*Sonic*

Basically I got two Lab pups (almost 12 months old now) and recently one has become increasingly jelous of the other

They have always been fed together etc, and spend pretty much 100% of their time together

But recently whenever I give them chews/bones etc one of the pups, will take both of them and run off and just put them down, and not eat them, but if the other pup goes to get one, the other will start attacking him, or at the least barking at him

its the same when I am in their company the dominant one will push the other out of the way so much that he will just walk away and sit and wait, and bascially wont get a look in

Now its happening with the food & water, and even if I seperate them for feeding, ie put one outside he wont eat his food he just jumps up and goes mental till they are back in the same room, so he can stop the other one eating

only when they are back together will the dominant one start to eat his food, unless the other one goes to eat his food, and he will then bark and growl and basically move him away so he cant have anything

Its getting to the point where the dominant one is going to have to go and be rehomed elsewhere

Even if I hold his collar and make him sit whilst the other eats his food, he just starts going mental to get at the other pup

They arent full Labs, the mother is full lab, and father is 50% collie 50% lab

both are boys, and are brothers

Any help would be appreciated

Also my neighbour has helped a bit (keeps labs himself) and has calmed one of them down (he used to be mental barking and going for everythiing, but scared of anything too)

Steve

davegtt

That explains it, half collie in the father, nasty dogs they are!!!! Should all be put down

Sorry cant help

Brendan Hughes

http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthread.php?t=423166

Got rehomed, but to a good owner IIRC; turned out well. (Last I heard...)

Daft Lad

Its not the dogs its the owners!

OllyK

It isn't unusual when 2 males are in close proximity for extended periods that they will vie for dominance and ultimately one will come out on top. The same applies to dogs

*Sonic*

the non dominant one is a chocolate one

heres a pic of them from a few months ago, a lot bigger now tho

stilover

Every time the dominant one takes the chews, or anything else you deem unfair to your other dog, give the dominant dog a whollop !!! then give both chews to your other dog. It will soon learn not to take both chews. It will also learn very quickly that being dominant over your other dog will result in a whollop. He won't like it so will stop.

Before people start saying "It's cruel to hit your dog" Dogs are pack animals and packs always have a leader. They have to learn just who IS boss. YOU !!!!!!!!

*Sonic*

Been doing that, and unless I spend 100% of my time with them he just wont stop doing it

the other one now, wont take the chews, eat his food if the other one is nearby and he is getting way way way too thin

if he does eat he eats it that fast it goes everywhere and gives up after a few mouthfuls

Edited to add, the pair of them can not be seperated at all, they whine howl bark like mad when they arent together for longer than 5 seconds

S

2000TLondon

I have two male Rottweilers that are seven months old.

There is no need to rehome the dominant dog, everything is fixable.

The dominant dog needs to submit to the other dog basically, there will still be a level of dominance, there has to be, but you have to demonstrate that this behaviour is unaccetable.

Firstly, you should be, or are the dominant figure and the pack leader. The dominant dog should repsect you and not challenge you anymore? Is this correct? If so, you have to correct the dominant dog when he is behaving badly over the food and the bones, terrority, etc etc.

When the dominant dog tries to fend off the submissive dog for the food, you have to correct him verbally and then touch him around the neck with your fingers lightly to distract him. Your fingers should represent the mouth of the mother dog, so like a claw shape. Just a quick touch should make him jump and make a sharp noise with your mouth to change his thought process.

You then have to do this everytime he does it. He tenses towards the other dog, you lightly jab him and make a loud noise. If he doesn't respond to this, you have to make him submit on his back everytime and allow the less dominant dog to stand over him and sniff him whilst you restrain the dominant one.

Hope this makes sense, I've just woken up! Basically you've allowed the dominant dog to take control and you need to take the control away. It shouldn't take long to break the routine, a few instances and the dominant dog should be giving up........

PM me if you need to. Good luck! Don't get bitten, if you are not the pack leader and in control, may be best not to get too physical and get a trainer in, if neither dog will challenge you it should be easy.

2000TLondon

Doesn't have to be a whollop, thhat just makes the owner feel better, you can change the dogs state of mind with a touch of a finger tip.

davegtt

Failing that, get the baseball bat out, Im sure you will be promoted to pack leader fairly quickly

2000TLondon

Yep, this is all synonymous. Best thing to start seperating them often, get someone to stay at home with one and walk the other yourself. The holwing and whining won't last long.

As soon as you have made the dominant dog submit in front of the other, you should see changes very quickly.

2000TLondon

They sell DOG REPELLANT MACE in the USA which I've considered several times!! The postmen carry it like it's the Holy Grail!

Crazy Chick

Similar thing happened with my dogs. Had an alsatian and when he was about 4 went to the dogs home and got an alsatian/labrador aged about 9 months. Stupidly didn't realise it would be a mistake to put 2 dogs together

For a few years all was quiet but when the newest dog got to about 4 he decided he wanted to be the boss and started doing exactly the same with the food - stopping the other one getting to his and growling and snapping at him whenever he was close.

It all came to a head one day when the oldest one was eating his dinner and the youngest one decided he wanted to eat out of the same bowl and attacked the other - it was a full blown, savage attack and because they were my dogs I waded in to try and break them up - somehow I emerged almost unscathed but I couldn't separate them. They eventually wore each other out but my room was covered in blood and I had to get help taking them both to the vets which resulted in a hefty bill.

I kept both of them cos luckily my house/garden was big enough for them not to have to cross paths again. The eldest one had to be put to sleep 2 years ago and the youngest one is now 13 and still going strong so I don't regret keeping them.

But given the same situation arising again I would never have 2 male dogs especially if at such a young age one of them is already trying to be the dominant one.

*Sonic*

LOL at the holy grail

thanks for the advice, Ill give it a go, it is very difficult to keep them seperated

Last time I walked just one, the other went absolutly ballistic, and I could hear him from the field half a mile away

when I cam eback and got the other one, he was even worse, and I had to come straight back

neither of them go for me, and the dominant one will cower a little when I tell him off, and the pair of them have permanent wagging tails even when the dominance is going on

they sleep together too, and are incredibly rarely apart,

They are at home on their own in the day with the full run of the garden, but as soon as I put one in the back area (segregated) the howling whining etc starts and lasts until I put them back together, last time despite me constantly telling them to be quiet etc, lasted for about 5 hours

my neighbours loved me for that one (not)

S

*Sonic*

My conservatory is permanently covered in blood as they wag their tails that much they smack the ends of them on everything and spray blood everywhere

Vet wont/cant do anything other than doc their tails, one of them is now bent at the very end, and neither now have fur on the very tips

S

bpm1588

i think in this case,you need to castrate both dogs.wont do them any harm just cool them down a bit.also get one of those collars that shock them and when one's bold,give him a blast"sounds bad" but really if you let lab's take the upper hand,they will make your life hell.

*Sonic*

The Choc one, is extremely well behaved 99% of the time, and is very intelligent too, just a shame he is getting bullied by the other one

there seems to be more collie in the black one now that the choc one

2000TLondon

You need to have someone help you if you are on your own as it sounds.

Check out this guy

http://www.dogpsychologycenter.com/ obviously he won't be able to pop round to yours, but his DVD and book is very informative........

he is a genius with dogs and a lot of the stuff I've done with my Rotties has been following his lead. (No pun intended)

It may be a good idea to get crates to keep them in at night, then you can put one in a crate and take the other out. I*t won't be hard to get them to take to the crates, just fill them with their bedding. I didn't like the idea but instantly my Rotties were in the crates with no help needed.

Do you have an area where they sleep that you can seperate from the rest of the house of garden with a child gate or something?

It sounds like your suffering with them, mate, they need good discipline from you and as much excercise as you can handle to wear them right down when they are playing up.

Crazy Chick

I had the younger of my 2 dogs castrated before he tried to take charge properly thinking it would calm him down - what a waste of money.

2000TLondon

Ouch! Do they get enough excercise, as in long walks and runs rather than just play time in the garden?

bpm1588

even get the dom one castrated,thats what the lady on "its me or the dog" would do.
i have two kerry blues,very dom and dog aggressive by nature and believe me it was hard work from day one training them.it started from week 6 and is still ongoing.but unless a dog been trained from word go and your two being a mix of the two brainiest dogs the only answer is having their nuts off.

2000TLondon

Chopping the nuts off will stop them being so terretorial but won't stop one trying to dominate the other and take charge of the pack. There has to be one defined pack leader, castration isn't a bad thing, but won't necessarily cure all the behviour. Sonic has to be the pack leader and there has to be no confusion between the dogs that this is the case.

shaunywrx

I agree with all that 2000TLondon said, i've got to collie males that are brothers, just coming up for 2 years old, and have had similar problems in the past (though not quite as bad as yours sounds) like he said touch his neck when he shows agression to his brother, and as a last resort (not nice but it do'es work believe me) pick him up (high) by the scruff of his neck and shake him and shout at him (it mimicks his mother picking him up as a pup and telling him off) also another good thing to try is, to get an empty spray bottle and fill it with tap water, and every time you notice him show any sign of dominance or agression spray him in the face with a fine mist of water, ideally without him realising it's you who's doing it, he won't like that too much, and it should'nt take him to long to work out every time he's agressive he gets sprayed.
Like i say, iv'e been through the same problems, but now i can feed both dog's at the same time in the same place, and both dogs will eat at there own pace, one will sometimes leave some of his food for later in the day, but both now know, who's bowl is who's, and not to try and steal each others food, they will still try it on a bit with bones and toys, but they both know not to push there luck, because at the end of the day it's me who's in charge and not them. Good luck you know it's worth the effort just to see there happy faces and all the love and affection they bring.
P.S. It took about a week of constantly monitoring there meal times, and any toys and treats they had to cure the worst of the problem.
P.P.S. That's two lovely looking dog's you've got there, am i correct in thinking you got them from another member on here?

sarasquares

iTrader: (1)

what about muzzeling the agressive one?

darren...

I'd recommend the Dog Listener series of books - they'll explain what's happening and how to correct it

powerwrx

iTrader: (11)

WHO LEFT THE GATE OPEN

Karl 227

Sonic, you might want to call Poochline, that's what I did after my dog got bummed

Reality

Pretty sure the problem is You.

You have to be top dog in the house - if you aint then one of the others will be !

How you go about it - that's a different story all together .

Might be quicker / easier to rehome one of the dogs .

*Sonic*

Thanks for that Reality, they know Im top dog in the house, the will do as I say when I tell them

the problem is when im at work I can hardly tell them to behave etc

They dont go for me, bark at me etc etc, they will listen, but only if im in the room with them

Thanks Karl