Tidgy

So those in the know, other than the leak itself which is suposedly a hack, have any crimes actualy been commited, or is it playing the system/systems?

hodgy0_2

The rich and powerful play by different rules

Who knew!!!!!

A "bears **** in the woods" story

Tidgy

yeah this is what i dont get, people seem to want to be outraged by it, but 99.99999% would do it if they had the ability to.

Using the system and breaking the law are two very different things

dpb

iv sailed into the bitter end ( bvi) 1986 -didn't seem that bad to me

hodgy0_2

Who says they are not breaking the law

The icelandic prime minister resigned because although Icleand had capital controls (it limits the amount of money you can take out of the country) he squirrelled money away

Same with the Chinese, same with all the dictators around the world

The Panama lawyers may say THEY are not breaking the law, and technically they may not be - according to the jurisdiction they operate under I,e Panama law

This is not about a few rich individuals doing a bit of canny tax planning

It is about global money laundering on an astronomical scale

With the nexus fairly pointed at the UK - most of these dodgy places are UK protectorates

markjmd

iTrader: (11)

Undoubtedly crimes committed in a good few cases, including but not limited to assisting clients with tax evasion, assisting with or participating in money laundering, large-scale transactions with individuals, companies and/or nation states subject to international sanctions, etc, etc. It would probably be easier to write a list of which rules they haven't broken or helped people break.

Whether any of it can or ever will get proved in a court of law is obviously a different story though.

dpb

Just slap a 50% tax / close down protectorates
Loss to local economy- nothing like what's mooted - these people aernt sailing their with their loot !

It'll never happen though because without this sort of allure, like flogging off half Belgravia , uk economy would collapse

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I don't see how this is even news, Shock Horror, Rich and powerful, criminals and politicians squirrel money away in off shore accounts to avoid taxes, I mean seriously, really seriously, are there still people out there that did not know about this.

andy97

iTrader: (1)

How will the shipping cope?

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

It's certainly a no s*** Sherlock story. The media are loving it, but I'm like "is this news?" I suppose it proof, but nothing of these leaked/hacked documents has been properly publicised so yet again we rely on the media's interpretation of it combined with their own opinion and skew.

I mean this Cameron bollocks, so what? His rich long-dead dad stashed some cash a few decades a ago, that assuming it is his Dad and not someone with the same name (you never know). It's not news. It's not important.

Now if it was some Prime ministers who have squirrelled away a few million whilst touting on the hunt for tax avoiders (note avoiders, not those illegally evading it), that would be something.

But all we have so far is hot air and warm farts. Must be a slow news week.

neil-h

Nah they don't, the play by the same rules everyone else does. They just play them better.

JackClark

Laws have been broken, plenty of them.

hodgy0_2

I don't agree - as JackClark says a lot of what has been going on is simply criminal

it will be interesting what the US state dept have to say - they get pretty pissed of with money laundering etc

what interesting is people (with some justification) complain about the corruption in these developing countries

usually in the context of "aid" - why should we give blah blah blah

yet we (UK PLC) are at the very heart of providing the mechanisms by which these dodgy dictators steal the wealth from their countries

then we complain when the peoples of these countries want to come here for a better life

re Cameron - yeah so what, but it does give up the lie "that we are all in this together"

JackClark

I read a good one about Cameron earlier today, can't remember where but it pointed out him slating Jimmy Carr for tax avoidance yet saying nothing about his own father.

RS_Matt

This rich person hatred being exacerbated by the despicable Labour Party is going to lead to a sticky end.

The level playing field angle is getting tiresome now.

SJ_Skyline

Just can't get this tune out of my head... You're welcome!

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Protests in London today.


Well well well. Look at all those people who don't work on Saturdays (if at all )


Where was I?

At work...like they should be...

neil-h

Ummmmmm, why?

JGlanzaV

iTrader: (3)

I think someone has had a bad day stuck in work while we are all out having fun....

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Yeah. On top of a lot of more far important things that's closer to home (if I can call it that anymore). I wish I could "afford" that lavish luxury of time and funds to protest in the capital.

Kinda of fed up of the newer generation of protesters protesting at everything and anything. Maybe it's justified, buts it's probably not...has a law been broken? (Yet) No. They are almost as bad as the rich fat cats themselves (especially if they can afford to live in London) Some need to get over it and get back to work and do something properly beneficial to society ...assuming they have a job and aren't career left wing layabouts


Bitchy mode is now off. So I'll shut up now

dpb

office worker neil , by any chance ?

JGlanzaV

iTrader: (3)

Chin up Ali,

I know your feeling, I am in the same kind of boat and doing over 100hrs a week at the moment to sort it. Don't let people get to you!

neil-h

Not if I can avoid it but sometimes needs must. Would much rather be out on the plant.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Cheers.

Sometimes it gets tough to stay optimistic.

What I'd like to see is the government doing something that benefits you and me. Not the demands of media and mouthy left wingers.

For me that would be less crippling demands on small business (less than five employees), be it tax or operational overheads (like the time and cost it incurrs with the changes to payroll and pensions), rates, rules, regs. Etc. Proper infrastructure investment on new roads, putting China in its place, the right to aggressively defend property, proper jails, proper punishments. Total overhaul of the insurance industry. Get the UN (with support and funding of EU as a whole) to annex part of Syria and Lybia to create a safe zone and plonk the asylum seekers back over there. Etc.etc.

The PMs tax affairs fall pretty much at the bottom of that long long list. Hence my annoyance at the media and protesters.

mrtheedge2u2

I do not think the US government will say anything considering it looks likely that they orchestrated the data breach.

The David Cameron angle I do not get. He paid all the tax owed on his earnings. Even independent tax specialists who looked at it say there is nothing untowards.

hodgy0_2

Yes that is interesting, you can certainly see their motives

What is your source

mrtheedge2u2

Was announced by wikileaks......

hodgy0_2

ah yes

I had heard there was a bit of infighting between WikiLeaks and the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (who got the papers)

a murky business

neil-h

The plot thickens. Global politics is fun isn't it.

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

This is what the US thinks of the British Territories Tax Havens. As the article suggests the UK could make the Top 10 of hidey holes for filthy lucra

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35998801