the big yim

as title.
i am thinking about running (or trying to) do the london marathon in 2006 for charity, thinking of cancer research etc.
just wondering if anyone has any training tips or advice for me please. im reasonably fit, 22 years old, go down the gym three times a week and 15 mile bike ride every sunday morning.
at the moment i can run about 4 miles non stop at a reasonable pace which is no where near good enough!
any posts would be welcome
thanks in advance
THE BIG YIM

Scooby96

Expect piss_lewis will have done in under an hour!!

Andy916

iTrader: (8)

Wander over to http://www.runnersworld.co.uk/ for suggested training schedules and lots of forum chat.

ozzy

Never entered an official marathon, but I've ran a few 30-milers in my time. What's your current 4-mile time?

Key to any distance running is to basically put in the hours. Slow, steady running builds leg endurance and it's usually these that'll blow first. You also need to do some speed work to improve your fitness and I would also recommend lots of hill work if you live in the country.

Most of the running mags talk about different slow & fast runs based on race pace (5k, 10k, etc..)m but unless you've run these you'll never know. An alternative is to use a heart rate monitor to make sure you're not working too hard and hitting the wall too early. It's all about conserving energy with these sorts of distances.

Other advice would be to get proper running shoes (not Nike's or any other fashion shoe) and to get your feet looked at by a proper running shop. Any biomechanical problems will just lead to injuries when you start doing lots of long distance running. It's tough enough without giving yourself shin splints, sore knees or hips.

Also, I would look at your diet and make sure you eat enough carbs for all the additional running.

You should be naturally fit @ 22, so running a Marathon by April 2006 should be a piece of pi$$.

Stefan

the moose

I'd entirely echo Ozzy and Dave's comments - when I did it I was fuelled by adrenaline, and managed to do my best-ever half-marathon time. I paid for it hugely by mile 18, and by mile 20 I was cramping like mad.

I remember the last few miles as being truly awful, but I always knew I'd finish, as will you. The time's not important, but the fact that you're doing it at all is.


Good luck.

Drunken Bungle Whore

I did the London in 1997 and the best piece of advice I was given was that a marathon is a helluva lot longer than 2 half marathons! Makes no sense till you do it!

Join a local running club - - get the right shoes - train sensibly - understand what you're getting yourself into - and have fun! I buggered my back completely doing London and am now no longer able to run - but if I went back in time and had the chance I'd still do it again - a truly fantastic experience! I swear that even if you had two broken legs, the adrenaline, the crowd, everything, wold still get you over the finish line!

Funniest thing was a comment from a friend who finished in just over 3 1/2 hours - she was really p1ssed off and when I asked why she said "I was over taken by a tub of Utterly Butterly in the last 100 yards!"

the moose

Yep - I had a lifeboat overtake me at 20 miles and I nearly killed myself trying to keep up. Thing is, it was carried by a team of 3-hour runners who swapped every mile - I was aiming at 4 hours as a personal best!

ozzy

LOL @ the Utterly Butterly & lifeboat comments I've been passed by 50 yr olds on hill runs, but you've got to look at the funny side and tip your hat to them

You've got to pace yourself over these distances and just run your own race. Even the elite runners do it, it's just that their pace is frighteningly quick and their stride is twice that of us mortals

Personally, I'd save yourself for the last 10K. if you've got the legs and energy you'll soar past all those people blowing up in the last few miles and have a sprint finish to take all the glory

Other training advice I can give is to make sure you warm-up, cool-down and stretch properly after your runs. If you are doing a lot of running, I'd even recommend doing one stretching session where you just warm-up and do lots of deep stretches.

A warm-up I was taught was:-

Start jogging slowly in a wide circle - 2-3 mins
Still jogging, start doing a freestyle swimming stroke with your arms - 30secs
Repeat again, this time do a backstroke - 30secs
Next to a breastroke movement - 30secs
Repeat, but reverse the stroke (i.e. pull your arms into your chest) - 30secs
Next, do long side-steps (face into circle), swinging your arms across your chest in a large arc
Repeat, this time face outwards
Next, put your arms out front at waist level, parallel to the ground. Lift your knees to your hands - 30secs
Put your hands on your butt (palms out) and kick your heels to your hands - 30secs

Now do some quick sprints 3 x 60m as fast as you can should get your heart & lungs up to speed. Rest between sprints by jogging on the spot for 60secs.

Finally, stop jogging and do some static stretches (those above are called dynamic stretches). Stretch for between 10 - 15 secs and don't go deep into the stretch.

Shoulders
Triceps
Chest
Hips/Butt
Hams
Thighs
Calves

Always work from head to toe.

Now you're ready to do your run.

Cool downs, should just involve slowing your heart rate down, followed by some deeper & longer stretches. For example, jog in a circle for 5 mins or the last 5 minutes before you get home, just slow your pace right down.

Do the same stretches, but go deeper into them and hold the stretch for 30 secs.

Stefan

SJ_Skyline

I'm being a total lightweight and doing the great north run this year (for Guide Dogs for the Blind), just a 1/2 marathon

Averaging 9:30min/10min miles at the moment over 6 to 7 miles, if I can double this distance and retain the average then I will be well pleased.

ozzy

Nothing wrong with that SJ_Skyline. One key to running is breathing. The more relaxed you are, the easier it is.

How do you "feel" on your runs? If you're not struggling for breath at that pace, then do some faster runs over shorter distances (say 3-miles fast as possible), it'll actually help your legs on the longer, slower runs.

Stefan

the big yim

cheers for the advice people, i can do four miles in roughly 35 mins ish. is that about right pace or too fast/slow??

should i be running long slow distances or fast sprints?
what are the best type of trainers to buy? cause my knees and shins are aching already!!
what time is a reasonable time for the marathon??
cheers for all the advice again

ozzy

Just finishing a Marathon is reasonable. Sub 3hrs is extremely good, 3-4hrs very good and 4hrs+ good.

35mins is a 9.5min/mile pace (say 6.5mph on a treadmill). At that pace, you'd complete a Marathon in just over 4hrs. How long have you been running that distance and how often are you running?

The majority of your runs should be long and slow. You need to build the distance over months though. Doing too much, too quickly will lead to injuries. Trust me, I've been there, done it and bought the tee shirt.

You still need to do speed work, so the answer is both. My own running would involve one long slow run, some steady state running and some pure speed work (intervals or fartleks). Depending on how long you've been running for depends on how soon you should start any speed work. I would wait until you've a good, strong foundation and your legs are strong enough to start stressing them even more. Obviously this varies between individuals, but a good few months of steady running would be better under your belt. That doesn't mean you stick to 4-miles for that 2 months, just that you gradually increase your running and perhaps add one sprint session per week to see how your body copes.

For long distance running I would try to get the idea of distance out your head. What you need to do is add time to your runs. If you can manage 35 mins, then you need to start adding 5mins, 10mins, 15mins, and so on over time until you're doing hours. Speedwork will help increase your slow pace, because as you get much fitter your heart rate will stay low but you'll be able to run faster. Your stride will increase as you get more used to running and you'll just become a more efficient runner. if you just stick to 9.5min/miles for the next year, you'll run a marathon for sure but you'll just become a slow runner.

Whether your current pace is too fast or slow depends on how you feel. It's very slow for me, but it could feel fast for you. It should feel very easy during the run. It's afterwards when you relax that you feel completely shattered and your legs feel like lead weights. You certainly shouldn't be breathing heavily or out of breath afterwards - just very tired. The later won't really relate to running for 35mins, but once you're over an hour that's when you'll feel the fatigue.

Trainers is a personal thing. Some simply feel more comfortable and some offer varying degrees of cushioning and support. My best advice is to go to a local running shop and get them to check your gait. They'll just get you to walk and jog while they look at your feet/legs. That will tell them if you fall into 3 basic categories:-

1. Pronator - your feet rolls inwards too much. puts a lot of stress on lower leg muscles
2. Neutral - natural running style where your foot is supported naturally
3. Supinator - your feet doesn't roll enough. doesn't absorb impact well

Once they have an idea what type of support and cushioning you'll need, then they can point you to the right type of shoe. All the major brands of running shoes offer models in these different categories.

Are you running on hard surfaces? If you are, then that's more likely causing your shin and knee pain. It could be your running style or trainers, but that should be sorted once you've had some advice from a local shop. If you've not been running long, then stick to grass or cross-country if you can. It'll absorb the impact until you find a good set of running shoes and your legs get stronger and used to all the running.

Don't expect to find the perfect running shoes right away. You may have the perfect running style and find a pair that fit like a glove and offer the ultimate in cushioning, but it can take a bit of experimenting. If you do get some new ones, wear them around the house and even try them on a treadmill to get a feel for them.

Asics shoes have always worked well for me, but other good shoes are Saucony, Brooks, Mizuno, Adidas, Puma, New Balance and Nike. The only issues I have with Nike or Adidas is that a lot of their models are sold purely on looks. That's why you need to go to a running shop - they'll tell you what model actually works well for your running style.

I have a pair of Nike trail running shoes myself. They look cr@p, but since they spend their time covered in mud, I don't care.

Stefan

ozzy

Yep, paying £60+ is considered expensive for a running shoe. If you look at the a brands latest, all singing, all dancing model then you could pay around £80.

I'd seriously look at joining a local club. They'll provide you with all the help and more than likely a well proven Marathon training plan. You don't have to go every week, but at least you can meet up with people and find some training partners that'll provide some encouragement and motivate you to stick to a plan.

Stefan