f1

ellooooo,

A colleague is trying to sell her car. It's just a Toyota Corolla 2 dr auto, nothing special at all. She's had an e-mail from a woman in Greece who wants to transfer the money into A/C and then send someone to pick the car up. I've talked her out of sending her bank details, and said a cheque would be better. The buyer has agreed that she'd send a cheque.

It just seems a bit strange that someone in Greece wants to buy a car, it's only £700, and get it shipped to them. Buyer is going to pay all shipping costs etc. I know that as long as she has the money then who cares. Are there any scams going at the moment that I should warn her of. It just all seems bizzare for a car worth a few hundred quid.

Regards
Steve

ChrisB

IT'S A SCAM!


Run away!

f1

was thinking that, but how so if she gets a cheque ? Am I missing something totally obvious then?

minor_threat

I hear about plenty of scams like this from NCIS (National Criminal Intelligence Service) and our other clients. There are always bulletins going around about scams but they usually originate in Lagos, Nigeria or other parts of South Africa. I haven't come across one like this originating in Greece yet.

Your advice to your colleague is sound - never send them bank account details, payment by cheque is much better. It takes 3 day to go through the (stupidly slow) system and leaves a nice paper audit trail which can be traced.

It does sound bizarre, somebody in Greece wanting the car, but scammers usually decline the offer to pay by cheque. If the cheque is received please ensure it clears the system and ends up in your colleague's account before handing the car over.

I'll ask if any of my colleagues have heard of this kind of scam coming from Greece, if I hear anything else I'll send you a PM. Sometimes life just is bizarre - good luck though!

Scoobychick

iTrader: (1)

As Chris says!

See Burr's thread here

ChrisB

Cheque might clear into your account but when it shows up as being stolen about two weeks later, it unclears your account...

talizman

iTrader: (1)

Wasn't there a warning going around about this recently?

Apparently, due to the cheque being from a different country, the funds "appear" to have cleared in your account and you release the car. A few days or weeks later, the cheque bounces and the funds are promptly removed from your account, and your car is gone.

Beware!

f1

Cheers all, that well known trading mag. has said forward the mail to them & they will investigate.

Talizman thats the thread I was thinking of.

Thanks again all.

Steve

minor_threat

LOL! It happens a lot! Fraud trends are moving from transaction and POS fraud to identity theft and laundering. Personally I'd never trade anything like this with somebody overseas. I don't even trust goods on ebay listed from outside the UK (lots of fraud there at the moment with telescopes!). The bottom line is if you're advertising goods on a public forum (such as Autotrader) in the UK and receiving interest from overseas then be very alert.

Talizman, there have been warnings about this, mainly about these scams originating in South Africa but to be honest I don't think the country of origin matters at all. Somebody in Greece may genuinely want the car but they'd have to be a bit insane to go to all that trouble for one worth £700!

gsm1

Ebay is full of scammers. I have placed a few high priced electrical items on there (one of which is detailed in another thread) and some git is then sending an email to everyone who has bid on my item giving them a second chance offer at their highest bid price, claiming to be me. They've shoved on all the Ebay logos etc. to make it look genuine. I know of one guy who was seriously going to respond to this offer until I warned him. The fraudster/s told him that he had just left the UK and was now in Italy, but if he wired the money across he would UPS the goods to him.

speedking

Replace Italy by Greece and see how this reads:
http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthrea...ighlight=italy and these ...
http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthrea...highlight=scam
http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthrea...highlight=scam

EvilKyote

Hi F1,

Yeah, I would advise your friend to be very very careful if she decides to go through with it. I would infact suggest she's declines the sale and only sells to someone in the UK.

Unfortunatley alot of these scammers are relying on people trust in the '3 days = cheque cleared'.

The problem is, although it might be 3 days in the UK, when i comes to international cheques it takes alot lot longer, it may appear to be cleared in a few days, you might even ring the bank and they will tell you 'yep, thats fine, cheques cleared and money's in your account' - the bank clerks don't really notice the difference, but it does in fact take something like at least 30 days for the payment to fully clear (Can't remember the exact time) so she might accept the cheque, payment clears, car is shipped out, then a month later you find out the cheque is infact either fraudulent or stolen, and you loose the money, and you've already lost the car.

Please don't let your friend become a another victim of this sort of crime. tell her to wait for a buyer in the UK to come along and if done my cheque, wait till it's cleared before releasing the car.


EvilKyote

Brendan Hughes

Amazing that the banks can tell you when the cheque has cleared if it hasn't.

Surely it is up to the bank after this, and the bank should carry the loss if they can't be arsed to check the cheque properly? Either you have the money, or you don't. It's a bit dumb to say yes you can have the money now but we might change our minds later, in which case, YOU suffer!

minor_threat

So true EvilKyote (unfortunately)! The finance system in the UK is geared to help the banks, not the consumers. Cheques in Europe are processed within a matter of hours but in the UK they wander through the ether and get lost for 3 days. APACS aren't concerned by this at all, and say it is legitimate and justified. Bank clerks will be able to see a cheque processing through the system, and will know it is on its way into your account, but sadly they are tracing a physical process and not tracing the physical 'cash'.

A cheque on its way to your account shows up on the computer but does not confirm the money is on its way - the two are physically separate entities in the UK system. You can be told a cheque has cleared even though the liquid assets haven't arrived in your account!! This helps the banks gain a few days' interest on the payment but opens a virtual safe harbour for fraudsters to gain a time advantage over the victim. It's a totally crap system and does nothing to help law enforcement agencies prevent fraud from happening in the first place.

Boss Hogg

As above- the funds clearing to your account (and balance showing) is provisional until the cheque has been through the clearing system - only then can you draw on the funds deposited. The fraudsters are playing on people's misunderstanding of this system, which the banks (or APACs) don't exactly explain very well....