Fast_Blue_Scooby

Can anyone advise me on the following:

A company owed me some money, after a phone call, they agreed to pay me via a visa credit. I approved this action over the phone and within the next 2-3 days, the money appeared in my account.

However a few days later, a cheque from this company for the same amount was posted to me. My wife opened the letter and not knowing about the visa credit assumed that the cheque was for the refund we were owed and paid the cheque in.

When my wife informed me later about the cheque, I thought the cheque would be cancelled by the company once they realised their mistake.
However 5 days later the cheque cleared. So I had legally been given a refund via a visa credit and also via a cleared cheque.

So in my opinion, this money was now legally in my account. However I knew that of course, this extra amount would have to be paid back and was expecting a phone call or letter from the company asking for their money back.

Now if this company had not messed me around in the past, I would have informed them straight away once the cheque had cleared. However they had caused me no ends of problems and I left the ball in their court. This time, it was their money in my account and they would have to ask for it back.

Now yesterday, I noticed on my account, that the company had used my debit card, which they had details on when they did the refund, to extract the money from my account! Now this had been done without my permission and without my approval. If they had phoned up, I would have agreed for the amount to be debited from my card or sent them a cheque. However they have gone ahead and in my opinion, illegally used my card without my permission.

Now as far as my bank is concerned, they have seen an approved visa credit appear in my account and an honoured cheque clear. The money is in my account and whether I owe the company is immaterial to the bank. That is between the company and me to sort out. However this new debit that this company has made is not with my approval, so I have sent letters of complaint to the company and also to VISA to claim this money back.

In my opinion, this company has gone about it in the wrong way. Instead of getting in touch with me to sort out their error, they have broken the law and used my debit card without my permission to claim the money back.

Now is there anyone on scoobynet who can state where I stand as far as the law and banking procedures are concerned. Am I in my rights to complain against this company for using my debit card without my permission? Will this company be taken to task by VISA as they have broken the law?

Thanks in anticipation of any advice......

Jubal

Not an expert but you gave them permission for the first transaction, you then received a credit for that, you then paid in the cheque they sent in error so they decided to take the credit back. It could be argued that it's still the same transaction and your acceptance of the cheque implied your preference for that method of receiving a credit for the first transaction.

Fast_Blue_Scooby

The company should have got in touch with me first before using my card to claim the money. The credit and debit are 2 different transactions imo. No one has the right to use a customer's debit card without their pemission. This is what my argument is with them.

I think it is similar to purchasing an item for £50 in the shop but when you pay for the item, the visa debit you approve is only for £40. £40 gets taken from your account. This does not give the shop the right to then take out a futher amount of £10 without your permission at a later date to cover their mistake.

The money was legally in my bank account. Once in there, the money which is in my name can surely only be taken out with MY permission. Surely we are protected from companies using our cards without our permission?

It is not the money at issue here but the way they have used my card without me approving the transaction.

mr & mrs carlos uk300

Phone your bank and ask for the debit card dispute number. Can't understand how they've taken the money back using your debit card, the only way this can happen is if you've given them your card number off your debit card, if so you could be fighting a losing battle, once you give a company your details it's classed as a gauranteed transaction, the bank itself can't stop deb card transaction's unless like you say they've taken it without your permission then it's classed as a fraudulant transaction. But how have they got your card details? if you first paid using your credit card, someone has giving them your debit card details because it's impossible for them to take money from your a/c without your card number.

Phil

With respect

What do you hope to achieve?

I appreciate your point but the supplier could see it as you were trying to pull a fast one

I am sure if you reported this to the bank they would ask you if you owe the money!

If you lied and said no they would be no doubt refund you without question


I would leave it IMHO

Fast_Blue_Scooby

Business etiquette is what I hope to acheive. Something that this company has not adhered to.

In response to a question, they had my debit card number as I gave them it when they did the refund back onto my card.

The company took the money out without my permission, therefore it is a fraudelent transaction surely?

Yes I would have approved the transaction IF they had phone or informed me via a letter but they did not. But the fact is I was not given the chance to approve the debit, they did it behind my back and without my permission.

On the reverse side, how would this company have felt, if I had their debit card number and instead of phoning them up to ask for the money they owed me, I simply put their card details into our system and gained the money that way!!!!! True that money was mine they were holding but it does not give me the right to have used their card detail to gain the money in that manner.

In business as far as I am concerned, you gain the approval of the party you are dealing with. THEY DID NOT IN THIS INSTANCE!!!

Phil

I take your point and please I did not mean to insult

Take it one step further then

My company checks all payments in BEFORE banking cheques if you had done this you would have returned the payment is this not good Business etiquette

Also if the company had not asked for the money back whould you have given it back?

As I said not trying to insult just looking from the otherside

mr & mrs carlos uk300

I'm afraid you don't have a leg to stand on, once you've gave them your card details your giving them permission to take or refund money from your a/c .It would have been curteous for the company to get in touch with you and let you know what they were going to do, but as you have giving them your card details they don't need your permision to go back into your a/c and take funds which you owe them. The bank would'nt treat this as a fraudulant transaction, they'll tell you it's a dispute between you and the company and that you will have to sort it out between yourselves.

TDT

I've had the same situation going on since last Feb and it's now ended up in the hands of the Financial Ombudsman because the card company involved have decided that it's much better to ignore recorded delivery letters rather than answer them

Good luck!