submannz

Ditto what everone said here, I also use a very similar setup to the prodive setup.

Slam the clutch then pull the hand brake, that will give you over steer.

[Edited by submannz - 11/4/2001 8:37:37 PM]

Rikki 95WRX

Caronte - yes I have raced Karts to quite a decent standard. I am not sure that the comparison between the way you drive a kart quickly and drive a car quickly on tarmac stands. You can do some pretty startling things in a kart - you can get the back end out extremely quickly and the large power to weight ratio means you can get going again very quickly - moreso than in a car I would imagine. I used to go to RAC meets supporting one of the top 'Super' drivers in the country. His team always said the quicker drivers didn't look so quick sometimes because they are so smooth and don't get out of shape.

For example, I am pretty sure that the Touring Car guys don't get too sideways coming out of bends. Perhaps a little, to enable them to get power down earlier without understeering off of the track. Perhaps when you speak of not losing traction you are implying not losing too much forward momentum?

I am sure SDB could clear it up in a sentence or two.

[Edited by Rikki 95WRX - 11/10/2001 12:35:14 AM]

catflap

Need some practical advice

I am a relatively new Scooby owner, only a few month or so, so very inexperienced.

I am suffering with massive amounts of under steer, now I put this down to my inexperience and would like some general tips,

Example

Private car park, approach my fictional turn in point at 30 mph, Load front by using left foot break, and then turn in quite sharp, result, car goes straight on, and loose all traction at front

Example 2

Private car park, approach fiction turn in point at 30, turn in reasonable sharp, loose grip after a second or so

Just cant get the car to over steer , its worrying me as I had to emergency swerve on a roundabout the other day and the same thing happened, I lost all grip (very quickly) and almost hit the fool swerving into my lane.

Car is a standard My99, Bridgestone tyres, due for replacement soon I recon, but should not cause this poor amount of grip, so I deduce poor driving technique.

I ave checked out some web sites about AWD driving, understand the theory quite well, but my scoob just don’t want to grip at all.

Any suggestions? (should be trying to get on a track day soon, safest place to push a car, but if I don’t know how it handles at 30, theni am not ready for higher speeds yet)

Thnx for your time (p.s I aint trying this stuff on roads don’t worry)

RussP

get the geometry re-set to the much revered "prodrive" settings,,,

then smile

Caronte

Hi,
30 mph seems a quite low speed. Even though AWD must be driven into corner slower than other cars in order to fully exploit its traction and coming out from the corner faster. I would check the differentials. An example, in fact can be when you block the differentials on a jeep to climb muddy roads it doesn't just turn.
Hope you gonna solve the problem
Caronte

catflap

Why thx for the advice,

So is it common knowledge that AWD needs to turn in slower?, is it that i am possible being violent turning in?, perhaps adjust my technique to turn in slower, been playing more with it and all i get it loss of grip at the front, starting to frustrate me.

But geometry you say would this make the car unbalanced in other area of driving slightly?

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Check the pressures in your tyres, they can make a difference but the biggest one is to get better tyres on your car as the OEM bridgestones are a little on the cr@p side
Of course it has been an excuse for most people to upgrade to 17's which does improve the handling (with decent tyres, pref SO2 PP's or Toyo's)
Just a thought

Tony (MY00 PPP'd turbo)

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

The Prodrive settings will improve your handling more than anything else

Tony

babber

I agree with all that spoken about tyre pressure and crap RE010, and Pro drive camber settings!!!

My MY00 was terrible for understeer when new. Had the SO2 and Pro-drive cambers done, and what a difference this will make to the overall handling. Play with the tyre pressures to find out what suites your driving / setup. I found 30 PSI on the back and 33 PSI on the front is the best setup for me.

Someone mentioned the Jeep. Well my missis has a Maverik AWD, I was driving it the other day in four wheel drive and noticed it doesn't like going around corners at all. In two wheel drive it is fine.

Cheers Phill C

Boost II

iTrader: (1)

Go round a tight fast corner, right on the limit. Then back off part way through. Then crap yourself as the back steps out - the famous lift off oversteer!

babber

I like lifting off in a corner to correct my line, takes a bit of getting used too. Steering with the rear, chuffing lovely

Cheers Phill C

Caronte

Submanz, this will soon destroy the central diff lock.

catflap

Yeh, and as i only have a standard uk turbo, im sure it will chomp my diif quite quick.

WEll folks i wend for a spin today, and managed a little lateral slide and even felt the tail come out a good foot or so, so im geting used to it slowly, il will look into geting 17`s and pro drive geom soon as i can afford it.

Where is the bast place to do it? Prodrive and power eng, ? what prices am i loong at?

Thnx for the help, most help full

P.S got my first wave by a fellow green scooby today LOL

babber

catflap,

My dealer (Tileys of Bristol) arranged for a guy to do mine while in for a service.

Bumpsteer mod might help, Although I haven't had this done yet, but am toying with it.

Cheers Phill C

PS A full on powerslide in the wet is fantastic, but make sure you have the confidence and ability to try it

Rosco

I had exactly the same problem with my MY00 when I first got it! Get Powerstation to do the Bumpsteer mod and it will handle a lot more neutrally. I had Prodrive settings done first, but it didn't make much difference so then went to Powerstation. Another way to induce oversteer is to turn in quickly (or flick from one direction to another) at the same time as releasing the throttle. It only ever gave the back end a little shake on mine, but enough to get it round that chicane a a bit quicker!

DaveW

OE tyres are rubbish when worn, get them swapped and get the geometry set. Should improve things a bit.

Haven't played with oversteer much, still having fun with 4 wheel power slides

DaveW

Sam Elassar

the only effective way i found was to dap the brakes mid corner to induce oversteer and correct my lines around the track. however this will not work if you are not going fast enough . works very well on track.

otherwise no matter what you will do you will still get a lot of understeer when pushing very hard. the best set up have ever experienced was with my car having
slicks
anti lift kit
eibach springs
bump steer
solid links, sway bars

and still with all this at the hair pin you could not floor it until the front is straight or otherwise it is pointless....

Rosco

Couldn't agree more!
With my lack of driving skills I found the car very restrictive on exit speeds around corners due to understeer. Even when I did induce oversteer, it never lasted long enough, not even for a chicane.
At Donington on Saturday I followed a saloon for a little while that was oversteering everwhere. Don't know why it did but he wasn't deliberately doing it!
I think it's a case of learn to live with it!

Steve

submannz

Guys, I was just kidding around with my post about the hand brake.

A strut brace in the front and and ALK (Anti Lift Kit) or lower the front slightly more than the rear will give you a good amount of over steer.

Dan

ssubaru

Hi
there is only one way to go round corners approach about 70 to 80 hard on brakes then of brakes throw it side ways with lots of power go round corner full vatenen style easy in wet but takes practice and a frontal labottomy to do this in the dry so dont listen to people above they are obviously slow drivers
yours ssubaru
ps only been nicked twice for this driving style

catflap

LOL

i was surprised by the poor grip, most probaly by beleife in the hype, and my lack of driving skill in the car, but it shocked me that it gave up so easily, know for a fact that my mates citreon ax gt, could take it round corners (for grip), but i am hopeing that i`ll grow into the car

ALso being an (ex) fast bike rider, and owning a little CBR 400, that grips like glue to evereything, i recon i could drive up a wall in on it LOL - SLOWLY hehe

But never been on a track in scoob, so not yet seen any of the top drivers throw it about, cant wait.

ssubaru

HI catflap
I agree the handling is rubbish i hated the car for 6 months until i got used to drifting it round corners got blown away on corners buy all sorts of slow cars because of the understeer so get out there and drive like burnsy
ssubaru
ps dont get caught and dont take out your bird in the car as all they do is tell you to slow down FKUCKING WOMEN

Sam Elassar

ssubaru is obviously the man. funny that when i have not been overtaken by ANY SUBARU at knockhill yet ? i take it you don't drive a subaru then

sam

Caronte

uoohhhh! big words for a big mouth.
everybody is good to slide..but then you're slower(unless you are Burns)

scoobystutoo

Where can i find prodrive's geomerty setings dose anyone have them.
stu

ssubaru

Hi sam
what were you saying about no subaru ever passing you, my mate was in a siver uk spec at a track night when he passed you and held you at bay for 6 laps until his bog standard 2 pots and standard pads caught fire so against your big brembos and engine work including your ecu this was good so eat your words and no excueses and yes i drive a subaru side ways like it should be driven so get out there do some rallly driveing courses and stop pissing about driving it with understeer on the track just watch the rally boys at knockhill its not that hard to do
yours ssubaru
ps you shoud never touch your brakes mid corner all braking should be done before the corner so take some courses and you might find your lap times goeing up and no i dont work for knockhill but i do rally subarus

ssubaru

Hi caronte
your not slower when you are slideing a 4 wheel drive car rather than slowing down and getting under steer what is faster slideing at 40 mph or getting understeer and haveing to slow down to bring front wheels back into line i know what is faster slideing i think and it wins rallys so come on guys and drive the car like it should be, like a fcucking rally car
yours ssubaru
ps. drive the car sideways and stop reading max power as all they no what to do is pose. dont mean any offfence from the above so what does any one else think sideways or not give me your oppinion

Caronte

Hi ssubaru,
we have to point out something. Getting oversteer is advantegeous till the point where it loses traction. In other words if you can manage to let the car slide slightly with you foot down on the accelerator that's advatageous. On contrary if you start loses traction and "play" with wide counter manouvres of the steering wheel it's going to be a loss of precious time.
This is applyable and effective on tarmac. On other surfices things change.
Caronte

Rikki 95WRX

Caronte


I was under the impression any amount of induced oversteer is a loss of traction... i.e. the rear wheels are breaking away?

SDB - isn't the quickest way to be on the limit of traction?

ssubaru

Hi caronte
you shouldnt be loseing it on oversteer unless you loss your bottle and take your foot off then you would be in big trouble as we all know what happpens then. well get your bottle out and go try bill gwynnes driving school then you will know what oversteer is but you do have a point on tarmac but all you do then is give it more power when sliding it
yours ssubaru
ps. i suppose even burnsy gets it wrong sometimes