Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

Hi all, Ive had a few threads recently concerning my Scoob and everyone has said basically that my next stage is a remap, now this is where I get confused as like Ive said before, Ive come from the world of Classic Fords where ECUs arent really spoken about..

So, the car is a 95 JDM WRX with various mods (and a couple more planned), and a standard unmapped Z4 ECU.

Ive seen various terms floating about on here, Apexi Power FC, Ecutek, Simtek, chips, daughterboards, all this is a bit confusing to me..

Ive seen an Apexi Power FC (with hand controller) on eBay to suit my car. Its £300 plus a little for postage, which I think is reasonable looking at others at around £400 - £450?

But, I don't know if this a sensible route to go down? If I did buy it and fit it, how much roughly would it cost me on top for it to be mapped? Would it cost the same to map that as it would to map my Z4 ECU? If so I may aswell just get mine mapped?

Im looking for advice really as I don't really know what route to go down, its all new to me

Many thanks in advance!

53

iTrader: (41)

£300 is a good price, looking at £200-300 for mapping, and you need a boost controller or AVCR if you want to run more than 1.1 bar of boost £200. Apexi is a good bit of kit and will cost about £700 I reckon. Other option is ESL daughter board which is £550 IIRC. If the new boards that were released for 97/98 cars are available for the earlier cars I would go ESL I like the Apexi commander unit though which gives useful monitoring, and the AVCR setup holds boost lovely.

Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

So with buying this PFC, boost controller and mapping, Id be looking at £700 - £800?
And to remap my ECU would be about £550 all in? Is that what EcuTek is, remapping my ECU?

It'd make sense to go for the latter then? Unless there is a substantial gain from going down the Apexi route?

53

iTrader: (41)

ESL not ecutek

Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

See this is where I get confused lol.. Are they just different software? Does it make a difference?

Thanks for the help

53

iTrader: (41)

As I said ESL is a daughter board. Ecutek is software but not an option on your car so forget it

Your best bet is to research, ESL (daughter board), APEXI (ECU), Simtek (ECU) on google and on here and see which one best suits your car now and where you want to go in the future

Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

Ok thankyou for the help bud!

Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

Oh one last question, the boost controller you mentioned for the Apexi set up, do I need it? Could I buy the PFC, have it mapped then add the boost controller at a later date and have the map tweaked if I want more boost? Or is that not possible/daft? Cheers

53

iTrader: (41)

Yes, but you'll be limited to about 1.1bar if it's done safely not so important on a later car to have the AVCR, but early cars have crap map sensors and even if you replace the map sensor for a later one the boost control is pap

You don't have to get an AVCR you could get an electronic boost controller or an Apexi boost controller (part of the full AVCR,but direct ECU plugin) but the AVCR's come up cheap enough and they're better and more reliable than aftermarket electronic boost controllers IMHO

stedee

iTrader: (4)

i thought that but i`m running without a boost controller and ive been surprised how well it is controlling boost, mine is set to 1.5bar though
the apexi`s are a simple product, mappers love em, makes their job easy lol, the commander is quite handy for seeing whats going on

53

iTrader: (41)

^ yeah but yours isn't an early classic, you have the later map sensor so it's not an issue

pete@s/e imprezas

iTrader: (47)

or just use the later map sensor and save a good few £££'s on not using a separate boost controller

Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

So if I was to fit a later map sensor it would do the job OK? I suppose some think its OK and some dont?

Just had a quick look on eBay, there is a few listed along the lines of 'impreza v3 v4 v5 v6 map sensor', would this be the correct one?

Thanks for all the imput all

53

iTrader: (41)

No it won't hold the boost very well on the Apexi at least it wasn't very nice on mine, will be very lumpy, with surges of boost rather than smooth. Works fine on the Simtek as I run a 99STi map sensor on my wagon, as there are infinitely more adjustments and scaling that can be made

Galifrey

iTrader: (3)

From what I have read on here, and chatting to others on other forums, the ESL is what I am gonna go for. http://www.enduringsolutions.com/

Will be fitted and mapped for similar price to an Apexi second hand, but is alledgedly more capable including switchable maps, MAF/MAFless setups, and they are adding antilag and launch control (not that I would use those on a Road Car).

Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

Just had a read of that, sounds good enough.. Need to have a long hard think lol..

Thanks!

Ste-V

iTrader: (2)

Just had a read of that, sounds good enough.. Need to have a long hard think lol..

Thanks!

Bananawasp

Does an apexi avcr run along side the apexi Ecu and give you more performance running both?

Dutch Scooby lover

iTrader: (3)

On a early classic it gives much better boost control, on the later classics the boost control is beeter then on the early ones, but a AVCR will still be an improvement anyway (just not as massive as on pre 97 classics)

Main thing is that the AVCR gives you 3 seperate boost levels (wastegate duty and 2 extra) which can be adjusted on the fly.
The Apexi ECU can only handle one boost setting (or 3 with the boost control add-on) but you can not switch them on the fly.

yabbadoo4

iTrader: (8)

yeah it does, apexi ecu,s are said to be poor with boost control so fitting an avc-r boost controller gives the mapper the option of better boost control through the avc-r instead of the ecu. ( i think lol)

Bananawasp

My Impreza is a 1993 I have just purchased an apexi Ecu for it, what is the boost control add on or would I just be better off going for the avcr unit? Do the connect up together or run independently ?

yabbadoo4

iTrader: (8)

i bought my ecu and commander form a member on here and it has 2 boost settings? it doesnt have an add on either?

Dutch Scooby lover

iTrader: (3)

The boost control add-on is nothing more then a AVCR kit without it's seperate controller.
(Also the plugs are different)

Boost control is much better with the add-on, but only the AVCR lets you change boost settings yourself, the add-on is used by the Apexi ECU/mapper to give 3 seperate boost levels, but you cannot change them should that be necessary.

For example, a very cold day can give a slightly higher boost, and on a AVCR the selflearning function will compensate (or you can fiddle with it yourself, IF you/a mate with experience feel confident)the add-on does not do this believe.

yabbadoo4

iTrader: (8)

i think he means the apexi 3 port boost solenoid? you can get them on ebay bud. ive got an apexi avc-d which is the older version of the avc-r and it came with the 3 port solenoid.

Dutch Scooby lover

iTrader: (3)

The 3 above was a typo/bit of a error on my side
The boost control add-on is just that, an add on.
If you would add that to your current setup you'll get 2 levels of boost.
The Apexi commander shows them both, but without the boost control kit you'll only get one.

The AVCR gives 3 boost levels (when turned "off" you'll get wastegate duty, handy for stopping valet parking guys/detailers/dealers taking the car for a trash)
The add-on gives 2 , as that can't be turned off.

yabbadoo4

iTrader: (8)

the add on is just the 3 port solenoid and a 3 bar map sensor which plugs into the ecu. you could just get a later map sensor from a my98 onwards car and fit that along with the avc-r if its a v1 classic you have. this allows the mapper to run higher boost as well as im sure you wont get more than 1.2 bar or so on the standard map sensor (someone more knowlegeable will correct this if its wrong lol)

53

iTrader: (41)

You can't map it to 1.2 or it will just boost cut all the time. Best is to map to a bar and expect slight overboost to 1.1. The 3 port is part of the AVCR kit. Like I said, if you can find out if the new ESL software is being rolled out on the V1/2 boards I'd just go for that with a later map sensor.

ukpaisley

iTrader: (4)

Latest ESL has two maps and run without MAf, and with a new map sensor will enable higher boost level control. I was going down this route, but then found a good second hand Simtek unit. The Apexi is a good unit, but I think the high price they are going for put me off, when you consider you need a remap. Injector calibration is easy on the Apexi and MAF change. If the mods are planned over a long period of time, stage by stage I would go for the ESL. If going for big mods and trying for every last BHP then the Simtek is a better option , for the track.

Sprint Chief

Every last bhp is a complicated equation and factors in specific build, mapper, time taken to refine the map, etc.,etc.. I would hate to second guess which ECU would yield "every last BHP" and it would probably vary from car to car, or from mapper to mapper (i.e. one mapper might get more out of the simtek, another mapper might get more out of the ESL. And on a different day, that might be reversed. Not seeking to pit mappers against each other here, just a general observation!!!).

To be fair - this doesn't apply in your case since you got a good second hand deal - but for most people, the four hundred odd quid saved between the ECU prices, wisely spent elsewhere, would almost certainly buy more BHP than the difference the ECUs make. This is a bit dependent on budget, but on (say) an £8k mod budget, that is 5% of the build - not a trivial amount. On a £2k-3k budget, the difference is a huge proportion (which ties in with your comment about incremental builds).

Difficult to put a price on active knock control capabilities of the OEM ECU, as well.

ukpaisley

iTrader: (4)

Definetly agree with the comments, my comment about every last BHP was realy amimed at track and drag cars , when the use of ALS and LC are being used.

On a road car, the different fules from pump to pump, its worth considering the ESL as it offers the Knock control.

I would have ESl , if it wasnt for the deal I got for sure. Combile the ESL with a new map sensor and you have a car that gets rid of a potential problem of the MAF and allows a higher boost level.