tarmac terror

iTrader: (2)

Folks - one posted for legal opinion please. I'll keep it as brief as I can.

During amicable discussion with a neighbour a few weeks back, i mentioned that I was considering have some conifers removed from the front of my property. He told me he knew a tree surgeon who was local and would do a good job. Happy to take his recommendation, one week later, my neighbour knocked my door and introduced me to Roy the tree surgeon, he left the two of us to discuss things on my doorstep.

The main points for discussion were, price, including disposal of the trees, his confidence in taking the work in in close proximity to my house, and for me to ascertain when he would be available to work. I also explained that I had two cars parked with 6 feet of a 30ft conifer, on which the batteries were flat and would need moved of the drive before any work started. I took his phone number and told him I would give him a call after I had discussed the price and details with my wife.

I took my wife and family went out for breakfast this morning at 9:30, on our return at 11:15, the conifer tree had been cut down and sawn into pieces and loaded onto a trailer. I checked my cars for damage, the MX5 was covered in saw dust, and my Impreza had been caught on the OSR corner and spoiler by the conifer leaves, causing some minor scratching. I spoke with the bloke who had cut it down, he said that I had given him the go-ahead last Saturday. I told him that was not the case, I had decided against having the tree taken away fully, because the terms of sale on my house, prohibited me from erecting any form of fence around the front boundary. He returned a short time later with my Neighbour who had introduced us, my neighbour stated that he was present last week when I discussed the arrangements with the tree surgeon, and that he would be making a statement to the tree surgeons solicitor that I had given him the go ahead to carry out this work today.

I have written my own record of all events around this, and am awaiting a visit from the police to get my own statement in place.

Any advice from the legal perspective welcome, will this be his word (and whatever story his neighbour gives) against mine?

Absolutely ripping at the minute - fit to do something that will land me in bother.

ScoobyDoo555

Neighbour's account won't hold up as they're friends.

sadly though, unless you've got any of this documented, you're gonna have trouble proving as such

Personally I wouldn't pay him. My understanding of your post is that you hadn't actually sanctioned the work....

Will the scratching clean/mop out? If so, treat it as a freebie and tell him to do one!

Probably not the best advice, and I'm sure others can advise better, but I think that the above is what I'd do.....

And chalk it down to experience.

Good luck either way

Dan

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Just ask for details of his public liability insurance..........

Shaun

MMT WRX

You know I think I would go with that too.^^^
Also, is this guy registered as a business for tax etc?
And what a complete and utter w4nker you have for a neighbour, I would be keeping a careful eye on him.
Hope you get this sorted.

Leslie

Can't believe that he should do the job in your absence and before the job had been agreed. I would not feel too keen about paying him for the work at the moment.

I imagine he will have got cash for the tree anyway.

Les

ScoobyWon't

Report him to plod for criminal damage to the tree and vehicles.

Glowplug

iTrader: (8)

I'd go for that one too

I cut a few down a few years ago as they where blocking sun light and had not been maintained in 10 years. Got arrested for crimanal damage and theft (as i dropped them in my yard), luckily it never got to court. But, a couple of weeks later my camper van was rattled canned, wonder who could of done that.

Just watch your back mate, neighbourhood disputes can get really petty and out of control.

PaulC72

Does the amount you were going to pay him cover the repair cost to the cars? if it does tell him to do one and use the money on the repairs. Say thanks a bunch to your neighbour and walk away. If it doesnt then contact his insurance.

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Keep it simple. Tell him the tree is down and that you would like him to make good the damage on the cars. Stick to what is indisputable.

billythekid

just looking at this from another angle - why would someone carry out work - for which they have not been paid - that they know the customer did not want doing - thus wont be getting paid.

Either he got the wrong end of the stick and thought you did instruct him to carry out the works - or maybe you were not clear that you were not 100% sure?

All sounds a bit odd to me.

Anyway, this is why a lot of people will now get a signed "order of works" or "job sheet" etc before they start work...

The Sheep Worrier

iTrader: (2)

As a self-employed plumber,i would not dream of entering a customers house/property to carry out any works regardless of wether i had been given the go-ahead or not,if they were not present at the property to confirm the required job and plan of payment. sounds to me that this fella was on a bit of a loose end this particular morning and was called off another job and thought, "**** i can go and drop that conifer at Tarmac Terror's place,i know the neighbour he's sound as and he'll be fine to speak on Tarmac's behalf and loose me in with me orange Husky and trailer and it'll be too late when its done he'll have to pay",
personally i wouldnt pay for it and go down the route of bolloking him and state theat he had not permission to enter the property as you were not present which is a crimminal offence. also as the boys said did he have public liablity?, had he carried out the proper Health and Safety procedure for doing the job etc i.e safety harness, did he use a ladder to do the job?(ladders are only allowed for access not to work off, unless the tree was under 6ft??) if not his public liabilty will be void, its also worth noting a lot of public liability covers do not cover weekend/out of hours work.
as said id not pay him for the job use the money to repair the cars and put it down to experience.
Good luck with sorting anyway
Rob :
p.s and dont trust that neighbou either sounds dodgy as **** to me!

what would scooby do

Sounds like your neighbour was on a commission..

53

iTrader: (41)

Does your neighbour know someone that lays drives too...I bet he does ! Pikey business model IMHO, tantamount to entrapment.

zip106

He needs a good birch - ing.

GMballistic

iTrader: (1)

"The neighbour, the tree surgeon, the damaged car, my conifer"........I thought this was going to be a joke ; but it's not .

Hope you get it sorted some how (maybe try citizens advice??)

bioforger

iTrader: (1)

Hangon damaged the cars??? some sawdust (not damage) n some tiny scratches is hardly alot of damage is it? Are we overreacting a tad here maybe? I would understand if he dropped the tree on the wing n hosed it or something, but this seems a bit ridiculous.

Jamz3k

send the lads around to sort him out, they may not have guns anymore but i hear they can do wonders with a cordless drill!

dpb

Youd scarce believe theres an impreza under there , let alone an mx5 !

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/...09_634x403.jpg

Kev_turbo

Idseally placed to make statements about another profession then

This is not a legal requirement - there are only 2 legally required insurances, they are employers and motor.

He might have clear felled it, why would you need a harness working off the ground?

Incorrect (in fact utter bollox!!), properly secured ladders can be worked from

Never seen this in 7 years of carrying public liability insurance - most tree surgeons carry 24/7 policies to cover call outs

You will no doubt find his liability insurance will have an excess of £1k or more, I would get a quote for returning the car back to it's previous condition and WRITE to the surgeon stating your case giving 7 days to reply. If it goes to court you will need to prove you gave the surgeon ample oportunity to rectify the situation. As for the incorrectly felled tree, again you could go to court and would be awarded the financial value of the tree or it's financial benefit to the property. A conifer close the the house is worth precisely f' all in most cases. If you do go for criminal damage ask the surgeon to provide the signed job card.

PaulC72

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

kev turbo

I legally have to have insurance / indemnity cover and it's not motor or employer

Shaun

Kev_turbo

what's your trade? Is it a LTD company?

Dedrater

My only advice, call the Police and state vandalism.

Kev, I work in the public sector and I have to have insurance by law (computers/law related)

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Kev

it's somewhere here.........the 1984 / 1986 Dentists Act

http://www.statutelaw.gov.uk/legResu...tDocId=1697973

Shaun

fast bloke

Take a different approach. If he can't provide proof that you asked him to cut down and dispose of the timber, report him to the police for theft. Did you know that if you trim your neighbours hedge that overhangs your property, you have to offer to give him the trimmings as they technically belong to him. At the same time, get his PI details and start a claim for damage to your cars, and make sure he knows that there is no chance you will ever pay him a penny. If this as you say it is, I think fair restitution would be that he pays you for the wood he will sell and pays to fix the damage to your cars.

(btw - I have a chainsaw and a wood burning stove. I can drop a tree on the desired spot 99 times from 100, but being able to make trees fall over in accordance with the laws of physics doesn't make me a tree surgeon. Try and find out if this guy is actually a tree surgeon or just someone with a chainsaw - Trading standards might be interested )

Dedrater

Tell you what TT, pm his legal notice and I will have a legal team rip it to bits, and a reply to send in return.

If damages can be claimed and are sought, you pay me 3% via Paypal for my time.

Dedrater

Forget the 3% bit, sounds a bit Nigerian, do this for **** all. Can be vouched for.

tony de wonderful

Sounds like some bad communication to me.

He should pay for the car damage though.

Leslie

Seems more like no communication, since he had not agreed the job beforehand.

Les

jods

+1 My thoughts exactly. On the face of it it could look like OP is trying to pull a fast one and get away without paying.

Minor scratching from leaves and dust?

Pay up man or you're really at risk of getting the reputation you deserve!