Rob Walker

Hi,

In my garage I have a washing maching and tumble dryer. If I have them both on at the same time the circuit breaker trips at the same point in the wash cycle every time (when the water is about to drain out of the washer)

Would it be safe to replace the 15Amp breaker for the power circuit with the next one up? 20Amp or whatever it would be?

As you can tell I know jacksh1t about electrics.

Cheers
Rob

Huxley

Does it have a RCD earth leakage trip or is it just a 15trip.

Is the 15amp breaker on a ring main or just on a spur??

If it's on a ring main it should have a 30amp trip on it iirc.


Huxley

Luke

Try using a Non Biological powder.

Rob Walker

Need that in laymans terms

Basically in the garage there is a box with 2 mini breakers in it. 1 is 15amp for the electrics and the other is a 6amp for the lights. On the box it says its rated for 45Amps max.

On my main box in the house it has lots of smaller circuit breakers. The one for the garage is 20Amps. This one doesn't trip when the one in the garage does.

Cheers
Rob

dnb

Huxley was refering to the actual wires in the circuit. If there is one wire going to the sockets from the consumer unit then it is a spur. If there are two wires in a loop then it is a ring.

The cable can take approx 15A per wire, so if there is only one, then there is a 15A limit.

This is quite a simple explanation, and is not complete by any means, so you would do well to get it looked at if you are not confident that you know what you are doing.

RON

If it is a spur, and therefore only has one wire going from the unit to the sockets, you could always just run a wire back to the box to create a ring, but you've still only got a spur from the house, if you make it a ring it should in theory be able to carry 30 amps, but seeing as the mcb in the house is still only a 20, you ain't gonna gain much, don't even think about changing the one in the house without getting the wire to the garage sorted, you don't wanna be running 30amps down a small wire, trust me!
Surely thre best thing to do is only run one appliance at a time!
Ron.

Rob Walker

Ok, just been out for a look. Its a spur system. Theres loads of grey wires going in/out of the switch box so its a bit hard to tell what goes where..

Theres about 6 double sockets, running off 2 seperate spurs. And cables for a florescent light on the ceiling and outside security light.

I realise I could run the 2 things seperate (which is what we have to do) its just a pain in the **** really..

mj

you need to check the size of cable between the small fuse box in the garage and the socket outlets your appliances are plugged into.

unless it has been wired by an idiot, it should be 2.5 mm square - you may find this stamped on the cable, if not you can measure the width- if it is 11-12mm wide it is 2.5 cable. if it is about 9mm wide it is 1.5 mm.

if the cable is 2.5 you can safely uprate the 15A breaker to 20A, as the current rating of 2.5 twin and earth is about 27A, hence the cable will be protected by a 20A breaker.

the only problem you may find is that you loose discrimination - i.e., in the event of a fault the 20A braker in the house may trip before the breaker in the garage. this is not a hazard in itself more an inconvenience.generally in electrical installations circuit breakers go down in size the nearer you get to the potential fault, for example if the lighting circuit in the garage develops a fault it will take out the breaker in the garage only, hopefully not taking all the lights in the house out aswell, this is what we call discrimination.

you can only do this if the cable that runs from the house to the garage is 2.5mm or bigger.

hope this helps,

mj


[Edited by mj - 8/19/2002 10:47:23 AM]

Rob Walker

Going by memory I would say the cables are about 11-12 cm. I'll have a look when I get in tonight.. Should the higher rated breaker just plug in then? They don't have different connectors or anything?

I bought the house off the bloke who built it. You wouldn't believe the amount of dodgy/bad jobs. for example:

1. The stairs have been raised to add a door for an extension above the garage. They are all different widths. The carpet fitters I had out a while ago couldn't work for laughing for about 1/2 an hour! Took them hours to fit the carpet too.

2. The conservatory has a balcony with tiles above it. Leaks with heavy rain. I've tried everything to stop it.

3. They left a nice mirror in the living room. Was only when I looked behind it I found out why. The plastering looked like it had been done my Stevie Wonder. Theres a 3 foot wide strip of crap plaster all above the fireplace. And all through the bedroom above.

I'll stop now before I get angry.. bloody cowboy!

Anyway cheers for your help

Rob

mj

rob,

whereabouts in manchester are you?

mail me offline and drop me a number.

Rob Walker

Hi Mate,

I'm in Stockport actually.. but you don't have to go out of your way or anything. Its not that big a deal...

Cheers
Rob

mj

not a problem,

it's no trouble.

mj,

(stockport near the bamford arms on the A6)

Rob Walker

is that the one with the TravelLodge build on the back? I've been in there a few times..

I'm behind the Carousel on Reddish Road

cryptwalk

Yer overloading it dude.

Get someone to sort it for you.

I only charge £30 an hour.

mj

only £30 ?

are you having a sale this week?

cryptwalk

A quiet week.

Not that I usually charge BTH mind.

mj

not surprised you drive an evo with those rates.

i think i am in the wrong game.

cryptwalk

You work for yourself?

I'm in a partnership and we have contracts with North, south, east manchester regeneration. We do alot of grant work.

Thats what pays for the Evo atm.

mj

i work for my old fella, installing diesel generators.

bit quiet at the moment.

cryptwalk

My friend used to work on all that sort of stuff, he worked for Aggreco. Wassent on good money mind for the hours and knowledge he possesed!

At least we've had nice weather for being quiet.

There's a gathering of local petrolheads at the carousel pub, end of each month I hear.

mj

if i had a car worth going in i'd go.

all i have is a caddy van and i've sold me westie.

Rob Walker

Crypywalk.. what do you mean about overloading it? Won't putting a 20amp breaker sort it out then?!?!?!

I've heard about that meet at the Carousel.. never managed to catch it yet tho.. I've not lived here that long. I would have thought I'd be able to hear something from my house. I'm only about 50 yards away from the car park... I can only just about see the pub from upstairs.. not the car park.

mj

rob,

DONT PANIC, You're britsh.

what crypt is saying is that your 16A breaker is overloaded. Think about it, each of your appliances is probably 2.5-3 kw when running in anger. a kw @ 240v is just over 4A, so this equates to 5-6 kw or 20-24A load on the breaker when they are both running togeyther.

this is what circuit breakers are for, dont forget you are still protected by the 13a fuses in the plugs.

i would still try the 20A breaker, they only cost about 6 or 7 quid.

mj.

Rob Walker

I'm not british.. I'm Scottish thank you! lol

I'll try and get to b&q tomorrow if I get the chance and see how I get on with the 20amp on then.

Cheers
Rob

cryptwalk

Rob, B@Q is dam expensive dude!

Have a look along redish lane, there has gotta be an electrical wholesalers somewhere along there.

Yup sounds like overloading dude as Mj has explained.

Going from what you have said on here I'd do the following...

32a Trip in the house and a 20a trip for the power in the garage, sounds like someone wired a radial circuit for yer sockets. Sounds funny though, Try that see how you go. It's all guess work without testing it out meself like.