UK then and now
10 December 2007, 03:23 PM
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UK then and now
Chap leaves in 1987 and moves back now. Here are his thoughts. You'll agree with a number of them.
[Love the comment about Paris vs London tube drivers!]
Jon Henley on his return to London after 20 years abroad | Special reports | Guardian Unlimited
[Love the comment about Paris vs London tube drivers!]
Jon Henley on his return to London after 20 years abroad | Special reports | Guardian Unlimited
10 December 2007, 03:43 PM
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Not the UK then and now, more like London. Which Ive not had to live in another country 20 years to notice. The place is a dump.
p.s. Good read though
p.s. Good read though
10 December 2007, 04:01 PM
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10 December 2007, 04:16 PM
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10 December 2007, 04:18 PM
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Acton of all places where I was born and bread, would'nt want to live there now the place sadly is a **** hole, thats why I moved away but sadly he is so right.
Cheers
Colin
Cheers
Colin
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11 December 2007, 12:33 PM
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I would not even want to visit London any more, let alone live in it!
Very interesting to read I must say, his observations seem to be pretty honest to me. Like him I don't like all the Americanisms creeping in which actually make the person using them sound as thick as the two short planks!
I am just glad I live out in the sticks surrounded by people who have still got their British identity and the immigrants that we do have who are so polite and helpful.
Les
Very interesting to read I must say, his observations seem to be pretty honest to me. Like him I don't like all the Americanisms creeping in which actually make the person using them sound as thick as the two short planks!
I am just glad I live out in the sticks surrounded by people who have still got their British identity and the immigrants that we do have who are so polite and helpful.
Les
11 December 2007, 02:19 PM
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Posted this elsewhere, but think it applys to this thread better.
This is my opinion,
We British are a nation that love taking in other peoples culture. For example when we go abroad, what’s the first thing we do? Buy a stupid straw hat like the locals wear, try the local beer and wine. Pop out in the evening in our sandals and straw hat to try the local cuisine. And we have very much grown attached to these cultures as shows when walking down any high street in Britain, restaurants of all nationalities lined up for us to choose from.
So I think what we find hard to accept, is the people that come into Britain and are given the rights to live here but have no intention of taking part in the British way of life at all. They arrive in this country, don’t speak English, and have no intention of trying to learn this language. Have children through the NHS, don’t teach them English, as they expect the schools at age 5 to teach them. Hide away from the rest of the country behind restricting non-British religious vales and head scarves. The only British thing about these individuals is the documentation they have obtained with the words ‘British Citizen’.
British my ****!
They don’t want to be British, they are simply living here to have a better quality of life. Fair play though, life’s to short to have a **** one, but I would expect that if this country was up to their expectations, (and I would imagine it would, otherwise they would move back right?) then they could show some gratitude towards us and try to embrace us a little instead of making the barrier between us taller.
Now its not just them to blame, the government recognise this problem, but instead of trying to reach out to these individuals and telling them how great it is to be British and giving them opportunities to try it in their communities, they do the opposite, and try to make Britain more like them. Trying to give us the impression they are being British without them actually having to change a thing.
This is the ripple effect that is slowly destroying the British culture. The government wants them to fit in so much into our multi-ethnic and diverse community they are willing to change the British way of life to do so.
Regards,
SetoN
This is my opinion,
We British are a nation that love taking in other peoples culture. For example when we go abroad, what’s the first thing we do? Buy a stupid straw hat like the locals wear, try the local beer and wine. Pop out in the evening in our sandals and straw hat to try the local cuisine. And we have very much grown attached to these cultures as shows when walking down any high street in Britain, restaurants of all nationalities lined up for us to choose from.
So I think what we find hard to accept, is the people that come into Britain and are given the rights to live here but have no intention of taking part in the British way of life at all. They arrive in this country, don’t speak English, and have no intention of trying to learn this language. Have children through the NHS, don’t teach them English, as they expect the schools at age 5 to teach them. Hide away from the rest of the country behind restricting non-British religious vales and head scarves. The only British thing about these individuals is the documentation they have obtained with the words ‘British Citizen’.
British my ****!
They don’t want to be British, they are simply living here to have a better quality of life. Fair play though, life’s to short to have a **** one, but I would expect that if this country was up to their expectations, (and I would imagine it would, otherwise they would move back right?) then they could show some gratitude towards us and try to embrace us a little instead of making the barrier between us taller.
Now its not just them to blame, the government recognise this problem, but instead of trying to reach out to these individuals and telling them how great it is to be British and giving them opportunities to try it in their communities, they do the opposite, and try to make Britain more like them. Trying to give us the impression they are being British without them actually having to change a thing.
This is the ripple effect that is slowly destroying the British culture. The government wants them to fit in so much into our multi-ethnic and diverse community they are willing to change the British way of life to do so.
Regards,
SetoN
17 December 2007, 10:59 AM
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Posted this elsewhere, but think it applys to this thread better.
This is my opinion,
We British are a nation that love taking in other peoples culture. For example when we go abroad, what’s the first thing we do? Buy a stupid straw hat like the locals wear, try the local beer and wine. Pop out in the evening in our sandals and straw hat to try the local cuisine. And we have very much grown attached to these cultures as shows when walking down any high street in Britain, restaurants of all nationalities lined up for us to choose from.
So I think what we find hard to accept, is the people that come into Britain and are given the rights to live here but have no intention of taking part in the British way of life at all. They arrive in this country, don’t speak English, and have no intention of trying to learn this language. Have children through the NHS, don’t teach them English, as they expect the schools at age 5 to teach them. Hide away from the rest of the country behind restricting non-British religious vales and head scarves. The only British thing about these individuals is the documentation they have obtained with the words ‘British Citizen’.
British my ****!
They don’t want to be British, they are simply living here to have a better quality of life. Fair play though, life’s to short to have a **** one, but I would expect that if this country was up to their expectations, (and I would imagine it would, otherwise they would move back right?) then they could show some gratitude towards us and try to embrace us a little instead of making the barrier between us taller.
Now its not just them to blame, the government recognise this problem, but instead of trying to reach out to these individuals and telling them how great it is to be British and giving them opportunities to try it in their communities, they do the opposite, and try to make Britain more like them. Trying to give us the impression they are being British without them actually having to change a thing.
This is the ripple effect that is slowly destroying the British culture. The government wants them to fit in so much into our multi-ethnic and diverse community they are willing to change the British way of life to do so.
Regards,
SetoN
This is my opinion,
We British are a nation that love taking in other peoples culture. For example when we go abroad, what’s the first thing we do? Buy a stupid straw hat like the locals wear, try the local beer and wine. Pop out in the evening in our sandals and straw hat to try the local cuisine. And we have very much grown attached to these cultures as shows when walking down any high street in Britain, restaurants of all nationalities lined up for us to choose from.
So I think what we find hard to accept, is the people that come into Britain and are given the rights to live here but have no intention of taking part in the British way of life at all. They arrive in this country, don’t speak English, and have no intention of trying to learn this language. Have children through the NHS, don’t teach them English, as they expect the schools at age 5 to teach them. Hide away from the rest of the country behind restricting non-British religious vales and head scarves. The only British thing about these individuals is the documentation they have obtained with the words ‘British Citizen’.
British my ****!
They don’t want to be British, they are simply living here to have a better quality of life. Fair play though, life’s to short to have a **** one, but I would expect that if this country was up to their expectations, (and I would imagine it would, otherwise they would move back right?) then they could show some gratitude towards us and try to embrace us a little instead of making the barrier between us taller.
Now its not just them to blame, the government recognise this problem, but instead of trying to reach out to these individuals and telling them how great it is to be British and giving them opportunities to try it in their communities, they do the opposite, and try to make Britain more like them. Trying to give us the impression they are being British without them actually having to change a thing.
This is the ripple effect that is slowly destroying the British culture. The government wants them to fit in so much into our multi-ethnic and diverse community they are willing to change the British way of life to do so.
Regards,
SetoN
17 December 2007, 11:02 AM
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Very true & SetoN's post hits the nail squarly on it head!
17 December 2007, 11:04 AM
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Rubbish, how many people in the UK do you know that dont speak English in this country? And how the fek do you know if they have no intention of learning? Do you speak their language and asked them? I very much doubt it. How many English have moved to Spain and think everything should be done the British way? You talk **** and are so narrow minded its hard to believe. 
17 December 2007, 11:45 AM
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The amazing thing is, this article came from a person who lived in Paris!!??!!
And that is some real perspective, as I'm sure many will agree with the state of Paris is best to be described as in the same state as the waste pipe outlet on a toilet macerator.
On a side note: For what its worth...I speak Spanish and I don't even live there (yet)
I am of the opinion that English people who want residencia in a Spain have to prove that they have a basic grasp of the lingo. It's not hard. Afterall part of escaping the UK is to get away from these inbreds, not to move into a shoddily built box crammed with thousands of jolly Englanders moaning about it being too hot, everyone speaking Spanish and not being able to smoke inside the local bar anymore 
:
But if you take what Dave implies that because the ignorant British buffoons that do move to Spain to create their liitle Englands (which is ruining the country), it means it fine and dandy for this to be allowed in the UK?? I don't think so. When it comes to a stage that civil buildings end up having signs in every language under the sun as with goverenment funded information leaflets. Some of which don't seem to even use the same alphabetical symbols (it ain't Greek either
). How did that happen?; would it be that we (the UK) are supporting people who live here that cannot read/speak English and have no intentions in doing so?
To make matters worse; Ok the NHS has signs plastered in alternate languages on its buildings, as do our community centres, clinics and schools.
But can you get a self-assesment tax return form in Urdu or Polish? That's actually quite difficult. Great, so the buggers have a ligitimate excuse to avoid it because they don't understand the lingo. Chin up though...at least its all available in Welsh
And that is some real perspective, as I'm sure many will agree with the state of Paris is best to be described as in the same state as the waste pipe outlet on a toilet macerator.
On a side note: For what its worth...I speak Spanish and I don't even live there (yet)
I am of the opinion that English people who want residencia in a Spain have to prove that they have a basic grasp of the lingo. It's not hard. Afterall part of escaping the UK is to get away from these inbreds, not to move into a shoddily built box crammed with thousands of jolly Englanders moaning about it being too hot, everyone speaking Spanish and not being able to smoke inside the local bar anymore :But if you take what Dave implies that because the ignorant British buffoons that do move to Spain to create their liitle Englands (which is ruining the country), it means it fine and dandy for this to be allowed in the UK?? I don't think so. When it comes to a stage that civil buildings end up having signs in every language under the sun as with goverenment funded information leaflets. Some of which don't seem to even use the same alphabetical symbols (it ain't Greek either
). How did that happen?; would it be that we (the UK) are supporting people who live here that cannot read/speak English and have no intentions in doing so?To make matters worse; Ok the NHS has signs plastered in alternate languages on its buildings, as do our community centres, clinics and schools.
But can you get a self-assesment tax return form in Urdu or Polish? That's actually quite difficult. Great, so the buggers have a ligitimate excuse to avoid it because they don't understand the lingo. Chin up though...at least its all available in Welsh
Last edited by Shark Man; 17 December 2007 at 11:50 AM.
17 December 2007, 11:55 AM
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Speaking Spanish or not, when you go to a resteraunt in Spain you'll still end up reading the English part of the Menu, its natural as its your first language. Why should you worry that we print something in other languages? I dont understand all this, we're losing who we are, no we're not, we're just sharing what we have. Anyway, were all in it together arnt we? Being born in a different country doesnt make you different. Well, unless your Scottish
17 December 2007, 12:20 PM
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I worry that there are more people like some of the above around tbh Kimmy. 
But thanks anyway
But thanks anyway
Last edited by davegtt; 17 December 2007 at 12:28 PM.
17 December 2007, 12:29 PM
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You'd be amazed now - Acton has been one of the hottest property areas in London. Go off the main high st (which I agree is awful) and wander around some of the big estates - Acton has one of the highest concentrations of £1M+ houses in London!
Good article BTW
17 December 2007, 12:41 PM
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Yeah but Chris when I lived there we lived in a bloody tower block half a mile in the sky
Thankfully my parants bought a house out in Heston what a culture shock that was, I know what you say about the house's my nan (god bless her) had a beautiful house there and they knocked it down as part of the A40 reconstuction which never took place in the end because of funding, the funny thing was I took my youngest son back there some years back and his face was a picture
Cheers
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17 December 2007, 12:42 PM
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Thats a bad thing is it?
Speaking Spanish or not, when you go to a resteraunt in Spain you'll still end up reading the English part of the Menu, its natural as its your first language. Why should you worry that we print something in other languages? I dont understand all this, we're losing who we are, no we're not, we're just sharing what we have. Anyway, were all in it together arnt we? Being born in a different country doesnt make you different. Well, unless your Scottish
Speaking Spanish or not, when you go to a resteraunt in Spain you'll still end up reading the English part of the Menu, its natural as its your first language. Why should you worry that we print something in other languages? I dont understand all this, we're losing who we are, no we're not, we're just sharing what we have. Anyway, were all in it together arnt we? Being born in a different country doesnt make you different. Well, unless your Scottish
Communication is one of the most basic but also most needed requirements in any society. Granted flexibility should adpoted to assist newcommers, yet at the same time a firm system needs to be inplace that prevents these people setting up home in a foreign country, and this requirement is currently not corectly implemented or enforced in the UK.
The current system is so backwards that it deters people from making ligitmate resident applications and promotes people to side step the system completely. The tests involved in residency do promote English and "Britishness", but its so badly implemented that it only affects the ligitimate people who would learn English and will integrate into out society anyway, who are more than welcome. The people we don't want (akin to the Jolly Englander in Spain) quite happily and easily bypasses the system and meanders their way through this country annoying every other legitimate permanent resident. And their life is made even more easy by adopting their languages, when it should be the reverse.
For example, in Spain in a non-tourist area the Menu won't have English. A typical bar won't even have a Menu! Not helped when the waiters will speak different dialects just to wind me up
(Seems that even speaking plain Spanish is not enough for the Catalans. ) The result is I HAVE to speak and read the language - it is the only option. Whereas in other areas where English is adopted to appease the ignorant immigrants, I probably could easily get by without learning a single word of Spanish. And in turth, I probably wouldn't bother learning it either. Not very good for integrating into a new country.
17 December 2007, 12:52 PM
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Alot of people who need to speak English do. Why does it matter if people don't? Do you personally get affected by people's non speaking of english? I mean really get effected by it on a day to day basis?
17 December 2007, 12:57 PM
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Not ours? Whos is it? All we're doing is communicating in extra languages, do we have to be different from the rest of the world, being awkward just so we can say we are different? Whats naive about coming up with the idea of having a sign printed in different languages? Whats so wrong about people not speaking our language anyway, does it effect you in any way what so ever? I was playing darts with a guy yesterday whos only words in English was yes and one. We managed to communicate ok and have a laugh, ok it helps I know a little Polish but generally we didnt use much language, oh and he bought a few of us 4 beers and wouldnt let us buy him one back lol
I like the bit where you say
Yet you state earlier that people dont speak English and have no desire to do so, how do you know this? Do you speak to these people and find out if theyre either a new comer or have any intent? I listen to loads of people speak Polish to each other all the time, yet they speak English and will talk English, just you hear them speaking Polish to other Polish people. Just like in Spain for example, you meet someone from England, you speak English, do you think the Spanish who over hear you think Ignorant English, in Spain, speaking English blah blah blah.
I wouldnt say we are adopting their language, just with the increase of population from other countries we're making more of an effort to integrate with them too.
LOL I know what you mean though regarding the Catalans, quite a funny bunch over there.
Fair play to you for making an effort though
lol I like the bit where you say
Granted flexibility should adpoted to assist newcommers
I wouldnt say we are adopting their language, just with the increase of population from other countries we're making more of an effort to integrate with them too.
LOL I know what you mean though regarding the Catalans, quite a funny bunch over there.
Fair play to you for making an effort though
17 December 2007, 12:57 PM
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I'm all for living in a multicultural society and would not class my self as narrow minded or a rascist. I do feel however that the immigration policies in this country now are too relaxed.
At this point i would like it noted that in my opinion the Influx of imigrant's during the 50's and 60's from former British Colony's contributed Britain greatly in so many ways . I also feel that there is a genuine need for skilled migrant worker's in the u.k at the moment, but in my opinion it has become all to easy for thousands of unskilled Eastern European's to relocate to the U.K. The strain that is beiing put on the NHS and the Education service's is plain to see. I'm not saying we should close our border's. However i do feel stricter measure's need to be in place to ensure that the immigrant's that we offer residency to have sufficient profesional skills and sufficent language skills to enable them to carry out there chosen proffesion in the u.k.
At this point i would like it noted that in my opinion the Influx of imigrant's during the 50's and 60's from former British Colony's contributed Britain greatly in so many ways . I also feel that there is a genuine need for skilled migrant worker's in the u.k at the moment, but in my opinion it has become all to easy for thousands of unskilled Eastern European's to relocate to the U.K. The strain that is beiing put on the NHS and the Education service's is plain to see. I'm not saying we should close our border's. However i do feel stricter measure's need to be in place to ensure that the immigrant's that we offer residency to have sufficient profesional skills and sufficent language skills to enable them to carry out there chosen proffesion in the u.k.
17 December 2007, 12:59 PM
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17 December 2007, 01:10 PM
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I'm all for living in a multicultural society and would not class my self as narrow minded or a rascist. I do feel however that the immigration policies in this country now are too relaxed.
At this point i would like it noted that in my opinion the Influx of imigrant's during the 50's and 60's from former British Colony's contributed Britain greatly in so many ways . I also feel that there is a genuine need for skilled migrant worker's in the u.k at the moment, but in my opinion it has become all to easy for thousands of unskilled Eastern European's to relocate to the U.K. The strain that is beiing put on the NHS and the Education service's is plain to see. I'm not saying we should close our border's. However i do feel stricter measure's need to be in place to ensure that the immigrant's that we offer residency to have sufficient profesional skills and sufficent language skills to enable them to carry out there chosen proffesion in the u.k.
At this point i would like it noted that in my opinion the Influx of imigrant's during the 50's and 60's from former British Colony's contributed Britain greatly in so many ways . I also feel that there is a genuine need for skilled migrant worker's in the u.k at the moment, but in my opinion it has become all to easy for thousands of unskilled Eastern European's to relocate to the U.K. The strain that is beiing put on the NHS and the Education service's is plain to see. I'm not saying we should close our border's. However i do feel stricter measure's need to be in place to ensure that the immigrant's that we offer residency to have sufficient profesional skills and sufficent language skills to enable them to carry out there chosen proffesion in the u.k.
Agree to al of the baove
Also add to this that they can prove who they are and that background checks do not turn them up as criminals.
Health checks as well would be a good idea, with an already broke NHS we cannot aond should not take on more problems.