Remapped ECU
13 May 1999, 03:29 PM
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Hello everybody,
I own a MY98.
I want to have more power achieved by remapping the ECU.
Who is the best supplier who does that and how much does it cost?
Should I install a completely new ECU?
What is the best way to have more power by an electronical change?
Any experiences?
greetings
ric
I own a MY98.
I want to have more power achieved by remapping the ECU.
Who is the best supplier who does that and how much does it cost?
Should I install a completely new ECU?
What is the best way to have more power by an electronical change?
Any experiences?
greetings
ric
13 May 1999, 03:42 PM
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From what I understand the majority of "chips" are actually a bolt-on chip which suppresses the signal of overboost i.e. the ECU thinks there is less boost than there is and raises it more/ keeps it on for longer.
Have heard from scoobysport that engine failures are common.
Have heard from Power Engineering that these devices are crude and don't alter the fuelling/ignition. This could be marketing on their part since they supply a "properly" remapped ECU which changes fuelling/ignition AND boost.
Marketing or not, when the develop the chip for the MY99 they'll be getting my money. It sounds more like the chip I had from BBR on a previous car, I don't like the idea of "pulling the wool over the ECU's eyes" to get more boost.
Have heard from scoobysport that engine failures are common.
Have heard from Power Engineering that these devices are crude and don't alter the fuelling/ignition. This could be marketing on their part since they supply a "properly" remapped ECU which changes fuelling/ignition AND boost.
Marketing or not, when the develop the chip for the MY99 they'll be getting my money. It sounds more like the chip I had from BBR on a previous car, I don't like the idea of "pulling the wool over the ECU's eyes" to get more boost.
13 May 1999, 11:43 PM
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The SUPERCHIP chip is in fact a device called a boost clamp. It fools the ECU into think it is seeing standard boost, then you raise the boost using a bleed valve and away you go. Unfortunately the ECU is sending out fuelling and ignition signals for standard boost so depending on how high the boost is set depends on how long your engine lasts. All internal safety measures are therefore removed, ie, boost control, boost limit etc.
POWER ENGINEERING (sorry for the plug)re-programme the original ECU completely. This allows us access to the internal software which means we can correctly increase boost levels, using original closed loop boost control. The ignition mapping is altered for more off boost torque and high boost detonation control and of course fuelling is altered in acordance with mapping. Lambda control is altered to imrpove cruising fuel consumption. Nothing is altered under the bonnet. Typical figures are +30bhp +40lbs/ft torque.
All safety limits are retained and there is no bleed valve. In fact even your dealer wouldn't know.
All work is individually mapped on each caron the dyno to ensure it is correct as there seems to be a lot of variation car to car. We will not sell the ECU mail-order.
We can modify all ECU's, UK, WRX, STi, but not yet STi5.
I am going to Tokyo on Monday to teach some Impreza tuners mapping (they like a thing called a Fuel Cut Defencer, just like a Superchip) and they only tend to go for big boost, big power, big injecters. They are not too worried about torque or driveability.
I am working on the STi5 and will seek help in japan so we might have some answers soon.
Hope this helps.
David
POWER ENGINEERING (sorry for the plug)re-programme the original ECU completely. This allows us access to the internal software which means we can correctly increase boost levels, using original closed loop boost control. The ignition mapping is altered for more off boost torque and high boost detonation control and of course fuelling is altered in acordance with mapping. Lambda control is altered to imrpove cruising fuel consumption. Nothing is altered under the bonnet. Typical figures are +30bhp +40lbs/ft torque.
All safety limits are retained and there is no bleed valve. In fact even your dealer wouldn't know.
All work is individually mapped on each caron the dyno to ensure it is correct as there seems to be a lot of variation car to car. We will not sell the ECU mail-order.
We can modify all ECU's, UK, WRX, STi, but not yet STi5.
I am going to Tokyo on Monday to teach some Impreza tuners mapping (they like a thing called a Fuel Cut Defencer, just like a Superchip) and they only tend to go for big boost, big power, big injecters. They are not too worried about torque or driveability.
I am working on the STi5 and will seek help in japan so we might have some answers soon.
Hope this helps.
David
16 May 1999, 04:19 PM
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We have yet to see a UK MY99 ECU so if you would like to bring a car down for us to look at then we can tell you.
I am away in Tokyo next week working on the STi5 ECU so I cannot be reached but if you would like to telephone and speak to Mervyn he can help.
I am away in Tokyo next week working on the STi5 ECU so I cannot be reached but if you would like to telephone and speak to Mervyn he can help.
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17 May 1999, 11:31 AM
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Hmm, I was at Power + t'other week with my MY97 UK Spec. Re-mapped ECU now (+ water injection to keep internal temps down and a trick gadget anyhow) after having had Superchip before. Superchip was fine for around 15k miles until I started fitting Scoobysport boxes, air filters etc which seemed to **** it right off and meant that peak power was right at the top of the rev range. Car now is a bloody beast (cheers Dave 
) with 284bhp at 6270 rpm and peak torque of same figure at 3500 rpm. Digital boost gauge/turbo timer works a treat too. All in all a worthwhile visit down South 
(do I get the free stickers now Dave - you were out of backings when I was down )
) with 284bhp at 6270 rpm and peak torque of same figure at 3500 rpm. Digital boost gauge/turbo timer works a treat too. All in all a worthwhile visit down South (do I get the free stickers now Dave - you were out of backings when I was down
)
17 May 1999, 07:59 PM
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So basically everyone is against the Superchips conversion because it doesn't alter ignition timing and fuel mixture.
This is for Dobbo. Are you satisfied after all from the Superchips conversion? Is it likely to do harm to the engine?
Like most people I am seeking a bit more power from my MY99.
This is for Dobbo. Are you satisfied after all from the Superchips conversion? Is it likely to do harm to the engine?
Like most people I am seeking a bit more power from my MY99.
18 May 1999, 03:07 PM
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I had a look at the MOTEC and GEMS sites and there's some really cool stuff (if you've got the money !). They're really for "proper" racing cars but a fully electronic dash with loads of warning gizmos and datalogging so you can record your trip to work would be quite a laugh. I don't suppose you'd get much change from 5K though !(that's a real wild stab in the dark btw).
cheers
Andy
cheers
Andy
18 May 1999, 03:52 PM
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Lads,
Thanks for the interest (at last someone talks to me!)
I only have the scoobysport back box as decided I didn't want to have to chop + change bits if I ever needed an MOT (ie. downpipe).
Superchip worked fine and I never had any chugging, blips, blops or bangs with it. As I said though, it seemed to go right out of whack once I changed the filter/exhaust bits so maybe best to fit to complement mods rather than as a first port of call. Long term if you're blasting the ****e out of the thing every time you get in it then things won't last as long - but then again this could be very many miles down the road. Each to his own after all, it's your car mate.
However what I can definately say is that the re-mapped ECU delivers power better, where you want it, and with more of a kick in the back. Glad I had it done (so far).
Can I PLEASE have the free stickers now Dave??!!
Thanks for the interest (at last someone talks to me!)
I only have the scoobysport back box as decided I didn't want to have to chop + change bits if I ever needed an MOT (ie. downpipe).
Superchip worked fine and I never had any chugging, blips, blops or bangs with it. As I said though, it seemed to go right out of whack once I changed the filter/exhaust bits so maybe best to fit to complement mods rather than as a first port of call. Long term if you're blasting the ****e out of the thing every time you get in it then things won't last as long - but then again this could be very many miles down the road. Each to his own after all, it's your car mate.
However what I can definately say is that the re-mapped ECU delivers power better, where you want it, and with more of a kick in the back. Glad I had it done (so far).
Can I PLEASE have the free stickers now Dave??!!
18 May 1999, 04:10 PM
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6 months later I get the answer to chipping
My car is running with a Mines ECU, can't compare with the original ECU as I never had it but I find that the boost, max set at 0.9 bar, is stable, no spikes, fueling/air optimised and good engine response with no noticeable lag.
Thing is, since you can reprogramme the ECU why change it, provided the programmer has the right parameters based on extensive R & D and practical experience.
Otherwise got to Motec.
Electronics
Tested a mate's car fitted with an Apexi super avc-r boost controller - boost very unstable, hunting in the range of 0.7 to 1.0 bar when "trying" to run full boost. Maybe this particular unit was faulty. Have been recommended the ProFec A, yet to try it out - why fit it when ECU is running well?....haven't a clue! *laff*
Don't forget to get an exhaust temp meter if you havent already.
My car is running with a Mines ECU, can't compare with the original ECU as I never had it but I find that the boost, max set at 0.9 bar, is stable, no spikes, fueling/air optimised and good engine response with no noticeable lag.
Thing is, since you can reprogramme the ECU why change it, provided the programmer has the right parameters based on extensive R & D and practical experience.
Otherwise got to Motec.
Electronics
Tested a mate's car fitted with an Apexi super avc-r boost controller - boost very unstable, hunting in the range of 0.7 to 1.0 bar when "trying" to run full boost. Maybe this particular unit was faulty. Have been recommended the ProFec A, yet to try it out - why fit it when ECU is running well?....haven't a clue! *laff*
Don't forget to get an exhaust temp meter if you havent already.
18 May 1999, 05:19 PM
#16
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Dobbo.
I like the sound of this even more. Like you, I dont wish to 'mess about' with the exhaust at each MOT. I already have the scoobysport back box and ramair filter so apart from the water injection, I'm a ECU remap away from 284BHP (give or take)
BUT...the sensible questions are...
What does your insurance company make of all this and, just as important, have your thrown away your Subaru warranty?
I like the sound of this even more. Like you, I dont wish to 'mess about' with the exhaust at each MOT. I already have the scoobysport back box and ramair filter so apart from the water injection, I'm a ECU remap away from 284BHP (give or take)
BUT...the sensible questions are...
What does your insurance company make of all this and, just as important, have your thrown away your Subaru warranty?
19 May 1999, 11:00 AM
#17
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Funnily enough, was insured with Kwik Fit (don't laugh) who wanted to put my premium up even though I had no claim in the previous year - so I went to Adrian Flux, cap in hand and admitted all mods, licence endorsements etc, and they gave me a price which was lower than that I'd paid the year before with no mods! Guess I'm just lucky to be an old git.
Dealer had carried out servicing etc when I had Superchip and back box fitted with no quibbles; yet to see their reaction to the water injection set up but chatted with the mechanic there last night who just seemed impressed by it all.
Basically spent a shade over 2k at PE having re-mapped ECU etc. PE don't recommend having the Water Inj kit unless you are going to go further with the mods later. I got it just in case, as it should serve to keep charge temps down and I liked the sound of the kit anyhow Re-map is 690 + VAT I think and water inj is 467 + VAT though you will need to pay extra if you want a separate water bottle (I have a Ford one fitted in mine on 2 specially machined brackets) and a low level indicator. Results will vary from car to car as they map each one individually. I am running at peak 1.42bar by the way.
Dealer had carried out servicing etc when I had Superchip and back box fitted with no quibbles; yet to see their reaction to the water injection set up but chatted with the mechanic there last night who just seemed impressed by it all.
Basically spent a shade over 2k at PE having re-mapped ECU etc. PE don't recommend having the Water Inj kit unless you are going to go further with the mods later. I got it just in case, as it should serve to keep charge temps down and I liked the sound of the kit anyhow
Re-map is 690 + VAT I think and water inj is 467 + VAT though you will need to pay extra if you want a separate water bottle (I have a Ford one fitted in mine on 2 specially machined brackets) and a low level indicator. Results will vary from car to car as they map each one individually. I am running at peak 1.42bar by the way. 
19 May 1999, 03:29 PM
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Dobbo,
What other changes have you made to your car?
I assume that the standard brakes, standard transmission and standard clutch are not constructed in such a way they can deal with this load of power/torque.
Cheers,
Ruud.
What other changes have you made to your car?
I assume that the standard brakes, standard transmission and standard clutch are not constructed in such a way they can deal with this load of power/torque.
Cheers,
Ruud.
19 May 1999, 05:41 PM
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Is seems Dobbo that you have a lot of questions to answer... ;-)
Here are two more (for anyone to answer).
1. I thought that the ECU was a ROM (Read only memory chip). Is it especially in the Subaru that you are able to reprogram the SAME chip (factory ECU)? (Maybe you can do this also in BMW, but surely not in all makes.)
2. How come it is so expensive to reprogram the chip? You quote a price of 690+VAT! Doesn't it just take a few minutes to do it? Or presumambly you pay for the expertise and the fixed costs involved in purchasing the necessary equipment to reprogram the chip?
Dimitris.
Here are two more (for anyone to answer).
1. I thought that the ECU was a ROM (Read only memory chip). Is it especially in the Subaru that you are able to reprogram the SAME chip (factory ECU)? (Maybe you can do this also in BMW, but surely not in all makes.)
2. How come it is so expensive to reprogram the chip? You quote a price of 690+VAT! Doesn't it just take a few minutes to do it? Or presumambly you pay for the expertise and the fixed costs involved in purchasing the necessary equipment to reprogram the chip?
Dimitris.
19 May 1999, 07:38 PM
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I'm also interested in the answers to Ruud's question.
On the track, Impreza's on standard suspension and brakes, even the 400+bhp ones, are easy targets.
On the track, Impreza's on standard suspension and brakes, even the 400+bhp ones, are easy targets.
20 May 1999, 10:43 AM
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Agree that once you get going it's difficult to stop as one upgrade begets another. Having now looked carefully at the gauge en route to work, I see that peak is around 1.32 bar - I wore my glasses today
I have Tarox front discs and Mintex 1144s (?) all round, with stainless brake hoses and uprated fluid, strut brace and Eibach lowered springs. 17 inch RL-Rs are en route for Saturday fitting.
I don't use my car on the track anymore(eats too much rubber!), just around town/motorways so have got the set up as I like it - maybe I could do better, maybe not, maybe suspension is next on my list.
If they are (hopefully) tastefully and professionally fitted then they should optimise rather than compromise the car's natural abilities/equipment - these are not Japanese 'tuned to the hilt and sod driveability' mods (I hope!?). Anyway, I like them and am changing cars on 1/9/99 (EVO VI UK spec) so doubt I'd have had enough time to blow it up by then
Yours responsibly
[This message has been edited by Dobbo (edited 20-05-99).]
I have Tarox front discs and Mintex 1144s (?) all round, with stainless brake hoses and uprated fluid, strut brace and Eibach lowered springs. 17 inch RL-Rs are en route for Saturday fitting.
I don't use my car on the track anymore(eats too much rubber!), just around town/motorways so have got the set up as I like it - maybe I could do better, maybe not, maybe suspension is next on my list.
If they are (hopefully) tastefully and professionally fitted then they should optimise rather than compromise the car's natural abilities/equipment - these are not Japanese 'tuned to the hilt and sod driveability' mods (I hope!?). Anyway, I like them and am changing cars on 1/9/99 (EVO VI UK spec) so doubt I'd have had enough time to blow it up by then
Yours responsibly
[This message has been edited by Dobbo (edited 20-05-99).]
20 May 1999, 07:27 PM
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Can anyone tell me where they Hide the ECU on the 95/96 model's.. When I bought the car I was told it had been chipped but was unable to find out which chip. Am seriously looking at having the ECU remapped - will the chip have any adverse affects to this?
Big Al.
Big Al.
21 May 1999, 11:48 AM
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Dobbo,
arent you afraid of overspeeding the turbine crankshaft by holding 1.32 bar at high revs?
The MY97\98 has a small turbo which runs with very high speeds.
David Power,
what about your pushing the engine by remapping the ECU? Is this reliable and comes with warranty?
ric
arent you afraid of overspeeding the turbine crankshaft by holding 1.32 bar at high revs?
The MY97\98 has a small turbo which runs with very high speeds.
David Power,
what about your pushing the engine by remapping the ECU? Is this reliable and comes with warranty?
ric
21 May 1999, 03:49 PM
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Peak bar is only held for a short period of time and quickly tails off during further acceleration - safety feature? No I'm not worried as if I were I'd never have bothered in the first place. This is why I decided to pay tailored suit money to a reputable tuner and to bin the Mr Byrite superchip. I'm happy and will comment on long term reliability over the Summer. Cheers.
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