t999cuk

Hi guys I'm sure this question has been asked many times and has many different answers, plus I'm sure people will say just search or ask around engine builders.

Basically nothing wrong with my hawkeye sti (at the moment) but as its already on its second engine from subaru i just think sonetime in the next twelve month I'd like to get a forged rebuild, partly for peace of mind partly for future proofing. I'd like to see 450bhp I know I'll obviously need injectors, exhaust turbo etc etc. I'm just trying to get an idea what it's going to cost to get the engine ready pistons, rods, any pumps and any work need on the block that sort of thing and cost involved to get this done.


Many thanks in advance.

Tom

mazmike

iTrader: (5)

3200

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

Tom

I have an 07 Hawk STI currently running 350 BHP and I am getting that exact work done right now as we speak and I am looking for the same power as you (450).

My build is Wossner forged pistons, Carrillo forged Rods, ACL Race Bearings, ARP head studs, uprated headgaskets, seals & cam covers, Sump & oil pipe. It's costing me £2,500 all in. Good up to 500BHP. If you want to go further you will need a 14mm head stud conversion & best get the block pinned as well.

Then in addition to get to the 450 you will need to upgrade your bolt ons:

MD321T turbo
DeatschWerks injectors
HRC HF340LPH race grade fuel pump
Front Mount Intercooler
Optional - fuel pressure regulator, RCM Headers & up-pipe, Full 3" Exhaust

It can get scary

mickywrx

iTrader: (29)

That's a good price, who's building it? If you don't mind me asking.

Closed decking will be better than pinning the block though.

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

Andy Kindon - Do you know him?

mickywrx

iTrader: (29)

Met him once or twice.

Can't comment on his work, as I've never had any done, or 1st hand experience. What I know/heard could only be classed as hearsay, so the only place for it is in my head.

rob84

iTrader: (5)

I was about to ask the same question myself, £2500 seems too cheap in my eyes especially when you seem some of the parts being used & machining going into it

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

I've had loads of work done by him and know plenty of people who have had forged engines built by him so I have no worries on that front.

Are you from around the Kenton area? Did I buy some top radiator brackets off you a few weeks ago? Your car looks like the one I saw in the garage being worked on if it was you!

Cheers bud

mickywrx

iTrader: (29)

Not from Kenton, and I didn't sell you any brackets. So wasn't mine mate.

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

OK mate - my mistake (guess! )

fasteddie84

iTrader: (1)

Well I am having the same done too although just a rebuild at present.

I was told that for 420 to 440, you would need the following:

Crank bearing set (tri metal race bearings)
11mm Stud set
STi gasket & seal set
Modded oil pump
Belt
Big end bolt set

This will set you back between £1,800 and £2,200 plus VAT depending on parts and labour involved.

To go over, you would need the rods which will cost between £400 and £600 plus VAT, once again, depending on parts used.

For over the 380 mark, the TMIC will need to be replaced along with the injectors and the turbo which are all at their limit around that.

For over 400, you would need new headers/manifold and up-pipe as with ported headers, you would be lucky to see 400. Headers and up-pie will be around £450 plus VAT and it may be worth wrapping them in decent heat-wrap.

Depending on what you are going to use the car for, whilst the engine is out, it may be a good idea to put in a sump baffle.

I haven't looked into clutches yet but mine has an uprated exedy clutch which was fitted by the previous owner and I believe it can handle 360bhp. Not sure which one you would be best going for if you are aiming for 450 but bear in mind that a new one will cost between £500 and £1,000.

It's a lot of money to go over 380 bhp as you will need a FMIC, injectors, turbo, clutch etc which alone will set you back around £3,000 and when taken into account the engine rebuild and remap, you won't see much change out of £6k!

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

It's a lot more than 6k to get that power from a hawk
"Reliability " & as a daily driver
Your torque level will be nothing short of amazing & peak torque will be in the low 4000rpm
Everything will need addressed
I was in & still am in that boat
Looking back wish I'd just bought a type 25 oh the joys the joys

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

You wont need to do anything with the manifold, they are good for over 500bhp, if you wanted to do anything then just have the standard ones ported, they are about the best you can get.
TMIC is good for over 400bhp (just look at the type 25's for that, mk2) so you can save a packet just by not buying the uppipe (not needed) or the manifold (also not needed).
Injectors and fuel pump are on the books if you go for 400bhp in a new age STI, but most of the rest... nah.
Baffled sump... well if you are taking the car on regular track days, its worth it then but as a road car, not really worth it.

Tony

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

^
I thought we were talking 500 it sub 5 cars here Tony
Not 400 ( headscratch )
The price for that 100 or over is not a cheap one by all means

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

I have indeed saved a packet Tony as that is exactly what my engine builder said to me!

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

Marietto
Your intensions must be for a 400 build then
Then why go for a front mount & md321t as described in your earlier post ?

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

Looking for around about the 440-450 mark mate

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

Then I would go for SC46 or MD321V
If you choose the latter , grab yourself a bargain , Wiley has 1 for sale at mo on marketplace , big saving
& I wouldn't trust the 0e oil pick up at that power level
Your car / your choice - hope it all works for ya

Merry Xmas all

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Its not cheap when you go for 500bhp on the 2.5, you need it pinned and linered properly as the block isnt exactly strong or you can just get the block converted to a CDB from SCDB, think the cost is around 1500 quid but it will be stronger
Alyn at AS do these conversions

Tony

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

I've seen the V Wiley has for sale mate but I've talked it all over with my builder and I am confident in his advice. I am fairly new to this sort of power bracket so am taking advice from all I have probably forgotten some of the things he said but I do remember him saying something about changing the oil pick up pipe and changing to a classic sump? That might mean something to you bud but not a lot to me!

I have a shopping list of the bolt on bits, which I will obviously not be doing all at once due to the costs but at least the engine build will be there to support them when I can afford to!

Thanks for the advice, it is very much appreciated and have an awesome Xmas & New Year mate

fasteddie84

iTrader: (1)

I see no-one has mentioned clutches. I am new to this and have done a bit of research on what parts to get but not looked heavly into which turbo to get (as I don't know how much I want to spend yet) or clutches.

I assume that the standard clutch won't work over a certain torque figure (anyone know what this is roughly) so what are people thoughts on a clutch for a 400bhp car, a 450bhp car and a 500bhp. Just want to see what is best to buy now so that I can bolt bits on to increase the power without having to worry about changing the clutch.

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

You have the exedy stage 1 ( pink box ) in now
API
Latteral as your power increases
Lightened flywheel , but the 2.5 won't like sitting at 2000rpm with this
6th gear will be a thing of the past below 3k

t999cuk

Love how these threads get carried away lol

I'm just kind of after knowing how much the block work and forged parts will cost pistons rods etc...

Basically what I'd be looking at paying some where like api or scooby clinic to take my engine out make it "forged" and safe for 400-450bhp.

I know it would be more cost effective to get it all done at once but bolt on parts will have to wait till I save a bit more money!!

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

I know what you mean bud - before you know it we are in 600BHP territory! We are both in the same boat - forged engine now, bolt on bits later when funds allow! Good luck with it!

jazzyjembreaze

iTrader: (11)

T99
I suggest you email your builder of choice because you obv havnt a clue
Your price will determine the products you choose
Pistons alone I can think of many options
With prices been vry different
This is something your builder will discuss & also how deep your pockets are .
The build you have will reflect on what you put into it .

Regards

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi there

We are run 2.1L Open Deck Block at 490bhp without the one problem,we are track the car,we are been on drag strip numerous times and engine has been spotless,as our engine builder said,we should be able push engine up to 550bhp without the problem

If you are thinking break 500bhp,would suggest speak to Alyn@AS Performance about the CDB insert

About the parts,speak to the Trevor@Real Street performance,yes is from USA,but still you will save some money

http://realstreetperformance.com/store/




Jura

prodriverules

iTrader: (52)

You wouldn't want to know the amount I've spent on mine

t999cuk

Cheers, I think luck is something I'm gonna need lots of. Of two minds if I should have bought a jdm hawkeye, certainly would have made it easier seem to be plenty of them quite safely running 450. But I do love the torque from the 2.5, had a twin scroll conversion on my old bugeye wrx loved the sound and pulled well and hard but the shove in the back from the 2.5 is epic.

Good luck with yours

t999cuk

Cheers Jura I will certainly look into them, bit scared about building it myself though!

Your wagon is epic by the way

Marietto

iTrader: (13)

You don't need luck mate, just a decent engine builder who knows what they are talking about. My Hawkeye is running 350 & 370 ft/lbs and the torque is lovely. Will hopefully get some more next year after I have all the bits and a good remap. Have a great Xmas & New Year mate and hope you get sorted with yours.

Mario