Brendan Hughes

What kind of offence is, for example, getting a minor speeding ticket? (I won't use a parking ticket example, that's local bye-laws usually). What's the correct term?

It's not a criminal offence.
It's not a tort (duh!)
It's not a misdemeanour, English law dumped those about 30 years ago.
Is it a civil offence?
is it a civic offence?
Administrative offence?

It's really bugging me.

Note to others - please at least let me get the right answer on here before muppetting me into next week, thanks

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

Good question!!!

No idea but would also be interested to know.

However if you don't pay it you will get expensively shafted.

Brendan Hughes

Don't worry, it's for an academic legal exercise writing about these things, and I just realised that in my own country I don't know the terminology.

T.C

They are commonly refered within the legal profession as Road Traffic Offences which differentiates between criminal or common law matters, however there are occasions when different categories can overlap.

For example, driving whilst disqualified although a traffic offence is actually recorded as a criminal offence, Murder is contrary to common law, so although we have the offence of vehiclular manslaughter, there is the option of charging the offender with Murder, contrary to common law, even though it is a criminal offence.

There are loads of examples where the overlap occurs which is why they are related to Road Traffic Offences unless the precedent is to commit a criminal offence.

22BUK

AFAIK, speeding IS a criminal offence. You must declare it when applying for a job as a teacher, for example.

T.C

Speeding is not a criminal offence, for a criminal offence you get a club number (criminal record) which you do not get for the majority of traffic offences! But as i said earlier, there are some cases where there is an overlap.

Brendan Hughes

Thanks TC, wondered when you'd arrive I'm aware of the difference btwn common law and statutory offences. But these don't really distinguish btwn the seriousness of the offence. Unfortunately neither does the phrase Road Traffic Offence. I'm sorry, maybe speeding was a bad example.

In other countries they have things like offences against the Administrative Code, or non-criminal offences. It's for generally bad behaviour which is not bad enough to call you a criminal. I suppose, apart from Road Traffic, pretty much everything is done with local bye-laws. Wossa breach of a local bye-law then? Just that?

Perhaps the answer is that English law simply doesn't have anything like that, and the concept cannot easily be applied?

Curses...

T.C

Brendan, I think you are right in your observation in that we have Common Law which dates back to the year dot, and we have the statutory offences where acts of Parliament say that a certain action will constitute an offence.

This is why Traffic offences fall into this middle sector because there is at times an overlap. For exmple speeding is not a criminal offence as we understand it, but it is a statutory offence. Likewise using a vehicle with say a defective tyre is contrary to the construction and use regs (statutory) but is not a criminal offence, whereas Drink Driving is a criminal offence the same as Driving whilst disqualified.

Hence the reason Road traffic Offences are refered to in different terms to criminal offences. We don't have offences such as misdemeanours, of Federal indictments or whatever they are as used in the states, perhaps we should?

Brendan Hughes

Aside from road traffic, for instance a pharmacist has to keep certain substances in a locked cabinet, and make records of quantities sold, in a certain manner. Inadequate precautions may be an offence (breach of the regs) but not a criminal one. So what's he committed?

I suppose the answer is statutory offences, but it's annoying that these can be both criminal and non-criminal.

T.C

The other term you could use is "Summary Offence" This is again a term that is quite popular for those who don't like the term traffic offence and it does apply to any offence where the offender is not arrested and charged, whether it be traffic or any other matter. In other words they are summonsed to appear at court rather than being charged and bailed, which would apply to your Chemist analagy.

Brendan Hughes

Sorry, same problem - a summary offence is one normally tried in a magistrate's court, as opposed to an indictable offence (Crown ct). A criminal offence can be a summary offence; JPs can give up to 6 mths in jail, IIRC. So still no clear distinction...

T.C

You are right of course. I would still stand by my original post!

Brendan Hughes

Actually, thanks for that last post about summary offences, I just saw the first words and replied, I do apologise. What you describe is indeed what I'm looking for. Just a pity that it covers some criminal offences as well!

Mungo

Sorry to butt in on your thread, but aren't all offences initially dealt with by magistrates courts? Even murder would initially go there, the offender would be remanded in custody to appear at a crown court at a later late?
I have no legal training so feel free to trash me!

Brendan Hughes

I think you're right Mungo, but I usually deal with the more theoretical aspects of law than the actual practice...

SPEN555

The way this country carries on you would think it was corporal

Little Miss WRX

I queried this with the police when I phoned to sort out the offences which weren't connected to me. For purposes of immigration, I asked what the speeding convictions would be classed as and would they be criminal? I got told no, they were RTA offences and not criminal.