Turbo help please
17 May 2013, 08:42 PM
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Turbo help please
Hi. I have a 2003 blobeye sti. Its had a decat downpipe , fuel pump , filter and map ... I am now tempted to swap the turbo for more power , but struggling to get decent info on whats available.
I'm basically trying to find out if there is a turbo that is a direct bolt on , that will work if we my current injectors / downpipe etc etc but can produce more power simply fitted and mapped ?
I appreciate small modification may be required , but something along then lines?
Any input appreciated , thanks , Chris
I'm basically trying to find out if there is a turbo that is a direct bolt on , that will work if we my current injectors / downpipe etc etc but can produce more power simply fitted and mapped ?
I appreciate small modification may be required , but something along then lines?
Any input appreciated , thanks , Chris
17 May 2013, 09:02 PM
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Thanks. Just had a look in the website , only showing 320-340bhp ? I'm running around 315 now so doesn't seem a decent gain for the effort , I expect I could get near that with with my vf35 ?
17 May 2013, 09:07 PM
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The sc series are designed by there name, i.e 36 = 360, 42 = 420
However......
Have a look at the thread in the trader section by scoobyclinic and see what results they've achieved...
The reason i suggested the 36 was due to your mods.
If you want to go higher you're really going to have to start stock piling parts.
However......
Have a look at the thread in the trader section by scoobyclinic and see what results they've achieved...
The reason i suggested the 36 was due to your mods.
If you want to go higher you're really going to have to start stock piling parts.
17 May 2013, 10:48 PM
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Having been chasing different gains over a decade of tuning my Wagon my advice is really simple:
Driveability over power EVERY time.
Slap an MD321V or an RCM 500 onto a 2 litre motor and be prepared for pretty tedious existence of laggy spool.
I have had an VF28, VF30, VF22, RCM400, RCM450, RCM500- I now have a scoobyclinic supplied Blousch SC460 on my 2.5 motor.
Basically if your after driveability you need to have meaningful boost by 3500rpm and proper boost by 4000rpm otherwise you will have to get used to a lot more peaky power delivery.
When we go out with the MSOC boys the Twin Scrollers in the 350-380hp range all make strong power lower down.
My advice is be realistic, if its a daily driver pick a mid 350hp type turbo
RCM400, AForrest TD04
HOWEVER the newer generation of SC range turbos are absolutely fantastic!!
spool hard and early. My 2.5 with an SC460 makes 503hp on methanol..........and 523ft/lbs at 4500rpm.
Don't get fooled into the peak hp game. strong early torque characteristics are were way more speed and progress than bigger power 1000rpm later in the rev range.
SC for me all the way.....
Driveability over power EVERY time.
Slap an MD321V or an RCM 500 onto a 2 litre motor and be prepared for pretty tedious existence of laggy spool.
I have had an VF28, VF30, VF22, RCM400, RCM450, RCM500- I now have a scoobyclinic supplied Blousch SC460 on my 2.5 motor.
Basically if your after driveability you need to have meaningful boost by 3500rpm and proper boost by 4000rpm otherwise you will have to get used to a lot more peaky power delivery.
When we go out with the MSOC boys the Twin Scrollers in the 350-380hp range all make strong power lower down.
My advice is be realistic, if its a daily driver pick a mid 350hp type turbo
RCM400, AForrest TD04
HOWEVER the newer generation of SC range turbos are absolutely fantastic!!
spool hard and early. My 2.5 with an SC460 makes 503hp on methanol..........and 523ft/lbs at 4500rpm.
Don't get fooled into the peak hp game. strong early torque characteristics are were way more speed and progress than bigger power 1000rpm later in the rev range.
SC for me all the way.....
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18 May 2013, 08:26 AM
#8
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The sc turbos my mates have brought have had nothing but problems and none of them made the power they said they would so I won't be buying me from them ,,,one of there current housings is having problems with the welds leaking :-(
18 May 2013, 09:13 AM
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Having been chasing different gains over a decade of tuning my Wagon my advice is really simple:
Driveability over power EVERY time.
Slap an MD321V or an RCM 500 onto a 2 litre motor and be prepared for pretty tedious existence of laggy spool.
I have had an VF28, VF30, VF22, RCM400, RCM450, RCM500- I now have a scoobyclinic supplied Blousch SC460 on my 2.5 motor.
Basically if your after driveability you need to have meaningful boost by 3500rpm and proper boost by 4000rpm otherwise you will have to get used to a lot more peaky power delivery.
When we go out with the MSOC boys the Twin Scrollers in the 350-380hp range all make strong power lower down.
My advice is be realistic, if its a daily driver pick a mid 350hp type turbo
RCM400, AForrest TD04
HOWEVER the newer generation of SC range turbos are absolutely fantastic!!
spool hard and early. My 2.5 with an SC460 makes 503hp on methanol..........and 523ft/lbs at 4500rpm.
Don't get fooled into the peak hp game. strong early torque characteristics are were way more speed and progress than bigger power 1000rpm later in the rev range.
SC for me all the way.....
Driveability over power EVERY time.
Slap an MD321V or an RCM 500 onto a 2 litre motor and be prepared for pretty tedious existence of laggy spool.
I have had an VF28, VF30, VF22, RCM400, RCM450, RCM500- I now have a scoobyclinic supplied Blousch SC460 on my 2.5 motor.
Basically if your after driveability you need to have meaningful boost by 3500rpm and proper boost by 4000rpm otherwise you will have to get used to a lot more peaky power delivery.
When we go out with the MSOC boys the Twin Scrollers in the 350-380hp range all make strong power lower down.
My advice is be realistic, if its a daily driver pick a mid 350hp type turbo
RCM400, AForrest TD04
HOWEVER the newer generation of SC range turbos are absolutely fantastic!!
spool hard and early. My 2.5 with an SC460 makes 503hp on methanol..........and 523ft/lbs at 4500rpm.
Don't get fooled into the peak hp game. strong early torque characteristics are were way more speed and progress than bigger power 1000rpm later in the rev range.
SC for me all the way.....
I know very little about subaru's I've always had vw's. I'm not just after big numbers , my last sat car was a edition 30 gti running revo stage 2+ ( 347bhp ) and it had a dsg gearbox , it was a lovely drive , smooth , loads of torque and loads of top end.
I love my sti, but it is my daily car in use it for nippingto the gym / shops / work ... And its great when I'm ragging it but its not great round town.
Any thoughts on the vf48 from the new sti hatch ? Been told this is a direct replacement and makes good power ?
19 May 2013, 01:06 AM
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get a td05-18g preferably a harvey/zen/afp one, half the price of the sc range and does exactly what it says on the tin, havent heard anything bad about the sc stuff but they are expensive atm
2nd hand one costs about 300 but harder to find and make between 360-380 usually
2nd hand one costs about 300 but harder to find and make between 360-380 usually
20 May 2013, 09:36 AM
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Been offered a vf34, vf48 , and considering a new td05 18g.
Spoke to dynamix who says the vf48 is a good option but since been offered the vf34 and don't want to pester him .. Any thoughts on these 3 ? There are so many varied opinions / answers when I search ...
Spoke to dynamix who says the vf48 is a good option but since been offered the vf34 and don't want to pester him .. Any thoughts on these 3 ? There are so many varied opinions / answers when I search ...
21 May 2013, 08:07 AM
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21 May 2013, 02:00 PM
#17
To offer a different perspective, my SC42 made 412bhp on a kinked inlet hose and ECUTek, then 432bhp on a Perrin inlet hose with Alcatek, mate's made 421 on Alcatek, both on VPower only (and his made 471bhp on 20% meth).
Same chap recently went 2.1 stroker and with 20% meth, the turbo and engine made 506bhp so I'd say it's more than capable!
I've also seen another SC42, and an SC40 both make more than quoted power.
If you don't have decent supporting mods or the fitting's not up to scratch I'd suggest that's more likely to blame.
Anyway....back on track, with the mods in this thread, I'd suggest SC38 would get the OP better mid range than the 36 will offer.
Or a billet 18g like others have suggested.
vf34 - seriously wouldn't bother.
For the silly money they fetch you can do better IMHO!
I have run a vf35, (non billet) 20g, and now an SC42 on my 05 STI (and a TD04 and vf35 on my old WRX
).The 20g was a good turbo, but the SC42 gives me the better top end I wanted, but at an expensive price admittedly.
On a good top mount, a 20g or 18g is nuts and acceleration is bonkers.
A FMIC will make delivery more gradual and less savage, and makes more power, but I honestly think the TMIC gives you the best for a point A to B car.
The SC42 also comes in later than the 20g on my 2.0 so it means a few more gear changes to avoid getting caught out on occasion. The 20g on the top mount really wasn't all that different in terms of power delivery to the vf35 according to my "bum dyno"
The SC42 is great fun for embarassing M3's and similar mind
Last edited by MrNoisy; 21 May 2013 at 02:05 PM.
21 May 2013, 02:16 PM
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First I've heard of this, surprised you haven't contacted them or posted on their massive thread on here
To offer a different perspective, my SC42 made 412bhp on a kinked inlet hose and ECUTek, then 432bhp on a Perrin inlet hose with Alcatek, mate's made 421 on Alcatek, both on VPower only (and his made 471bhp on 20% meth).
Same chap recently went 2.1 stroker and with 20% meth, the turbo and engine made 506bhp so I'd say it's more than capable!
I've also seen another SC42, and an SC40 both make more than quoted power.
If you don't have decent supporting mods or the fitting's not up to scratch I'd suggest that's more likely to blame.
Anyway....back on track, with the mods in this thread, I'd suggest SC38 would get the OP better mid range than the 36 will offer.
Or a billet 18g like others have suggested.
vf34 - seriously wouldn't bother.
For the silly money they fetch you can do better IMHO!
I have run a vf35, (non billet) 20g, and now an SC42 on my 05 STI (and a TD04 and vf35 on my old WRX ).
The 20g was a good turbo, but the SC42 gives me the better top end I wanted, but at an expensive price admittedly.
On a good top mount, a 20g or 18g is nuts and acceleration is bonkers.
A FMIC will make delivery more gradual and less savage, and makes more power, but I honestly think the TMIC gives you the best for a point A to B car.
The SC42 also comes in later than the 20g on my 2.0 so it means a few more gear changes to avoid getting caught out on occasion. The 20g on the top mount really wasn't all that different in terms of power delivery to the vf35 according to my "bum dyno"
The SC42 is great fun for embarassing M3's and similar mind
To offer a different perspective, my SC42 made 412bhp on a kinked inlet hose and ECUTek, then 432bhp on a Perrin inlet hose with Alcatek, mate's made 421 on Alcatek, both on VPower only (and his made 471bhp on 20% meth).
Same chap recently went 2.1 stroker and with 20% meth, the turbo and engine made 506bhp so I'd say it's more than capable!
I've also seen another SC42, and an SC40 both make more than quoted power.
If you don't have decent supporting mods or the fitting's not up to scratch I'd suggest that's more likely to blame.
Anyway....back on track, with the mods in this thread, I'd suggest SC38 would get the OP better mid range than the 36 will offer.
Or a billet 18g like others have suggested.
vf34 - seriously wouldn't bother.
For the silly money they fetch you can do better IMHO!
I have run a vf35, (non billet) 20g, and now an SC42 on my 05 STI (and a TD04 and vf35 on my old WRX
).The 20g was a good turbo, but the SC42 gives me the better top end I wanted, but at an expensive price admittedly.
On a good top mount, a 20g or 18g is nuts and acceleration is bonkers.
A FMIC will make delivery more gradual and less savage, and makes more power, but I honestly think the TMIC gives you the best for a point A to B car.
The SC42 also comes in later than the 20g on my 2.0 so it means a few more gear changes to avoid getting caught out on occasion. The 20g on the top mount really wasn't all that different in terms of power delivery to the vf35 according to my "bum dyno"
The SC42 is great fun for embarassing M3's and similar mind
21 May 2013, 02:37 PM
#19
I'd say yes mate.
The vf35 on your car is capable, with the right mods, of achieving around 350bhp max.
However, even pushing it to that limit, IMHO the mid range acceleration will never be as good as a well setup 18g or 20g as they will keep you going.
My biggest issue with the vf35 (and I suspect a standard 16g would display similar characteristics) was that it ran out of puff too early and fourth and fifth gear acceleration felt poor.
When I swapped to a 20g (was a rebuilt AET job), whilst still on TMIC, the car felt a *lot* quicker accelerating.
It didn't make much top end, but later we realised this was because my TMIC was basically knackered.
The 18g acceleration should be quicker still, and you'll be able to retain your standard injectors.
It really depends what you're aiming for. If you want to go silly fast, probably go 20g or even SC42.
If you're less fussed about that but want quick accleration for overtaking but more in the midrange so you don't run out of puff half way through an overtake, I'd recommend 18g.
Also, I seem to recall STI's still have a cat in the centre section.
They don't have one in the up pipe but fairly certain they still have a downpipe and centre section one as standard so as you've already done the down pipe would be daft not to do the centre as well.
Prodrive systems are half decent, but you can pick up any decent 2.5" system secondhand nowadays for silly money that will do the job.
The vf35 on your car is capable, with the right mods, of achieving around 350bhp max.
However, even pushing it to that limit, IMHO the mid range acceleration will never be as good as a well setup 18g or 20g as they will keep you going.
My biggest issue with the vf35 (and I suspect a standard 16g would display similar characteristics) was that it ran out of puff too early and fourth and fifth gear acceleration felt poor.
When I swapped to a 20g (was a rebuilt AET job), whilst still on TMIC, the car felt a *lot* quicker accelerating.
It didn't make much top end, but later we realised this was because my TMIC was basically knackered.
The 18g acceleration should be quicker still, and you'll be able to retain your standard injectors.
It really depends what you're aiming for. If you want to go silly fast, probably go 20g or even SC42.
If you're less fussed about that but want quick accleration for overtaking but more in the midrange so you don't run out of puff half way through an overtake, I'd recommend 18g.
Also, I seem to recall STI's still have a cat in the centre section.
They don't have one in the up pipe but fairly certain they still have a downpipe and centre section one as standard so as you've already done the down pipe would be daft not to do the centre as well.
Prodrive systems are half decent, but you can pick up any decent 2.5" system secondhand nowadays for silly money that will do the job.
Last edited by MrNoisy; 21 May 2013 at 02:39 PM.
21 May 2013, 04:26 PM
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some good advice there.
i think a vf34 wouldnt be enough of an upgrade , imo the 20g is a bit laggy ,decent top end but i wanted the power in the midrange. ive got an 18g and it was andy f who had a graph of the 18g v 20g that persuaded me to get one, the 18g beat the 20g powerwise all the way to 7k.
the sc range are all good but expensive and the md321h is what i would love tbh but finding a second hand one is next to impossible
i think a vf34 wouldnt be enough of an upgrade , imo the 20g is a bit laggy ,decent top end but i wanted the power in the midrange. ive got an 18g and it was andy f who had a graph of the 18g v 20g that persuaded me to get one, the 18g beat the 20g powerwise all the way to 7k.
the sc range are all good but expensive and the md321h is what i would love tbh but finding a second hand one is next to impossible
21 May 2013, 04:58 PM
#21
some good advice there.
i think a vf34 wouldnt be enough of an upgrade , imo the 20g is a bit laggy ,decent top end but i wanted the power in the midrange. ive got an 18g and it was andy f who had a graph of the 18g v 20g that persuaded me to get one, the 18g beat the 20g powerwise all the way to 7k.
the sc range are all good but expensive and the md321h is what i would love tbh but finding a second hand one is next to impossible
i think a vf34 wouldnt be enough of an upgrade , imo the 20g is a bit laggy ,decent top end but i wanted the power in the midrange. ive got an 18g and it was andy f who had a graph of the 18g v 20g that persuaded me to get one, the 18g beat the 20g powerwise all the way to 7k.
the sc range are all good but expensive and the md321h is what i would love tbh but finding a second hand one is next to impossible
I think I'm correct in saying that a 321H is still a modified 20g, same as the SC40 when it was in production, and same as the SC38 is an 18g.
On a top mount with AVCS on mine I really didn't find the 20g laggy at all, and on a back to back graph with my old vf35, there was literally about 3-400rpm in it with spool up IIRC.
After going to front mount, acceleration was more progressive with more top end but honestly I'd say I preferred the TMIC bonkers kick you in the back repeatedly feel to the car.
The SC42 is nuts fast when it kicks in just after 4000rpm, but the lag until then is much more evident, on a 2.0 anyway.
That said - still LOVE it - it's fun to accelerate quick, but to show a clean pair of heels to an M3 or similar spec car that costs more than 5x more than mine did to build does make you smile that little bit more (it's the child in me).
Last edited by MrNoisy; 21 May 2013 at 05:01 PM.
22 May 2013, 09:48 AM
#24
Scooby Regular
First I've heard of this, surprised you haven't contacted them or posted on their massive thread on here
To offer a different perspective, my SC42 made 412bhp on a kinked inlet hose and ECUTek, then 432bhp on a Perrin inlet hose with Alcatek, mate's made 421 on Alcatek, both on VPower only (and his made 471bhp on 20% meth).
Same chap recently went 2.1 stroker and with 20% meth, the turbo and engine made 506bhp so I'd say it's more than capable!
I've also seen another SC42, and an SC40 both make more than quoted power.
If you don't have decent supporting mods or the fitting's not up to scratch I'd suggest that's more likely to blame.
Anyway....back on track, with the mods in this thread, I'd suggest SC38 would get the OP better mid range than the 36 will offer.
Or a billet 18g like others have suggested.
vf34 - seriously wouldn't bother.
For the silly money they fetch you can do better IMHO!
I have run a vf35, (non billet) 20g, and now an SC42 on my 05 STI (and a TD04 and vf35 on my old WRX ).
The 20g was a good turbo, but the SC42 gives me the better top end I wanted, but at an expensive price admittedly.
On a good top mount, a 20g or 18g is nuts and acceleration is bonkers.
A FMIC will make delivery more gradual and less savage, and makes more power, but I honestly think the TMIC gives you the best for a point A to B car.
The SC42 also comes in later than the 20g on my 2.0 so it means a few more gear changes to avoid getting caught out on occasion. The 20g on the top mount really wasn't all that different in terms of power delivery to the vf35 according to my "bum dyno"
The SC42 is great fun for embarassing M3's and similar mind
To offer a different perspective, my SC42 made 412bhp on a kinked inlet hose and ECUTek, then 432bhp on a Perrin inlet hose with Alcatek, mate's made 421 on Alcatek, both on VPower only (and his made 471bhp on 20% meth).
Same chap recently went 2.1 stroker and with 20% meth, the turbo and engine made 506bhp so I'd say it's more than capable!
I've also seen another SC42, and an SC40 both make more than quoted power.
If you don't have decent supporting mods or the fitting's not up to scratch I'd suggest that's more likely to blame.
Anyway....back on track, with the mods in this thread, I'd suggest SC38 would get the OP better mid range than the 36 will offer.
Or a billet 18g like others have suggested.
vf34 - seriously wouldn't bother.
For the silly money they fetch you can do better IMHO!
I have run a vf35, (non billet) 20g, and now an SC42 on my 05 STI (and a TD04 and vf35 on my old WRX
).The 20g was a good turbo, but the SC42 gives me the better top end I wanted, but at an expensive price admittedly.
On a good top mount, a 20g or 18g is nuts and acceleration is bonkers.
A FMIC will make delivery more gradual and less savage, and makes more power, but I honestly think the TMIC gives you the best for a point A to B car.
The SC42 also comes in later than the 20g on my 2.0 so it means a few more gear changes to avoid getting caught out on occasion. The 20g on the top mount really wasn't all that different in terms of power delivery to the vf35 according to my "bum dyno"
The SC42 is great fun for embarassing M3's and similar mind
We have sent them back and they have sent out another turbo that's ment to be the same but with a cast housing ,,this turbo has a massive rear housing compared to the welded one so was extremely laggy and the owner wasn't happy at all so sent that one back only to be told he would have to have another welded one that is going to leak again in the near future so he isn't happy at all and it never made the power expected on that car or my other mates car and the both very high spec (running Perrin or RCM stuff no cheap parts at all) and mapped by very good mappers (both diffrent mappers)
Last edited by domino46; 22 May 2013 at 09:50 AM.
22 May 2013, 04:56 PM
#25
Well I know 3 other SC42 owners (plus myself) who will watch this thread with interest!
How long did you have the turbo on the car (and what spec?) before you encountered these problems? From new?
I know you said the housing was leaking, but which version was this?
How long did you have the turbo on the car (and what spec?) before you encountered these problems? From new?
I know you said the housing was leaking, but which version was this?
Last edited by MrNoisy; 22 May 2013 at 05:09 PM.
22 May 2013, 09:33 PM
#26
Scooby Regular
The first turbo that went was on the car for a year but its a show/track car so done less than 1000 miles from new before it started leaking very badly,,even the welds were leaking not just the gaps in between the welds
,,,the car was running 400bhp ish with all the proper bits along with it,,that one was a sc46 I believe ,,,sc swapped that one out for the new cast housing but the extra lag was insane and it couldn't be driven unless it was mapped as you could tell it wasn't the same rear housing (sc said its exactly the same lol),,,,ill get my mate to jump on this thread as he is a bit more technical than me and he has also seen this with his own eyes,,,,,my other mate had a sc42 running a forged 2.1 with 20% meth and only made 420 mapped by ET
23 May 2013, 06:52 AM
#27
I have seen several SC42 and SC46 with this exhaust housing fault.
Never seen one MD321 turbo suffer a failure. Still makes them a better turbo in my opinion and much better resale value (unfortunately if you are buying).
FYI MrNoisey - the MD321H is not a 20G nor even a modified 20G. All the MD321 range are garret cored ball bearing turbos.
Never seen one MD321 turbo suffer a failure. Still makes them a better turbo in my opinion and much better resale value (unfortunately if you are buying).
FYI MrNoisey - the MD321H is not a 20G nor even a modified 20G. All the MD321 range are garret cored ball bearing turbos.
23 May 2013, 07:32 AM
#28
Scooby Regular
I have seen several SC42 and SC46 with this exhaust housing fault.
Never seen one MD321 turbo suffer a failure. Still makes them a better turbo in my opinion and much better resale value (unfortunately if you are buying).
FYI MrNoisey - the MD321H is not a 20G nor even a modified 20G. All the MD321 range are garret cored ball bearing turbos.
Never seen one MD321 turbo suffer a failure. Still makes them a better turbo in my opinion and much better resale value (unfortunately if you are buying).
FYI MrNoisey - the MD321H is not a 20G nor even a modified 20G. All the MD321 range are garret cored ball bearing turbos.
Have to agree if it was my money I'd be buying the MD or Owen developments turbos
23 May 2013, 03:32 PM
#29
Thanks Duncan, tbh I did say I wasn't sure on the 321 series, the SC's are just re-branded Blouch items as far as I'm aware.
Bit concerned now re all this exhaust housing business.
My SC42 will have been on the car for 3 months tomorrow.
I'm fairly pleased with it, bit laggier than I expected, but still pretty decent (I can always add meth I suppose).
Looks like 321T billets don't spool any earlier from graphs I've seen, and the extra £3-400 odd they cost put me off somewhat.
Bit concerned now re all this exhaust housing business.
My SC42 will have been on the car for 3 months tomorrow.
I'm fairly pleased with it, bit laggier than I expected, but still pretty decent (I can always add meth I suppose).
Looks like 321T billets don't spool any earlier from graphs I've seen, and the extra £3-400 odd they cost put me off somewhat.
Last edited by MrNoisy; 23 May 2013 at 04:13 PM.