michaelro

On my way home this evening in slow moving traffic.

I steered round a drain when a bike overtaking came past.

The bike came from quite a way back and I'll admit I didn't see him.

He avoided me, but if he hit me or I steered into him while overtaking whose fault would it be?

Snazy

I think the wording says it itself.
While the bike should be taking care overtaking, but in turn you should be checking your mirrors before swerving.

In reality, some bikers take WAY too many chances and are a pain in the fricki ****!

Varboy

Your fault.

His speed, if proven excessive, would be contributory negligence.

I can see why you're asking though, as it sounds as if you were trying to avoid an obstacle ie an emergency situation.

I think a solicitor would argue that even though you did not have time to check, only react, that you should have been aware of what was around you. It is interesting though, my wife is a Personal Injury lawyer, I'll ask her (but she's napping at the moment)

michaelro

Thought it probably would be my fault - Just wasn't sure about the law regarding bikes and the road.

He was completely on the other side of the road and then veered into the single lane just in front of my car.

David Lock

The bloke who put the drain in badly

powerman1

the drain is a obstacle that you should have seen in advance and as such you could have slowed down and used your mirrors before swerving.hard pill to swallow but i think thats how it would go in court if you had knocked him off...bluddy bikes

davegtt

And to the bike the car is an unexpected obsticle. as would be a pedestrian infront of the car on the pavement.

Its not 1 rule for one and another for everybody else.

daddyscoob

funny this should come up cos I've spent several days disagreeing with a mate who has never been a biker whereas I used to ride motorbikes up to middle of last year.

He claimed it's illegal for bikes to ride up the outside of slow moving or stationary traffic. I stated I did this all the time as any biker would od - advantage of being on two wheels.

I ended the argument by printing of pages from the online highway code which proved me right

So yes would be your fault - check those mirrors.........

fatherpierre

Driver's fault.

No question.

powerman1

drains dont suddenly swerve in front of you where as the car did

Odds on

Bikes only filter at 5mph faster than the traffic. Thats enough time for him to stop, or if you did hit him, to not seriously harm him. (which would be considered your fault)

If their going faster than that, then you'd have a pretty good arguement.

Also remember that bikers do not have right of way when filtering. Or at any time for that matter. If your stuck in traffic and indicate with plenty of notice then one rides into the side of you, you should help them, but not think your at fault.

davegtt

No, exactly. So bikers should be more aware of something that is in front of them thats capable of moving unexpectedly

:

fatherpierre

He was overtaking, not filtering, according to the 1st post.

Depends how slow the traffic was. Filtering suggest more than one lane in one direction.

Odds on

In a slow moving traffic situation, I'm sure that's classed as filtering through the traffic.

Obviously if you wish to ride down the outside of a row of slow moving traffic at speed, then you can't complain if someone tags you. Same as if a car driver sits up someones **** and hits an obstacle in the road that they didn't see.

fatherpierre

In any case, he was at fault by his own admission of not checking mirrors.

Many a biker would have kicked his wing mirror off.

davegtt

Cause theyre t\/\/ats in their own right sometimes....

Before I get infracted, can I point out that it was fatherpierre who catagorised you all by saying you'd kick wing mirrors off so Im not lumping you all in the same boat.

Odds on

Oh, so now we have to consider damage to wheel or vigilantly bike rider kicking mirror off.

How the hell can the Police think that's OK?

As I said before, car drivers don't need to feel responsible for bike riders.

fatherpierre

LOL.

I agree - a few bikers give the majority an really bad name.

Alas, I have experience of scraping many squashed/smashed/ripped apart bikers from the roads of London. 95% of the time it was shown that the poor, dead ******'s death was their own fault.

There was one a couple of months back that was bent backwards - he was unmarked other than his body had been snapped in two. That was down to him riding a very high powered bike and ignoring a lorry indicating right. Oh, and he was estimated at doing 95 in a 30. Mad

Odds on

Working in London you must see that 95% of bikers think that they have right of way!!

Its not good when someone gets hurt whoevers fault it is

fatherpierre

I agree.

But they do kick wing mirrors off on the odd occasion.

Most bikers are very good on the road and realise they're not bullet proof.

davegtt

Exactly. We are all on the road, 2 wheels or 4. are the rules different? I think not. If your going to overtake the then onus is on you

fatherpierre

Cyclist, my friend. Cyclists.

They are the ones that require the education.

It's a daily thing to see 3/4/5 hurt cyclists, or hurt pedestrians from idiot cyclists. Mainly idiots that think there's no highway code relating to them. Then moan when they end up under a lorry if lucky to survive.

Odds on

Don't get me started on the traffic light jumping crew..

fatherpierre

The best ones are the ones that get hit on pedestrian crossings - cycling across.

They just ride staright onto it, thinking a car will stop with a second's notice. The look on the (usually a woman) face is priceless when they are informed they are not a pedestrian and therefore have caused an accident, and are liable for the cost of the damage to the car that hit them. And, that I will be a witness for the car driver as to liability!

Odds on

Ah well, these impatient sods that are about to be cold and wet on the way to work might possibly consider abiding by the law (Or whats best for there well being.) You never know....

BTW bike riders - Getting a car driver prosecuted when your 6' under isn't really a victory is it?

Jerome

I think it would be the bikers fault.

You don't always get loads of notice about obstacles, including drains. If the drain was visible from a long way off, maybe the biker should have seen it also - drains are not bike friendly so all good bikers should be looking out for them all the time.

Also, what road markings where on that road? If there were hazard lines, the biker should probably not be overtaking anyway.

When overtaking, you have chosen to take the risk associated with that. What if, instead of a drain, a pedestrian had stepped into the road?

Snazy

Interesting read this has turned into

Nice to see the majority agree with the opinions of motorcyclists in London. Not all of them for one moment, but the bad ones are certainly the most memorable.

Seen far too many nasty outcomes of bike vs car, bike vs lorry, bike vs bus etc And as for cyclists. I wish there could just be a 2-3 week clamp down on them. Throwing fixed penalties at them. Im not sure who is worse, but motorcyclists reputations have been saved by 2 groups.

Cyclists, who believe they are above the law, and can do ANYTHING. Red lights dont apply etc. Who ride in bus lanes where there are bike lanes on the pavements. Ride on the pavements when there are cycle paths on the road.....Grrrrrrr

And the 16yr old moped riders, who think they are on a 1000cc at Spa, stick a silencer on there, stop trying to pop wheelies and impress 12yr old girls, put some decent clothes on, and stop revving the damn thing up!! lol

michaelro

I didn't see him as I was closer to the kerb with a lorry behind me who was closer to the white line, blocking my visibility.

The traffic was stop start 5mph traffic so I didn't see the drain until the car in front had gone past it.

Nice debate though

Leslie

I am a biker and I think it was down to him really. If he wants to overtake you it is down to him to make sure there is enough room to do so so that if you do have some kind of emergency he has enough room to stop or avoid you.

If he was overtaking too close to you it would be all his fault if you had hit him by avoiding the drain.

Les

logiclee

I agree, as long as the car driver stopped within his own lane it's the bikers fault.

You can't invent three lanes when there are only two, bikes should not filter in between slow moving traffic.

Cheers
Lee