LoneGranger

Looking to enhance power beyond PPP - must be reputable tuner with genuine warranty - c 300 lb ft torque reasonable? (cant afford STi PPP ! ) - any volunteers or pointers?

Propose buying from Motorpoint or ? and having tuner offer full genuine warranty

Will also probably take PPP springs - STi is a bit firm and WRX too floaty

Guess I am looking for an interim step to T25....

If PPP can produce more torque than STi I am guessing an experienced tuner can get around 300 lb ft?

greasemonkey

Lol, the words cake and eating it spring to mind. Think you'll find that tuners don't offer to take over the manufacturer warranty, so you're on your own once you leave the standard/PPP arena.

Probably not on a WRX. You'll get varying opinions on this but personally the TD04 turbo would be well outside its envelope even if you could achieve this sort of figure.

"Full genuine warranty"? What, exactly, is that? Third party tuners tend not to warrant their work, that's why they're third party tuners. If you want a warranty, you'll have to buy one from a warranty company.

As for Motorpoint, there's loads been written about these cars in the past, suggest you do some research and found out if the "savings" available are really what you think.

Wanting to get on the ladder is one thing. As things stand your goals are unrealistic.

Lol, you are acting like Prodrive aren't experienced tuners or something! The PPP is designed to fit within the three year warranty offered with the car, so you should consider the figures produced by it as near reliable limits. A third party tuner may be able to eke a little more out here and there, but you are not going to get quantum leaps without the longevity of the car being prejudiced.

GaryCat

Power Engineering told me that an 03 WRX with Ecutek and full decat would give about 280bhp and which point the fuel pump and turbo become the limiting factor.

G.

LoneGranger

Hmm guess you are right many tahanks for professionally edited response (haven't got a clue how you do it...)

Thing is, I drove a 5 dr wrx ppp which was genuinely quick if a little stuttery around the rev range and a 17k mls 4 dr which was smooth and boringly slow (Dealer in Pboro say that their 4dr checks out as PPP conversion, though I did notice that it sounded like it didnt have an induction kit...)

The Sti PPP is blisteringly quick and frankly I cant imagine what the T25 or 333 are like... - I have driven a 4.3 Griffith with over 300 lb ft / ton for a decade and the STi PPP still felt blinking quick when on song (which was somewhat breif in 2nd, 3rd and 4th!!)

Problem is (and will be a nice one if I can make the money) that for 30k, cars like M3 smg or even Maserati 3200gt start to divert your attention

I guess I value the Scooby experience as ' great performance / pound' like the TVR but only up to low 20k (preferably below - hence the WRX PPP ++ for £19k goal....

LoneGranger

Thanks

Is Power Eng the co. responsible for Lichfields T25 engine mods?

Are they considered to be a reliable tuner (ie not risking longevity of engines?)

Anyone out there got any data on this or similar upgrades?

Pre bug eye cars had a tendency to break their engines when modified - is the WRX really that much stronger (presumably it is not even built as strong as an STi?)

I think this proposition of trying to build a 'cheap as chips' T25 stepping stone could have a lot of appeal?

STI4ME

I may have missed something in your post, but couldn't you get yourself a nice WRX STI, maybe even from a dealer, and add a PPP later if and when you want to? (or a private one, and be able to afford a PPP convertion now). Personaly I loved the '02 STI when I test drove, but couldn't afford. But then I've not been used the the TVR you mention.

The Fixer

No, Litchfields worked in conjunction with powerstation.

I had a Motorpoint STi (2003), no issues, they appear cheap at first glance but buy the time all the other charges, Number plates, tax, tracker installs etc you end up at £23500 or something. I'm pretty sure you could get a UK one from a dealer for that with some haggling.

Tuning & warranty are not two words that go together unless its PPP

LoneGranger

Thanks guys for feedback

I could probably live with the bug eyed looks, however several dealers have said that they will no longer take them other than px and feel they are set for a heavy devaluation as latest shape hits the market 2nd hand........ therefore the WRX - obviously the STi + ppp would give me all the performance I could want

greasemonkey

Like most things it's easy peasy when you know how.

Not sure what that means. No official Subarus come with an "induction kit" (in the cone filter sense). All, whether UK, Japanese, PPP or not, use a panel filter based induction tract.

I don't know how much the Maserati costs, but you'll be looking at an M3 with a few years on it for £30K. Thus not really fair to compare new Subaru with used alternative cars.

Not really. The likes of the WR1 and Type 25 provide excellent value when you weigh up their balance of strengths. Don't forget though that if you're on a bit more of a budget, you could get a year old STi PPP, or even a used Japanese market car, for less than the money a new WRX PPP would cost.

LoneGranger

Power Eng pointed out that the Air flow meters are still very vulnerable and indeed should not be fitted with an induction kit - I think this could well have been the difference between the 2 cars I tried because the noisier (induction) car hesitated and surged around the revs but was a lot quicker.

Trying another 7k WRX PPP tomorrow for balanced view.

Yes I would love to get a new shape STi, downgrade spring stiffness slightly - fit WRX PPP springs?? (or speak to Lichfields re suspension mods in line with everyday ease of use - getting old!!) and put PPP performance pack on, but price will be prohibitive? - How low does a genuine UK Sti latest shape go for?

greasemonkey

The problem isn't just vulnerability. Many induction kits alter the airflow characteristics into the MAF tube making the sensor misread, so while the sensor isn't actually broken, the readings still end up wrong.

If the ECU gets an incorrect airflow reading, an error will be introduced into the fuelling calculations. The resultant lean running makes the car feel quicker, but can, if you're unlucky, result in serious engine damage.

If you were assured that the two cars had the same spec (bar the cone filter), I would be very wary of buying the quicker one. The difference could well be due to the misfuelling mentioned above. Trouble with underfuelling (no matter what its cause) is that the car tends to go like sh*t, right up until the point it nips a bore.

You would have to do some research to find whether the STi dampers would work optimally with the WRX springs. You might find the car over-damped in this scenario.

There are plenty of people to speak to regarding improving performance, don't confine yourself to a single potential supplier, see what's out there!

A look/search in the For Sale section would probably be a worthwhile way to spend ten minutes. You should find a couple of good 03 STi's in there.

LoneGranger

Will let you know how the next WRX PPP test goes - meanwhile I will look at the 03 STi prices - you feel the new shape (UK) is available under £20k?

greasemonkey

Hell yes, you should be able to find an 03 STi PPP with low mileage for under that. Might take a bit of looking but it's possible.

LoneGranger

Non bug eye - latest shape sti uk ppp for 19k would certainly steer me away from a wrx ppp - if I could get the suspension modded to a half way house between wrx and sti setting and remove some of the understeer at the same time....?

I see white line mentioned a lot and tsl - can you suggest any mods to the sti which would remove some of the throttle on low speed understeer (I like roundabouts! and make the ride more 'everyday for the, ahem, older passenger - not me you understand... although it can feel a little like being a passenger when you welly the ppp sti in 2nd gear - or 3rd for that matter...