jiffthejiffmanjaffa

iTrader: (10)

Hi guys,

In reading all the treads on here I've decided I'm going to wrap my FMIC pipe work and a few other bits to help in heat loss.

But I just wanted to make sure I get this right.

The FMIC pipe that goes from the throttle body to the off side wing and goes across the turbo this needs to be wrapped in heat reflective tape. To stop the turbo heat making the charged air hotter. Is this right???

The decat down pipe and headers need exhaust heat wrap to keep the hot air in?

Is there any other pipework that needs wrapping in reflective wrap or exhaust heat wrap?

What about the other FMIC pipe that goes from the throttle body to the nearside wing? Does this need wrapping at any point?

The header tank, this needs to be wrapped in heat reflective wrap to stop heat transferance to the cylinders?

Cheers All.

s5ooob

iTrader: (1)

wrap the pipe to the trottle body with reflective wrap from the point it enters the engine bay...to prevent the cooled charge from picking up engine heat.

Wrap the turbo outlet pipe in exhaust wrap to the point it exits the inner wing...to retain heat and help speed up gas flow [reduce lag], same principle as wrapping headers.

The rookie

iTrader: (1)

WHAT I think you mean the exhaust downpipe, although that's to keep the engine bay cool, not to help turbo spool....you don't want to keep heat in the 'oulet pipe to the inner wing' as that the turbo to intercooler feed and you may want to insulate that from engine bay heat (depending on which one is hotter) but you don't want to keep heat in if you can help it!

another forum 'expert'!

Simon

jiffthejiffmanjaffa

iTrader: (10)

So was I right? I need to wrap the turbo to off-side inner wing in reflective wrap to stop heat getting in?

borat52

Yes, the turbo gets very hot and is right underneath this pipe, wrap it in reflective material to avoid turbo/engine heat being soaked up by it. The idea is to get the air coming out of the turbo as cold as possible (ie dont want to absorb heat through the pipes and want to dissipate as much as possible at the intercooler core.

Another step is to put a heat blanket on the turbo.

Its the exhaust gas you want to keep hot so insulating the headers and downpipe is really whats needed here.

p1mark

Meeow!

You need to read it again Simon. He has not mentioned the downpipe at all. He has said exactly the same as you in that the 'cold' inlet pipe from core to TB wants to be insulated from bay temps - hence wrap and silver tape.

The 'hot' outlet pipe from the turbo to the core he has said you can wrap exactly the same as you would headers. This is not to be dismissed as if you have a very efficient core which has a good handle on temps, then it would not be a bad thing to wrap the hot pipe and keep the speed of the charge up as high as possible.

If you are a bit marginal on cooling - then i would agree leave it unwrapped and allow heat to dissipate quicker into the engine bay which will be cooler than the pipe.

jiffthejiffmanjaffa

iTrader: (10)

What about the header tank? is it worth wrapping that? If so I'm thinking it would be best to wrap that in reflective wrap, to prevent the water absorbing any more heat?

Mother Theresa

Just as a complicating factor: Surely the air flowing in through a scoop or out through a vent would cool the pipework more than a turbo would heat it up - once the car is no longer stationary.

silent running

Wrap the entire FMIC pipe run that is within the engine bay in reflecting/insulating tape. I've got some double layer fibreglass/aluminium stuff that does it perfectly. With the car moving, heat transfer between the charge air coming out of the turbo and the engine bay is not an issue at all. At slow speed and standstill, the pipes will be picking up engine bay heat. Therefore you need to insulate one from the other. I know for a fact this works because I have studied my charge temps pretty well.

Basically you want to keep heat OUT of your whole inlet tract and WITHIN your exhaust system until it's away from the engine bay.

E46_M3

Regarding the header tank, the issue is heat transference into the inlet manifold.
To combat this I have made 'Tufnol' spacers (to reduce conductivity into the inlet manifold) and fabricated a heatshield, which is placed between tank and manifold.
Others have re-sited the tank away from the inlet manifold.
These modifications may each have a minimal effect, but viewed as a whole, definitely worth doing

My WRX is currently undergoing a major refit. Amongst many modifications I will be monitoring inlet temperatures at various points along the inlet track, enabling me to judge how effective each modification has been. I shall post the results.

s5ooob

iTrader: (1)

sometimes pictures are easier to understand... eh, simon




Meeow!

axgt_bwaii

iTrader: (6)

im sure ive seen that engine bay at yorkraceway? black classic with afterburners?

s5ooob

iTrader: (1)

Sorry fella, you're mistaken on both counts, Ive not been to york raceway...



And currently prefering Subarus take on rear lights.:

Back on topic, thinking about it, wrapping the pipe over the turbo to prevent heat soak is proberbly pointless as the charge within the pipe is pretty much at the same temp. as the turbo its just left, whereas, wrapping it to retain heat till it arrives at the cooler may help to increase gas speed and minimise lag.

Flow and pressure drop is just as important a consideration, in an intercooler system, as charge temp. control, which to some extent can be dealt with by fuel trims in the mapping and an efficient turbo set up.

silent running

Interesting, heat wrapping the turbo outlet pipe. I still think that insulating it with reflecting tape is better, although I'm perfectly willing to accept others' point of view on this. My line of reasoning is that with the turbo on boost, it will be putting huge amounts of heat into that pipe anyway (from turbo outlet to FMIC inlet) so it makes no difference whether you heat wrap it, foil wrap it or paint it black, silver, purple whatever. The only thing that is going to make a difference to the charge temp when on the move and on boost is the FMIC and the remainder of the pipe run after it up to the throttle body. I would suggest that heat soak INTO that turbo outlet pipe is going to be zero when on the move.

This all changes when you're at standstill or low speed where you are often totally off boost, working in vacuum all the time and the turbo is pretty much doing no work at all. The charge temp coming out of the turbo, whilst fairly warm, is nothing like as hot as when making boost, and on top of this the engine bay heat soak into the turbo outlet pipe may be significant.

This is why I think you should aim to keep engine bay heat OUT of the turbo outlet pipe run rather than keep charge heat INSIDE it.

axgt_bwaii

iTrader: (6)

no worries

jiffthejiffmanjaffa

iTrader: (10)

Now wrapping the inlet FMIC pipe in reflective wrap that makes sense, in that you want to keep it as cool as possible.

But is there really anything on that side of the engine that is likely to create heat transferance, other than general ambient temps???

As for the outlet pipe from the turbo, I can see the benifits of both wrapping in exhaust wrap and reflective. Can anyone offer some advise with regards to which is actually the best option???

jiffthejiffmanjaffa

iTrader: (10)

Here's another idea. What about wrapping the turbo to intercooler pipe in exaust wrap and then reflective wrap over the top.

Any benifit in that do we think?

Ian

iTrader: (10)

could be worth getting a inlet temp gauge and then you can see the difference it is making

silent running

I'd say the more you can insulate any of the FMIC plumbing the better, but it comes down to whether what you are doing is a waste of money and time or not. Now we might have Little Lord Fauntleroy come on here and say that they can afford to do both so why not, but I'd counter that by saying why not spend the extra on wasted exhaust wrap on something else? A pair of header tank spacers for a start; heat reflecting sleeving for your fuel lines etc. There's plenty that needs doing before wrapping the FMIC pipes with both exhaust wrap AND foil/fibreglass tape. You don't need the huge heat insulation capacity of exhaust wrap on there. The proper good stuff (I've got DEI copper wrap on my headers) is mental - I can take it for a run and then get under the car and briefly touch the headers with my bare fingers -hardcore stuff that's just overkill for FMIC pipes.

jasonius

iTrader: (1)

^^^^^^^

Silent, sounds like you've done a bit more R&D than me on heat management, lol.

What's this double layer glass/ally tape you've mentioned..?

Also, what, if anything have you done to lower fuel temps..?

Interesting this, as I was having a nose around one of the lads standard 06 spec C engine bay the other day and noticed a mesh bag, of what looked like ceramic beads on the in fuel line from the fuel filter..?! I presume it was a crude (but possibly effective) heat shrink to take heat out of the fuel..?

I'll see if we can get a pic..

rcwhite

jasonius

iTrader: (1)

jiffthejiffmanjaffa

iTrader: (10)

Jolly Good, aren't you a lucky boy then

jasonius

iTrader: (1)

ehhh..? WTF..!

Not sure what your on about, but maybe you need to get a girlfriend/boyfriend (delete accordingly) to make your Saturday evenings more interesting..