steve McCulloch

I have 2*12inch Diamond M512 subs in the boot of my car

They weigh an absolute tonne -good for 500wrms each(although I dont take them that high - running off a Genesis Miniblock (£600) and have a 1.5 Farad Capacitor

Just wondered - will I notice a huge difference in Bass if I just have one 12 inch sub in the boot as the rear end goes down 20mm with the subs in! which is a pain! (The box must weigh about 3okg's at least)

Stupid Question I know - but I want to reduce weight in the boot. I have 2 6*9's in the rear shelf (and no they dont destroy the sound as I used to have no rear speakers and I cant tell any difference at all - just better for the rare rear passengers)

Anyone got any amazing base out of one sub - and what was the make?

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

Sorry can't help but you may what to try the forum at www.caraudiodirect.com they may be able to help

chiark

Telling grandmother to suck eggs here, but the best way to make noise is by shifting more air. 2 12"s move twice as much air as 1 12 . Plus your amp configuration may deliver more power into 2 drivers bridged rather than just 1 driver, so you may be dropping power too - depending on how you've got things wired.

I'd wander over to http://www.carsound.net and try them?

Nick.

chiark

You could give me one of the subs. That'd save you some weight?

globbits

Nice one Chiark
You still interested in those two Phase Linear Alliante 8's? I've still got 'em if you are....

chiark

Mr Globbits, I've been rather upset by having to buy new tyres for the car so that's this month's budget buggered...

Adam M

aliante 8s?

nick, I am impressed with your taste.

I wouldnt buy em though )

how are the horns?

havet spoken to you since.

Still looking for the passives, if I find them I will send them up, sorry!

steve.

sorry mate but get with the programme.

why spend all the money on the engine to fill the boot with superfluous heavy crap.

be like me and ditch all base, and unnecessary amps.

I still have a smallish 4 channel running four speakers.

good sound in a car is futile, so give up.

I'd have gone for gimmicks such as sat nav and four decent component speakers.

Free up your boot, and make your car much faster at the same time.

Subs are for girls and children.

steve McCulloch

Thanks for that Adam - just what I needed to be told!

I'm slowly... finding out for myself that Stereo gear in the Scoob is a total waste of time

2 Genesis Amps
2 sets of Dyn Audio Speakers
2 sets of Focals
loads of leads
Farad capacitors
Expensive headunits
2 M510'S then 2 512's and I'm still hacked off with the system!!

Add to that the lights dimmer - even with the Farads - cos my battery didnt cost £600!

I'm 50/50 on ditching

I was thinking of putting on the Bilsteins - 10mm lower at the rear and 30mm lower at the front - that would even things out - but then If I took the box out to go on track then I'd need the suspension off again and another few hundred to PowerStation

Oh.... Choices, choices

After many £k's my car still sounds total pants compared to my home hi-fi - which I got for free from the parents, and its basic stuff like Technics (the speakers were Monitor though and cost them £700!) thats probably why it sounds good....

impy

if only you could get them for r/c scoobys

Tom

audio g man

1 10" In a small sealed box,200WRMS and your laughing all the way to the bank via as many race tracks as you can think of.

kryten

Remove one sub and you'll drop about 3dB (maybe more if the amp delivers more power into the parallel load).

You probably won't notice much difference in volume, though the 'kick' may change a bit. Hard to explain, but as the nice French lady in the ad says 'size matters'.

Moving more air = louder. Now, whether its better using 2 x 12s depends on how loud you want to go (or how deaf you want to be).

I settled on a single 12W6 in a sealed box - plently loud enough for me, especially after being totally stupid in a setup session a few years back: adjusting the phasing on an Audiocontrol processor while led in the boot.

What is 'missing' from the car system that you have at home?

Bass? Top-end? Stage width/depth? Imaging?

You've been chucking cash at the problem - can you be specific about what the problem actually is (don't worry, we've all done it!!).

With the cash I've spent on car hi-fi over the last few years I could have bought a decent second hand scoob!!

I got the RB5 pretty much spot on with door builds, custom amp racks, sub box, time alignment, parametric eq and minute attention to detail, plus hours of listening and RTA work: but it cost me big time and I can't be bothered going through the cost/hassle again. Now, like Adam, I've pretty much given up.

The BM has the stock system, which is nicely integrated but doesn't sound great though is fine for odd CDs and Radio.

I'll probably end up floging all the gear when I get round to it. Anyone after a full scoob system.....

David_Wallis

Steve..

Remove the offending subs (as its probably easier to sell both..) and throw them through a certain white scoobys window

Then go somewhere better and buy A lightweight Sub (They do exist) but you cant go with out a system or subs for that matter...

David

steve McCulloch

Russel

M510's sold to a mate - didnt see the point in offloading on this site - too many **** takers when it came to price - and no its very difficult to sell anything on here - I get questions like - can the subs be run at 8ohms.. whats the phasing - all I know is that both of them are dual 4 ohm - whatever the heck that means!!

Mr Wallis.....

Very funny.... but that would slow your car down sooo much it would only feel like a 'sport'.........

Kryten

Yes your sset up at the front was excellent... However on the track you played there was no bass at all.... I think I wanted Bass - I know that to get this I need to get rid of the Genesis amps and put in more powerful amps and then put in a couple of 1000wrms subs.. However, based on the current set up I dont think the car would survive. Its already had the rolls of silver lining placed just about everywhere and still I get rattles.
Oh... you were right about the Focals - truly rubbish - Dyn's were much better - I never learn... The focals just rattle at the front to ceratin frequency's regardless of the level of soundproofing - they can take a fair bit of power but dont have any depth of clarity.

I found out why the Dyns were going as well - clipping on the amp through not having a Farad.... serves me right with the power I was running - shame certain outfits could not spot this - took a couple of friends and a stereo outfit to spot this - may well ditch the Focals now and go back to the Dyns again.........

What I want in a system is the nice bass beat I get on the home system - I mean nice deeeeeppppp basss that gives me a lovely head massage - I have heard plenty of sound systems in the last 6 months - the owners were all beaming until I comment that their system sounds utter pants - I dont want a car that rattles the car to bits in the process.. Nice deeepp bass - I have not heard a set up with this yet - Leeds Car Audio's demonstrator came reasonably close and I think they forked out about £10k at Retail to get this - but it still was not perfect....

I think as Adam says the solution is to Ditch the subs and the amp and the Farad I recently put in - I may do it later in the year.... when I really am truly fed upppp...

But you know me - never satisfied - whether its stereo gear or car engine and other modification - perhaps I should buy a cheap car and become a Kev boy racer - sooo much cheaper..

russell hayward

I have three 10W6's powered by a Genesis Monoblock, which is more than adequate.

David_Wallis

Steve... the white scooby I was suggesting wasnt mine.. it was possibly the person that supplied you them...

Which demonsrator at leeds car audio came close.. was it the scoob with three jl's (or it has last time) or was it the bmw.. (now replaced with a seriously fast porcshe)

David

russell hayward

JL Audio 10W6 Sub

steve McCulloch

Russell

Ooops - put my foot in it again. Of course - what I meant to say was that its all personal preference............

My comment was actually aimed at the components - I've only heard a fairly basic JL Audio sub so that does not count.........

3*10's are supposed to give a better set up than 2*12 - But then this would have cost me about an extra £300...

kryten

Steve, my car was setup to how I like it and I don't care what anyone else things IIRC when you listened, the sub wasn't even connected!

The problems of getting bass around the car without rattling it to bits are difficult. In a scoob they are almost impossible!!

You don't _NEED_ 1000w+. What you need is a system designed and tuned to how _you_ want it to sound.

I've had 'big bass' systems in the past, the best of which from a pure volume point of view was an old Kenwood 1021 (440w RMS) driving a pair of Rockford 12s. You could literally move people's hair/clothing with the air flow. However, that was in a Mondeo which had a huge boost at 40Hz. To be honest, the system sounded pretty kak overall, but it was _loud_.

The scoob was a really difficult car to work with because of the build quality (!) and the fact its a saloon and not a hatch. The Time Alignment made a big difference to the integration of the fronts and the sub.

Power supply is adequate but if its while you are driving that you want to listen, batteries won't help. The alternator kicks out 14+ volts and that's what you need, so get a bigger one (or two) - but how the **** can you fit it under the bonnet? I managed with a 1F cap that seemed to just about cope.

I'd be interested in an RTA plot of your home stereo output! Low bass is easier to achieve in car, due to the cabin gain but.

My guess is that what you're after is more 'kick' in the 60-120Hz region and that is VERY hard to achieve in car as subs need to be kept below 80Hz.

Also, you don't have any sort of EQ. Due to the compromises in-car you NEED one to make adjustments!

What you're trying to achieve cannot be done cheaply. If you don't have the time/effort/budget (change from £7k?) then I think you'll be disappointed.

Just buy a bigger turbo instead

russell hayward

Let me know if you want to offload any of your Genesis amps !

Ta

ps still got the M510's ?



[Edited by russell hayward - 5/7/2002 9:53:58 PM]

steve McCulloch

Dave

seriously fast Porsche.. fancy setting up a stereo business....

The White Scoob (Ians) had 2 or was it three DLS 12 inch subs powered by a ridiculous amount of ampage.......

Didnt realise they'd put in JL - Ian commented that JL were total crappp when I was there over a year ago.... - I'd have to agree - JL Audio is probably the worst stereo ger I have ever heard - almost worst than standard 30w speakers.... (esp in 22b's as I recall........)

Russell

Whats a 10W6?

[Edited by steve McCulloch - 5/8/2002 12:46:14 PM]