Thinking of moving the girlfriend in...? (Legalities)
20 October 2009, 04:26 AM
#1
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Thinking of moving the girlfriend in...? (Legalities)
I've got my own home with a mortgage and I am contemplating moving the girlfriend in with her two teenage brats aged 16 and 14.
The girlfriend will be leasing out her own home and then paying rent to me to live at mine but all bills and deeds etc will be in my name and she will not be paying upkeep for my property.
I was just wondering what would happen if the relationship was to break down further down the line i.e. would she be legally entitled to anything and where would I stand?
Cheers in advance.
The girlfriend will be leasing out her own home and then paying rent to me to live at mine but all bills and deeds etc will be in my name and she will not be paying upkeep for my property.
I was just wondering what would happen if the relationship was to break down further down the line i.e. would she be legally entitled to anything and where would I stand?
Cheers in advance.
Last edited by slagmagnet69; 21 October 2009 at 03:52 AM.
20 October 2009, 07:03 AM
#2
I guess that as time passes, she would accrue rights on much the same way as if you were married (one must not discriminate on these grounds).
I imagine that if the children are living in your house for a period of time, it would become their home and that may have implications that may not be to your advantage.
Any family lawyers out there?
I imagine that if the children are living in your house for a period of time, it would become their home and that may have implications that may not be to your advantage.
Any family lawyers out there?
20 October 2009, 08:08 AM
#4
If you want to protect yourself, it doesnt mean you are a mean person or anything like that its just prudence on your part.
You can see a solicitor and get a declaration of trust / trust deed, drawn up. Its an informal contract between yourself and your partner just outlining what she would be entitled too if you did split up.
You can be as generous as you wish.
I had one of these and after a 10 year relationship broke down it was the easiest way to settle our affairs. There was no bickering between the ex and I, however if there was this piece of paper would have sorted it all out.
The trust deed can cost anywhere from £300 - £50 depending on the solicitors you use.
You can see a solicitor and get a declaration of trust / trust deed, drawn up. Its an informal contract between yourself and your partner just outlining what she would be entitled too if you did split up.
You can be as generous as you wish.
I had one of these and after a 10 year relationship broke down it was the easiest way to settle our affairs. There was no bickering between the ex and I, however if there was this piece of paper would have sorted it all out.
The trust deed can cost anywhere from £300 - £50 depending on the solicitors you use.
20 October 2009, 08:10 AM
#5
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How much do you love this woman ? Will she contribute to bills / mortgage ?
I would serious seek legal advice before you do this. Its all nice and rosey now, but when the milk turns sour, its not unheard of guy's loosing homes !!!
SBK
I would serious seek legal advice before you do this. Its all nice and rosey now, but when the milk turns sour, its not unheard of guy's loosing homes !!!
SBK
20 October 2009, 08:43 AM
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There isn't Dave however after 2 years (and they wanted to reduce this and maybe have done) you do get rights.
It cost me 35k to get rid of my dad's girlfriend of 2 years after he passed away.
It cost me 35k to get rid of my dad's girlfriend of 2 years after he passed away.
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20 October 2009, 09:48 AM
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There is a lot of misunderstanding on this subject. I took some advice on this exact subject myself a few years ago - for the same reasons. This is what I was told.
Its also true that every case is different... but the basics are as follows.
Un married couples have NO right over each others property (including houses) - UNLESS:
1)Verbal Contract was formed to agree some kind of joint ownership.
2)Part payment for property by each party.
3)Contributions to upkeep / or similar.
To go into a bit more detail.
1) This is almost impossible to prove - and courts dont really like these.
But it can happen. Not often though.
2) Classic example, is G/F makes a contribution to the deposit on a house.
This can give her some ownership rights. You might have to "buy" her out if you split.
3) She might pay the rates and the elecy, you pay the gas and the Mortgage.
This can cause problems, lots of evidence to put before a court... might cost you a bit to buy her out again.
So, I was told - keep EVERYTHING in my name, gas, electricity, rates, TV licence. Even window cleaners. The whole lot. This way there is no ownership rights issues at all. If you buy something new e.g a new TV, it goes in your name. The only property she would be entitled too is the stuff she brings into the house when she moves in. If you split, she gets nothing else.
In the end we decided to go down the joint tenant route - we put both our names on the mortgage and had 50/50 share. I paid everything for the first couple of years as she had gone back to uni, but I was happy to do this. We had been together for 5 years at that point. Now, 12 years down the road, we own another house - and we pay everything out of our joint account. We are still not married.
Its also true that every case is different... but the basics are as follows.
Un married couples have NO right over each others property (including houses) - UNLESS:
1)Verbal Contract was formed to agree some kind of joint ownership.
2)Part payment for property by each party.
3)Contributions to upkeep / or similar.
To go into a bit more detail.
1) This is almost impossible to prove - and courts dont really like these.
But it can happen. Not often though.
2) Classic example, is G/F makes a contribution to the deposit on a house.
This can give her some ownership rights. You might have to "buy" her out if you split.
3) She might pay the rates and the elecy, you pay the gas and the Mortgage.
This can cause problems, lots of evidence to put before a court... might cost you a bit to buy her out again.
So, I was told - keep EVERYTHING in my name, gas, electricity, rates, TV licence. Even window cleaners. The whole lot. This way there is no ownership rights issues at all. If you buy something new e.g a new TV, it goes in your name. The only property she would be entitled too is the stuff she brings into the house when she moves in. If you split, she gets nothing else.
In the end we decided to go down the joint tenant route - we put both our names on the mortgage and had 50/50 share. I paid everything for the first couple of years as she had gone back to uni, but I was happy to do this. We had been together for 5 years at that point. Now, 12 years down the road, we own another house - and we pay everything out of our joint account. We are still not married.
20 October 2009, 09:57 AM
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Oops! Maybe I was just lucky then but the 'common-law' bit I knew was just urban myth. Sounds like billy has the answers.
Dave
20 October 2009, 10:00 AM
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We're missing the bigger picture here, people.
Have a look at the OP's user ID.
Mate, if that's accurate you shouldn't move in with ANY girl who you're dating!!!!
Have a look at the OP's user ID.
Mate, if that's accurate you shouldn't move in with ANY girl who you're dating!!!!
20 October 2009, 10:03 AM
#14
There is a lot of misunderstanding on this subject. I took some advice on this exact subject myself a few years ago - for the same reasons. This is what I was told.
Its also true that every case is different... but the basics are as follows.
Un married couples have NO right over each others property (including houses) - UNLESS:
1)Verbal Contract was formed to agree some kind of joint ownership.
2)Part payment for property by each party.
3)Contributions to upkeep / or similar.
To go into a bit more detail.
1) This is almost impossible to prove - and courts dont really like these.
But it can happen. Not often though.
2) Classic example, is G/F makes a contribution to the deposit on a house.
This can give her some ownership rights. You might have to "buy" her out if you split.
3) She might pay the rates and the elecy, you pay the gas and the Mortgage.
This can cause problems, lots of evidence to put before a court... might cost you a bit to buy her out again.
So, I was told - keep EVERYTHING in my name, gas, electricity, rates, TV licence. Even window cleaners. The whole lot. This way there is no ownership rights issues at all. If you buy something new e.g a new TV, it goes in your name. The only property she would be entitled too is the stuff she brings into the house when she moves in. If you split, she gets nothing else.
In the end we decided to go down the joint tenant route - we put both our names on the mortgage and had 50/50 share. I paid everything for the first couple of years as she had gone back to uni, but I was happy to do this. We had been together for 5 years at that point. Now, 12 years down the road, we own another house - and we pay everything out of our joint account. We are still not married.
Its also true that every case is different... but the basics are as follows.
Un married couples have NO right over each others property (including houses) - UNLESS:
1)Verbal Contract was formed to agree some kind of joint ownership.
2)Part payment for property by each party.
3)Contributions to upkeep / or similar.
To go into a bit more detail.
1) This is almost impossible to prove - and courts dont really like these.
But it can happen. Not often though.
2) Classic example, is G/F makes a contribution to the deposit on a house.
This can give her some ownership rights. You might have to "buy" her out if you split.
3) She might pay the rates and the elecy, you pay the gas and the Mortgage.
This can cause problems, lots of evidence to put before a court... might cost you a bit to buy her out again.
So, I was told - keep EVERYTHING in my name, gas, electricity, rates, TV licence. Even window cleaners. The whole lot. This way there is no ownership rights issues at all. If you buy something new e.g a new TV, it goes in your name. The only property she would be entitled too is the stuff she brings into the house when she moves in. If you split, she gets nothing else.
In the end we decided to go down the joint tenant route - we put both our names on the mortgage and had 50/50 share. I paid everything for the first couple of years as she had gone back to uni, but I was happy to do this. We had been together for 5 years at that point. Now, 12 years down the road, we own another house - and we pay everything out of our joint account. We are still not married.
I think you will find this may have some bearing on the matter.
20 October 2009, 10:22 AM
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We are talking about ownership rights to the property here are we not.
Assuming they are not joint tenants, or tenants in common this fact would make no difference to ownership of the property (assuming she does not make any contributions to upkeep etc etc etc as mentioned), also he is not the father, and one would assume he has no legal parental responsibility, although this is not mentioned, and as such I dont see how her or her children would have any ownership rights. But I might be wrong. If in doubt speak to a solicitor.
Assuming they are not joint tenants, or tenants in common this fact would make no difference to ownership of the property (assuming she does not make any contributions to upkeep etc etc etc as mentioned), also he is not the father, and one would assume he has no legal parental responsibility, although this is not mentioned, and as such I dont see how her or her children would have any ownership rights. But I might be wrong. If in doubt speak to a solicitor.
20 October 2009, 10:48 AM
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I think if she has kids and moves in with you, then they become your responsibility. If it all goes **** up, you could be the one who has to leave and she and the kids would get the house because they are minors. If that makes sense.
As for the common-law bit. Means nothing. Years ago, when I split with someone, I was told if we had been married it would have been easier to sort out. I was stitched up like a kipper.
As for the common-law bit. Means nothing. Years ago, when I split with someone, I was told if we had been married it would have been easier to sort out. I was stitched up like a kipper.
20 October 2009, 10:55 AM
#19
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Seems to me that if you are going to live together that you both should be prepared to accept some responsibility for each other during the relationship. Looking to see how much you can get away with should it fall apart even before you start it does not seem the best way of thinking from the beginning.
Les
Les
20 October 2009, 11:49 AM
#20
No such thing as Common law wife. If things break down in the relationship then she has no rights to your property, pension or income. This is as long as you don't marry her. Once she is out of the house, then you're home free
Last edited by andy97; 20 October 2009 at 11:57 AM.
20 October 2009, 11:49 AM
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Ah, the old Common Law thing. I think that under English Law the Common Law partnership isn't legally recognized when it comes to divvying up things when you split with a common law partner. I have a feeling it is recognized under Scottish Law however.
I thought there were/are things happening to change this, but I could be wrong, and I'm not sure if a civil partnership can be applied to a heterosexual couple, and if it can, again I'm not sure what legal standing that has, it could be the new phrase for common law.
As others have said, when kids come into the picture, things change, as I believe you cannot deprive the kids of a home and thus you'd either have to leave the house, or find them somewhere to live.
I thought there were/are things happening to change this, but I could be wrong, and I'm not sure if a civil partnership can be applied to a heterosexual couple, and if it can, again I'm not sure what legal standing that has, it could be the new phrase for common law.
As others have said, when kids come into the picture, things change, as I believe you cannot deprive the kids of a home and thus you'd either have to leave the house, or find them somewhere to live.
20 October 2009, 02:23 PM
#23
I am no expert, however if the children live there and go to school locally and buy a pet cat etc etc....
I would not be overly surprised if a judge took the view that they had a right to live their until they reached maturity (or longer if they go to University) and that it might not be possible to sell the "family" home until then.
As I say, I am no expert on the matter, but this is the sort of area that may well be of interest to the OP as well as the issues you have mentioned regarding property rights.
It would certainly be an issue if the couple were married, and the law might take the view of "why should the childrens rights be affected by the marital status of their carers?"
I would not be overly surprised if a judge took the view that they had a right to live their until they reached maturity (or longer if they go to University) and that it might not be possible to sell the "family" home until then.
As I say, I am no expert on the matter, but this is the sort of area that may well be of interest to the OP as well as the issues you have mentioned regarding property rights.
It would certainly be an issue if the couple were married, and the law might take the view of "why should the childrens rights be affected by the marital status of their carers?"
20 October 2009, 03:59 PM
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