to cut down a bit if it does.
We seem as a culture, and I am as bad as anybody else on this, unable to contemplate going out without drinking, we make complicated logistical arrangements to contrive situations where we can drink, when just driving would be easier, cheaper and the sensible option. Blokes dont go out together unless beer is involved as a rule, women have got a lot worse, I went to a school reunion and a few of the girls were as mullered as the blokes, all 41 plus and looking fat, puffy and that they should perhaps cut down.
Alcohol rasies a lot of revenue but would we need all that revenue to patch people up from fighting and falling over every weekend if they couldnt get hold of it, this year I have heard of two people locally who have drunk themselves to death.
We have a daft attitude to alcohol over here, all the little slogans and sayings, one doing the rounds on Facebook about not being able to start the day without Coffee or end it without Alcohol, of course we can do both, we all seem to thinkits ok as everyone else is doing it, guy at work did his medical form and says he drinks 6-8 "drinks" a day, thats pints, and he does, I had six on a work night out last week and felt horrific the next day.
There is a good side to alcohol, its fantastic stuff but we try and chase the magic of that first pint or two all night and it doesnt work, you cant force it and you cant do it every day, it needs to be a treat or a special occasion, not routine, or a crutch to get through life, my theory is that anything that makes you feel good artificially has an equal (or greater) and opposite effect so use sparingly, make it count.
I dont advocate doing away with Booze, cant say the teetotal groups stand out as a shining beacon of happiness, in fact the reverse sometimes, quite grumpy and I reckon a pint and some processed pork in a bun may help in that respect.
So, do you support what the government is doing, I do but I cant get my head round the fact it always involves making things more expensive ! but if it helps with underage drinking and violence then it may not be a bad thing.
The government are talking about introducing minimum unit prices and I think its a pretty good idea, cut down on the scuffers drinking Frosty Jacks in the park, wont make any odds to my fairly moderate drinking of normal Beer and Wine and it may be cue to cut down a bit if it does.
We seem as a culture, and I am as bad as anybody else on this, unable to contemplate going out without drinking, we make complicated logistical arrangements to contrive situations where we can drink, when just driving would be easier, cheaper and the sensible option. Blokes dont go out together unless beer is involved as a rule, women have got a lot worse, I went to a school reunion and a few of the girls were as mullered as the blokes, all 41 plus and looking fat, puffy and that they should perhaps cut down.
Alcohol rasies a lot of revenue but would we need all that revenue to patch people up from fighting and falling over every weekend if they couldnt get hold of it, this year I have heard of two people locally who have drunk themselves to death.
We have a daft attitude to alcohol over here, all the little slogans and sayings, one doing the rounds on Facebook about not being able to start the day without Coffee or end it without Alcohol, of course we can do both, we all seem to thinkits ok as everyone else is doing it, guy at work did his medical form and says he drinks 6-8 "drinks" a day, thats pints, and he does, I had six on a work night out last week and felt horrific the next day.
There is a good side to alcohol, its fantastic stuff but we try and chase the magic of that first pint or two all night and it doesnt work, you cant force it and you cant do it every day, it needs to be a treat or a special occasion, not routine, or a crutch to get through life, my theory is that anything that makes you feel good artificially has an equal (or greater) and opposite effect so use sparingly, make it count.
I dont advocate doing away with Booze, cant say the teetotal groups stand out as a shining beacon of happiness, in fact the reverse sometimes, quite grumpy and I reckon a pint and some processed pork in a bun may help in that respect.
So, do you support what the government is doing, I do but I cant get my head round the fact it always involves making things more expensive ! but if it helps with underage drinking and violence then it may not be a bad thing.
23 March 2012, 01:04 PM
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The biggest problem is the attitude in the UK to everything not just alcohol. You all think you are something special and better than everyone else. You think you need to go out and get hammered and then prove how hard you are, you get into fights and violent/verbal confrontations just because you think some one looked at you wrong. I am in Germany as most of you know and we have 24/7 drinking and alcohol is available all over the place, even in McDonalds and Pizza Hut etc. The biggest difference here is people respect each other, they respect each others rights and property and they also do not feel the need to get rat arsed and cause trouble or knock seven bells out of someone who happened to glance in their direction inadvertantly. until you lot got over yourselves and realise you are not special and learn to respect yourself aswell as others nothing the government do will make any difference.
23 March 2012, 01:24 PM
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its at base level education, society removes alcohol from other drugs - like dont drink and drive, then dont take drugs and drive, slogans??
why differentiate - people need to wake up and realise alcohol is the most dangerous DRUG available. all the effecst are so widley documented, from social/econimc to health/dependancy effects.
that said i beleive people have every right to drink if they want - as i do with any drugs tbh(some exceptions). they shouldnt be told what they can and cant to there - BUT they must be fully eductaed to all the potential risks.
and that come from teaching kids the truth.
the goverments aim is to make money, nothing else. putting up prices raises revenue and they have the moral highground of were doing it because we care. lol
same as enviromental taxes - even though we are a tiny island with all but no effect on global climate change
why differentiate - people need to wake up and realise alcohol is the most dangerous DRUG available. all the effecst are so widley documented, from social/econimc to health/dependancy effects.
that said i beleive people have every right to drink if they want - as i do with any drugs tbh(some exceptions). they shouldnt be told what they can and cant to there - BUT they must be fully eductaed to all the potential risks.
and that come from teaching kids the truth.
the goverments aim is to make money, nothing else. putting up prices raises revenue and they have the moral highground of were doing it because we care. lol
same as enviromental taxes - even though we are a tiny island with all but no effect on global climate change
23 March 2012, 01:55 PM
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The Government, of whatever "hue", always thinks that more cost (i.e. tax) is the way to regulate everything to make things "right". As Wurzel says, the problem is not "cost", it's the "attitude". The police have plenty of powers already, they should haul the drunks to the cells and have them "stay" overnight, with a trip to court the next morning for being drunk and disorderly, or whatever. A few months of this and I'll bet that most of this so-called "binge-drinking" would stop.
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23 March 2012, 02:36 PM
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The biggest problem is the attitude in the UK to everything not just alcohol. You all think you are something special and better than everyone else. You think you need to go out and get hammered and then prove how hard you are, you get into fights and violent/verbal confrontations just because you think some one looked at you wrong. I am in Germany as most of you know and we have 24/7 drinking and alcohol is available all over the place, even in McDonalds and Pizza Hut etc. The biggest difference here is people respect each other, they respect each others rights and property and they also do not feel the need to get rat arsed and cause trouble or knock seven bells out of someone who happened to glance in their direction inadvertantly. until you lot got over yourselves and realise you are not special and learn to respect yourself aswell as others nothing the government do will make any difference.
23 March 2012, 02:39 PM
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Interesting thread.
In january, my friends and I were talking about the whole 'what else can we do for fun if we can't drink' topic.
Usually every week i will go out on a friday or a saturday for a *ahem* few beers with my mates. we do usually stay out till close (depending where we are between 1am-3am). Sometimes we will start in the afternoon if there is football or rugby on or something. But this proves to get very expensive.
Since a couple of my mates are looking/buying houses, and the rest are fed up of wasting so much money, we decided to do an alcohol free january.
First weekend was easy. Went out for a meal, had water or whatever with our meals. got to 11 o clock and then went home. done. The next weekend we did the same thing, also went to the cinema. The weekend after we couldn't face going out for another meal so thought we'd try something else......What else? We had no idea what to do. Bearing in mind we are all 22/23, we literally thought there was nothing for us to do without going for a beer or 10.
That is what our culture has become. We are almost dependant on going out for a beer. Since we thought there was nothing else to do, we thought, fvck it, lets go to a bar but just not drink. We all had this vision that if we were sober then we would stand more chance of chatting up girls, since we wouldn't just be slurring absolute gibberish.
Oh how we were wrong. Try and chat up a girl who is just slurring absolute gibberish, whilst you're sober as a judge trying to talk sense. It's frustrating. We all went home by about 10 o clock as it was so bad being sober in a bar.
The last weekend of jan we thought fvck it and got absolutely plastered on Guinness. It was amazing
In january, my friends and I were talking about the whole 'what else can we do for fun if we can't drink' topic.
Usually every week i will go out on a friday or a saturday for a *ahem* few beers with my mates. we do usually stay out till close (depending where we are between 1am-3am). Sometimes we will start in the afternoon if there is football or rugby on or something. But this proves to get very expensive.
Since a couple of my mates are looking/buying houses, and the rest are fed up of wasting so much money, we decided to do an alcohol free january.
First weekend was easy. Went out for a meal, had water or whatever with our meals. got to 11 o clock and then went home. done. The next weekend we did the same thing, also went to the cinema. The weekend after we couldn't face going out for another meal so thought we'd try something else......What else? We had no idea what to do. Bearing in mind we are all 22/23, we literally thought there was nothing for us to do without going for a beer or 10.
That is what our culture has become. We are almost dependant on going out for a beer. Since we thought there was nothing else to do, we thought, fvck it, lets go to a bar but just not drink. We all had this vision that if we were sober then we would stand more chance of chatting up girls, since we wouldn't just be slurring absolute gibberish.
Oh how we were wrong. Try and chat up a girl who is just slurring absolute gibberish, whilst you're sober as a judge trying to talk sense. It's frustrating. We all went home by about 10 o clock as it was so bad being sober in a bar.
The last weekend of jan we thought fvck it and got absolutely plastered on Guinness. It was amazing
23 March 2012, 02:41 PM
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The biggest problem is the attitude in the UK to everything not just alcohol. You all think you are something special and better than everyone else. You think you need to go out and get hammered and then prove how hard you are, you get into fights and violent/verbal confrontations just because you think some one looked at you wrong. I am in Germany as most of you know and we have 24/7 drinking and alcohol is available all over the place, even in McDonalds and Pizza Hut etc. The biggest difference here is people respect each other, they respect each others rights and property and they also do not feel the need to get rat arsed and cause trouble or knock seven bells out of someone who happened to glance in their direction inadvertantly. until you lot got over yourselves and realise you are not special and learn to respect yourself aswell as others nothing the government do will make any difference.
I think you are only talking about a specific category of people there.
23 March 2012, 02:44 PM
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I don't think for one minute this has anything to do with the Government trying to stop binge drinking. It has been going on for years. I bet 90% of the Government themselves have been guilty of it. It is only in recent years it has been publicised so much.
I feel this is nothing more than another great way to get more money from the British people. Money that is getting scarcer by the day. They continue to find new ways of robbing us all, in the name of looking after us. Yeah!
I feel this is nothing more than another great way to get more money from the British people. Money that is getting scarcer by the day. They continue to find new ways of robbing us all, in the name of looking after us. Yeah!
23 March 2012, 02:50 PM
#12
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They know drinkers won't stop drinking - they've learnt that from the smokers.
Personally I don't drink so the minimum per unit doesn't bother me and most of the intelligent population will realise that the whole thing is just a means to being in more cash.
Hopefully they'll rush through the bill and they can use the increase in revenue to cancel the 3p fuel increase.
Personally I don't drink so the minimum per unit doesn't bother me and most of the intelligent population will realise that the whole thing is just a means to being in more cash.
Hopefully they'll rush through the bill and they can use the increase in revenue to cancel the 3p fuel increase.
23 March 2012, 03:02 PM
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Interesting thread.
In january, my friends and I were talking about the whole 'what else can we do for fun if we can't drink' topic.
Usually every week i will go out on a friday or a saturday for a *ahem* few beers with my mates. we do usually stay out till close (depending where we are between 1am-3am). Sometimes we will start in the afternoon if there is football or rugby on or something. But this proves to get very expensive.
Since a couple of my mates are looking/buying houses, and the rest are fed up of wasting so much money, we decided to do an alcohol free january.
First weekend was easy. Went out for a meal, had water or whatever with our meals. got to 11 o clock and then went home. done. The next weekend we did the same thing, also went to the cinema. The weekend after we couldn't face going out for another meal so thought we'd try something else......What else? We had no idea what to do. Bearing in mind we are all 22/23, we literally thought there was nothing for us to do without going for a beer or 10.
That is what our culture has become. We are almost dependant on going out for a beer. Since we thought there was nothing else to do, we thought, fvck it, lets go to a bar but just not drink. We all had this vision that if we were sober then we would stand more chance of chatting up girls, since we wouldn't just be slurring absolute gibberish.
Oh how we were wrong. Try and chat up a girl who is just slurring absolute gibberish, whilst you're sober as a judge trying to talk sense. It's frustrating. We all went home by about 10 o clock as it was so bad being sober in a bar.
The last weekend of jan we thought fvck it and got absolutely plastered on Guinness. It was amazing
In january, my friends and I were talking about the whole 'what else can we do for fun if we can't drink' topic.
Usually every week i will go out on a friday or a saturday for a *ahem* few beers with my mates. we do usually stay out till close (depending where we are between 1am-3am). Sometimes we will start in the afternoon if there is football or rugby on or something. But this proves to get very expensive.
Since a couple of my mates are looking/buying houses, and the rest are fed up of wasting so much money, we decided to do an alcohol free january.
First weekend was easy. Went out for a meal, had water or whatever with our meals. got to 11 o clock and then went home. done. The next weekend we did the same thing, also went to the cinema. The weekend after we couldn't face going out for another meal so thought we'd try something else......What else? We had no idea what to do. Bearing in mind we are all 22/23, we literally thought there was nothing for us to do without going for a beer or 10.
That is what our culture has become. We are almost dependant on going out for a beer. Since we thought there was nothing else to do, we thought, fvck it, lets go to a bar but just not drink. We all had this vision that if we were sober then we would stand more chance of chatting up girls, since we wouldn't just be slurring absolute gibberish.
Oh how we were wrong. Try and chat up a girl who is just slurring absolute gibberish, whilst you're sober as a judge trying to talk sense. It's frustrating. We all went home by about 10 o clock as it was so bad being sober in a bar.
The last weekend of jan we thought fvck it and got absolutely plastered on Guinness. It was amazing
but if your doing afternoon drinking, theres loads to replace with - ill bore you with my thinking lol. rockclimbing centres, go-carting, mountain biking, quad biking/hovercraft as a few.
yes all cost but i would think less than a full day/night on the drink?
23 March 2012, 03:51 PM
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Not where alcohol has always been such a companion in the customs, in joyful social interactions and events, and to help the anxious ones forget about the painful reality. How can you eradicate something that has been around for Adams, and so well-mingled with the way of life. The society will be like H2O without any oxygen in in it. I see plenty of troubles ahead if alcohol is totally banned here.
Someone today said that Moonshine may come back because its cheap. Whatever that Moonshine is. It must be like that cheap Lambrescue Chianteu or something.
23 March 2012, 03:53 PM
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I'm not certain, but I understood that the recommendation of the 40p per unit would be added at the point of sale rather than as extra duty, therefore the extra cost to buy a bottle of whatever benefits the retailer rather than HMRC and can't be used for a cut in / cancellation of fuel duty.
23 March 2012, 03:58 PM
#16
No.
Not where alcohol has always been such a companion in the customs, in joyful social interactions and events, and to help the anxious ones forget about the painful reality. How can you eradicate something that has been around for Adams, and so well-mingled with the way of life. The society will be like H2O without any oxygen in in it. I see plenty of troubles ahead if alcohol is totally banned here.
Someone today said that Moonshine may come back because its cheap. Whatever that Moonshine is. It must be like that cheap Lambrescue Chianteu or something.
Not where alcohol has always been such a companion in the customs, in joyful social interactions and events, and to help the anxious ones forget about the painful reality. How can you eradicate something that has been around for Adams, and so well-mingled with the way of life. The society will be like H2O without any oxygen in in it. I see plenty of troubles ahead if alcohol is totally banned here.
Someone today said that Moonshine may come back because its cheap. Whatever that Moonshine is. It must be like that cheap Lambrescue Chianteu or something.
Like I said, that doesnt work, use and abuse needs to come down and the culture change, its got silly.
23 March 2012, 04:11 PM
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I know, they are not banning it. I do read the papers sometimes, mate.
Yeah.
Making it more expensive is rationalised in the sense that it alcohol consumption is not a necessity but a recreational top-up. But, some are so into it that they'd rather sacrifice or compromise their food for alcohol, no matter what. We will see more malnutrition and related health isues in the society. I also see hypothermia deaths increasing, as alkys would rather pay for a bottle than for heating. One can't win.
Like I said, that doesnt work, use and abuse needs to come down and the culture change, its got silly.
Making it more expensive is rationalised in the sense that it alcohol consumption is not a necessity but a recreational top-up. But, some are so into it that they'd rather sacrifice or compromise their food for alcohol, no matter what. We will see more malnutrition and related health isues in the society. I also see hypothermia deaths increasing, as alkys would rather pay for a bottle than for heating. One can't win.
23 March 2012, 04:13 PM
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No.
Not where alcohol has always been such a companion in the customs, in joyful social interactions and events, and to help the anxious ones forget about the painful reality. How can you eradicate something that has been around for Adams, and so well-mingled with the way of life. The society will be like H2O without any oxygen in in it. I see plenty of troubles ahead if alcohol is totally banned here.
Someone today said that Moonshine may come back because its cheap. Whatever that Moonshine is. It must be like that cheap Lambrescue Chianteu or something.
Not where alcohol has always been such a companion in the customs, in joyful social interactions and events, and to help the anxious ones forget about the painful reality. How can you eradicate something that has been around for Adams, and so well-mingled with the way of life. The society will be like H2O without any oxygen in in it. I see plenty of troubles ahead if alcohol is totally banned here.
Someone today said that Moonshine may come back because its cheap. Whatever that Moonshine is. It must be like that cheap Lambrescue Chianteu or something.
alcohol is around purley due to social acceptance, histroy and tradition.
unfortunatley none of which have a bearing on its effects.
it will never been outlawd here imo, and doesnt need to as long as people are eductaed as to exactly what it is and its effects.
alcohol like many drugs can have positive effects, but people need to get the fact it can be an extremely dangerous drug.
23 March 2012, 04:16 PM
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let just bring in sharia law and be done with it.
for ***** sake.
putting price of alcohol isnt going to stop anyone from drinking. The boot leggers vodka that turns people blind will be having an increased sales and i'll probably be bootlegging booze across the country in the scoob like the good 'ol days of prohibition. Look what happened back then!
Its got to be education. The french have CHEAPER alcohol than us, and dont get this problem because it is part of normal life not "its friday, lets go get smashed" attitude that we have here.
The more you try and stop people doing something, the more they will want to do it.
If you want to change people's rights, dont moan when it comes around that people start changing your rights too! Let bygons be bygons.
i.e. anti-smokers. well, now they're after the boozers. Next will be the take aways and anything that has salt as the ingredient. It WILL happen.
for ***** sake.
putting price of alcohol isnt going to stop anyone from drinking. The boot leggers vodka that turns people blind will be having an increased sales and i'll probably be bootlegging booze across the country in the scoob like the good 'ol days of prohibition. Look what happened back then!
Its got to be education. The french have CHEAPER alcohol than us, and dont get this problem because it is part of normal life not "its friday, lets go get smashed" attitude that we have here.
The more you try and stop people doing something, the more they will want to do it.
If you want to change people's rights, dont moan when it comes around that people start changing your rights too! Let bygons be bygons.
i.e. anti-smokers. well, now they're after the boozers. Next will be the take aways and anything that has salt as the ingredient. It WILL happen.
23 March 2012, 04:29 PM
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23 March 2012, 04:43 PM
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It wont work but the government will steam roller it through anyway. Remember 24 hour drinking was supposed to cut binge drinking, all the experts said it would only make matters worse, but labour came to the conclusion that if bars and pubs were open longer then people would drink slower
.
.
23 March 2012, 05:00 PM
#23
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The main argument here, and the reason it's acceptable for these political morons to tell people how they can spend there time, is based on the fact that it will save the NHS money.
If that's a principle we're to adopt, where will it end? The creep of state power continues...
If that's a principle we're to adopt, where will it end? The creep of state power continues...
23 March 2012, 05:24 PM
#24
The real issue here is that individuals need to have a sense of personal awareness coupled with personal responsibility where alcohol is concerned as it is a drug even though it is legal and socially accepted.
Also I agree with Wurzel from Germany as we don't respect alcohol or each other when under its influence. In fact I quite envy our European counterparts who appear to enjoy the social aspect of life accompanied with alcohol but without the abuse & other misdemeanors that often arise in Great Britain, sometimes I even think that we should drop the 'Great'.
Also I agree with Wurzel from Germany as we don't respect alcohol or each other when under its influence. In fact I quite envy our European counterparts who appear to enjoy the social aspect of life accompanied with alcohol but without the abuse & other misdemeanors that often arise in Great Britain, sometimes I even think that we should drop the 'Great'.
23 March 2012, 05:34 PM
#26
The biggest problem is the attitude in the UK to everything not just alcohol. You all think you are something special and better than everyone else. You think you need to go out and get hammered and then prove how hard you are, you get into fights and violent/verbal confrontations just because you think some one looked at you wrong. I am in Germany as most of you know and we have 24/7 drinking and alcohol is available all over the place, even in McDonalds and Pizza Hut etc. The biggest difference here is people respect each other, they respect each others rights and property and they also do not feel the need to get rat arsed and cause trouble or knock seven bells out of someone who happened to glance in their direction inadvertantly. until you lot got over yourselves and realise you are not special and learn to respect yourself aswell as others nothing the government do will make any difference.
A couple of time we seen groups of guys with a small cart tipping hundreds of bottle tops down a set of stairs, whats that all about?
23 March 2012, 06:04 PM
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I think we should be wary of assuming that all problems to do with drink revolve around people going out on a weekend, getting hammered, and beating each other up.
Plenty of nice, respectable, adults drinking way over the recommended limits every night of the week but because it's in their own home with a decent Shiraz it's somehow not an alcohol problem...
I know quite a few people who are completely in denial that they are actually dependent on booze.
Plenty of nice, respectable, adults drinking way over the recommended limits every night of the week but because it's in their own home with a decent Shiraz it's somehow not an alcohol problem...
I know quite a few people who are completely in denial that they are actually dependent on booze.
23 March 2012, 06:20 PM
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And of course everybody here has been distracted into talking about what the government wants us to talk about, alcohol, rather than dissecting the budget and its complete lack of original thinking or ideas to actually do something useful, like reduce public spending! You'll note that this call for 'minimum alcohol pricing' was preceded by a so-called survey/report on the increases in liver problems 'caused by' alcohol. You'll also note, as was mentioned earlier, that the EU is also involved - not that our politicians will admit that. Still, it beats taking the government to task over the Granny tax 
Dave
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23 March 2012, 07:28 PM
#30
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I think we should be wary of assuming that all problems to do with drink revolve around people going out on a weekend, getting hammered, and beating each other up.
Plenty of nice, respectable, adults drinking way over the recommended limits every night of the week but because it's in their own home with a decent Shiraz it's somehow not an alcohol problem...
I know quite a few people who are completely in denial that they are actually dependent on booze.
Plenty of nice, respectable, adults drinking way over the recommended limits every night of the week but because it's in their own home with a decent Shiraz it's somehow not an alcohol problem...
I know quite a few people who are completely in denial that they are actually dependent on booze.
I was one of these people until the turn of the year when I woke up and realised..... I'm drinking a bottle of merlot nearly every night, then 2-3 at the weekend!! Cut back, hit the gym, 15st 3lb-13st 6lb, feelin alot better and now enjoy my glass of wine or pint now!!! You hit the nail on the head there!!