Neil Smalley

Thanks to some ill informed judge it's now illegal(in theory) to import DVD's from abroad.

Full story at http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/23814.html

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[Edited by Neil Smalley - 1/24/2002 6:45:37 PM]

Mr.Cookie

Wonder whose pocket he was in [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] bunch of (oops i said the C word) [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

Katana

The judge must have been a drunken heroin addict to make that kind of judgement. I normally import most of my games from the US because of the stupid release date difference between the US and the UK. Besides, it also works out a tad bit cheaper to do so.

I say they can make the law, but lets see how they're going to enforce it...

Neil Smalley

They will if the importers refuse to ship to the UK, because it's illegal.

Markus

WTF! so, I can long longer legally purchase a dvd from dvdboxoffice if it's not region 2!!!!!

What about purchasing DVDs whilst in the USA and bringing them back into the UK? this illegal too?

going to have a chat with dvdboxoffice and see what they think about this.

This is total and utter madness! This has major implications for everyone with a dvd player, espeically if it is, or can be made, via a handset 'hack' region free.

I have built up my libray of dvds from region 1 titles. why?

1) they are cheaper
2) they are titles not available in the UK
3) they have additional material that is not present on UK release
4) other reasons I can't think of at the moment.

Does this judge realise that he has just cost many dvd companies a massive amount of money? for example, how many of you use dvdboxoffice to by dvds? I do, and at least 10 of the people I know do, and I'm not talking about one dvd every month, these guys buy 95 percent of thier dvd's from dvdboxoffice.

madness.

[Edited by Markus - 1/24/2002 7:35:58 PM]

Little Miss WRX

That idiot could easily get a managerial job where I work [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

Markus

So, what can we, the consumers do about this? where's a pettion I can sign?

So, what action would I face for importing a region 1 dvd? confiscation of goods? a fine? jail time?

they **** with our motoring (speed camera's et al), now they are ******* with our relaxation, mad, mad, mad!

Ian Cook

Doesnt really change anything ! its always been naughty to import Region 1 DVD ! thats why they have regional encoding ! The ruling was on mod chips for PS2's not DVD's !

I will still order from USA until they stop shipping !

Markus

FYI - just submitted this info to slashdot, let's see what they make of it.

Luke

Good .all that filth and violence....

God save the Queen


just because America lets us lick their *** doesnt mean they want us to share with them

Shark

A job in the muppet show Michelle ?

[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] Rant mode here - WTF are sony on about - they produce a game and charge for it - fair enough, we all need to make a profit, but what does it matter where in the world that game ends up? It's about price fixing again [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

David


[Edited by Shark - 1/24/2002 8:14:28 PM]

Markus

It's all about markets.

here's the problem.

You live in the UK, you buy a game from japan. Sony Japan gets the money Sony UK does not.

therein lies the problem for sony, profit lost from one division.

bloody corporates.

upon reading stuff it seems we may have jumped the gun a little with regards to dvds, though, if I remember correctly some PS2 games are DVD's or come on DVD media, thus does that not make them DVD's?

GranTurismo

The key thing is that games and videos are "licened" for use in a specific environment. For instance you are not allowed to show a film and charge people to see it, you cant show them on oil rigs and hospitals either. The producer currently has the right to state how the media can be used. The thing is this is limited to music film games etc. You can expect a certain car maker would love it if it was illegal to imprt thier vehicles outside thier teritory!!. So the judge is right, its in theory illegal to view region one DVD outside USA. I am not saying I agree with this however!

Its interesting to not that **** is usually region free (I am told) so they obviously have a different attituse to ...er... Penetraiting the world market? Also In theory we should be able to buy any product that is for sale in the EU, so Ill have some hardcore **** and a big box of hash please, oh yes and **** for 20p.

Katana

Nah they just make it f*****g difficult for you to use it on the road. They start off with making you wait 3 months for the SVA test (this is after you pay them the 200++ option instead of the 125 quid). Then they'll complain that you filled out the wrong customs clearance form, next they tell you that your exhaust is 10mm too long and has to be cut before they give you your SVA cert which by the way you did a crap job. At the end of it you've ended up spending almost a grand waiting for the car because you had to commute to Reading every day using public transport.

To top it all up, because you waited over three months when you were given 2 months by the insurance company, you lost one helluva deal on your insurance where you end up paying 1100 (the cheapest after no insurance company is willing to cover a 24 year old) instead of the 800 quid. Oh yeah, in the process of changing my dials, I've also no have a defunct fuel gauge. [/rant]

GavinP

Maybe Tescos will be the people to take up the battle - I think I read somewhere that they were looking at legal action regarding regional coding on DVDs... ?

Thanks

Gavin

ScoobyJawa

Didn't the article say illegal to play on your PC and about the PS2, didn't really comment on multi region DVD players............

Neil Smalley

The key point is, is that chipping a player to be multi region is illegal as well [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

I guess it's a case of wait and see.

zoog

If they are so bothered about divisional profit problems due to imports then the answer is logically to synchronise release dates and level the relative prices and the importation would no longer be necessary by the poor long suffering ripped off consumer. The companies would save on legal bills to boot.

The hypocrisy of multinationals is apalling: they bang on about the benefits of globalisation but as long as it's on their terms and retaining parochial regional market restrictions for the consumer - PAH!

All power to the pirates/filesharers I say, I'm just downloading LOTR from morpheus.

Dave P

Ahhh the joys of free trade

ScoobyJawa

Hmm if thats the case then you'd be fine if you bought a player that was multi region without a hack or chip as many are these days..... the key is where they aim it at - the media/hardware or the importing of said media. Be interesting to see what happens and if consumers take it lying down (but they usually do [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] )

Markus

ok, so chipping a player is illegal, but what about using a handset hack? is that illegal too? can't see how as it's not using any other hardware.

logiclee

It has always been illegal to sell region 1 DVD's in this country as well as selling multiregion players. So far though, it has not been illegal to own them.

Lee

mutant_matt

Guys,

What the ruling means is that it is illegal for a company to sell the mod chips in this country. That's all - nothing more. It has no (direct) bearing on the use of Region 1 DVD's in this country and it is still not illegal to buy these from overseas and import (as long as they are not of a type of content which customs would sieze ( )). It is (and always has been) illegal to sell in this country any video material (VHS, Laserdic, DVD etc.) which has not been certified by the BBFC (British Board of Film Classification). It is not illegal per se to sell Region 1 DVD's in this country, but it is really because they are not BBFC certified.

Therefore, purchasing from another country means neither the buyer or the seller is breaking any laws. Well, not quite. Technically, the terms of licence that you accept when you purchase a DVD from say the US say that it is not covered by the contract of sale for you to use the DVD outside of the US. OK, so technically, you are breaking US law - tough ( ), they can't do anything about it 'cos US law doesn't have any power over us in the UK ( ).

Bottom line is, the Trading Standards *may* start clamping down on sales of mod chips (for either the PS or any other DVD player) but I seriously doubt it. What is more likely is that the big boys like Sony will start going after the manufactures (like in this case) and the supplies of these chips might dry up.

At the end of the day, it's in the interest of the player manufactures to allow their players (somehow) to play all regions because not many people are going to buy a player which can't play other regions ( R1 in particular ). Sony are in an interesting postion as they both make players and sell titles.....

Anyway, that's my take on it. It's a very similar situation to the Laserdisc fiasco of 1995 which just pushed the sale of these products overseas to some country that isn't gonna give a toss about a company making/selling these kinds of devices.

Ta,

Matt

logiclee

Matt,

I remeber the Laserdisc problem, I think it was Laser Enterprises that were raided, local Audio store had shopped them for selling non BBFC (ie NTSC) Laserdiscs, nearly put them out of buisness.

I think offshore on-line companies like Play247 should be OK, UK based modders such as Techtronics may have more of a problem if they intend to crack down.

Makes you laugh that the Far Eastern manufactures are more or less using the ease of making their players multi-region a selling point.

Lee

[Edited by logiclee - 1/25/2002 7:19:03 PM]

mutant_matt

Lee,

It wans't just them - a whole bunch of UK Laserdisc suppliers got raided One of them was a friend of mine.....

It was all spurred on by Sony, Universal and Pioneer in the run up to the US LaserDisc release of Jarassic Park on NTSC (THX certified). Everybody wanted the US versoin as they knew it would pi$$ all over the PAL release (6 months later).

Sony/Universal/Pioneer knew this so started complaining to the local Trading Standards offices about the UK suppliers, TS had previously turned a blind eye to it. After all, it's not like they're breaking an important law is it? (selling non BBFC approved versoins of films (they would have argued **** but in reality, in the main it's just normal films like the DVD market is now)).

The Trading Standards then closed down a bunch of suppliers and that was when the offshore, Internet based businesses started springing up.....

Trouble is, like I said, with the big boys going after the chip manufactures, down the line, we *may* be in trouble. The Remote control hack type DVD players may become our only hope.....

Matt

AndyC_772

iTrader: (2)

I've just started a thread on this subject over on The Dvd Forums. It's one of the major discussion boards for DVDs, and imported DVDs in particular.

Let's treat this case as a wake-up call to actually do something rather than just moaning about it. We all quite rightly don't want to be ripped off every time we want to see a movie. It's a worrying trend; what if I buy a pair of branded jeans in the US and then get them confiscated by Customs as I enter the UK "because the label isn't licensed for use outside the US"? It's the same issue. What then for free trade?

Suggestions for what to do:

- write to your MP or MEP
- get in touch with the Campaign for Digital Rights at http://uk.eurorights.org/
- encourage your friends to do the same, you must know someone with a multi-region DVD player that doesn't read Scoobynet.

Andy.

tiggers

Calm down calm down (putting on my best Scouse accent)

This is not really news. There have been many cases over the last few years regarding importing of DVD's, games, electronics. Some have gone one way, some have gone the other. At the end of the day it's a massive grey area and not one that any goverment department wants to really nail down due to the complexity of the issues.

Suffice to say I know of a company who import Region 1 DVD's and sell them in the UK mail order. They have been visited by the local trading standards office who basically told them to get on with it as they weren't bothered so long as they weren't selling copied discs (in fact the guy asked them to chip his player!!!).

So as you can see - nothing is clear.

Regards,

tiggers.

logiclee

Matt,

Yeh remember it better now. I've sold most of my Laserdiscs but still have about 50 and have still got a Pioneer 925 player. A few dscs have suffered disc rot over the last ten years or so.

Another option if they crack down on chip suppliers would be to have two DVD players, a region 2 player and an import american region 1 player. I've actually gone down this route myself and don't have to worry about the RCE or future regional coding problems.
As long as you can get the discs into the country there should always be a way of playing them.

Cheers
Lee

Robertio

iTrader: (1)

Like Lee I've got a region one DVD player, but rather than buy a UK one as well, I got mine modified to play region 2 discs, so should always be able to play import discs, sort of shows where my disc buying loyalties lay

logiclee

Robertio,

After buying a number of players from Techtronics for friends and family I also had my region 1 Toshiba modified for multi-region.
The region 2 player is a cheapo with a handset hack that has worked well up to now. The region 2 player now sits in separate room as I use the Toshiba's component output in my main setup.

Back in the Laserdisc days when we were paying anything from £25 for a disc less than two hours, around £35 for a film over two hours and £70 for a special edition there were loads more horror stories and judgements kicking around. I don't think they will be able to stop the massive on-line trade unless a new law is passed to make it illegal to own none bbfc approved material and that would involve a massive cost to enforce and police.

Lee