I have had 4 owners contact me in the past week, all after pistons, rods and cranks for their version 4 (3 people) and 5 (1 very unhappy person) STi's. Each car has holed pistons and the resultant damage has seriously scored the bores.

ALL of these cars were being run only on 95 RON fuel.

If you have one of these cars, use 98 RON only. They were intended for 100 RON fuel and the cylinder temperatures get too hot when using a fuel with too low a detonation temperature.

Pete
Scoobysport

 

Pete
Does this apply to my humble 95WRX - which obviously has much less power than the later vehicles?

 

stevebyng.

The problem identified by Pete appears to be with newer model cars than yours, I would suspect that would imply that your vehicle may also be susceptible to similar consequences on the assumption that the car is as described by Pete (Sti 4 or 5).

I have only had my MY93 WRX a matter of days though the fear of exactly this sort of problem would deter me from ever using anything less than 98 octane fuel, except in dire emergency.

It extends to cutting corners for which the potential consequences appear to be catastrophic.

I today paid a whopping £99.84 (with discount) for a simple cambelt
From the main dealer, didn't enjoy it but I would not have even considered looking for or using a pattern part in such a crucial position. Peace of mind will also come with a "Super Plus only" policy.

 

Peter,

Are these cars personal imports previously used in Japan? If so, perhaps they got used to running 100 octane fuel and the chips were not re-set on entering the UK?



[This message has been edited by MartinK (edited 09-02-99).]

 

I asked my importer about this and they have experience/feedback on several hundred cars though their network (they are the founder of British Independent Motor Traders).

Their view is that they have had four cars altogether with blow pistons - and all of them had been chipped.

I am not suggesting that they are condoning running on 95 in all conditions - their view is that if you are not pressing on all the time (e.g. track day, weekend blast) 95 is OK. The upshot is that if you have no choice but to put 95 in then it is OK, but 98 is better all round - why buy a decent car if you are not going to drive it

Just thought it was useful feedback and wondered if this fit with Pete's comments about the cars he was dealing with - and a potential warning for chippers!

David

 

aaargh thanks pete for this - last thing I want is some holes in my pistons.
presumably temperature relates to how much welly? I've had to feed mine with 95 in desperation - and IF you have to do this, it shouldn't blow up unless too much right foot is applied? and, more to the point, what the hell are us guys gonna do IF 98 RON gets phased out by the euro politically coorect brigade?

 

The German auto industry lobby will not allow this to happen. The larger capacity Audi/VW engines quote their power output with 98RON petrol and the vast German tuning industry produces engines which recommend using only 98RON, Alpina and AC Schnitzer are examples.
Anyway, are there any evidence that 98RON produces more emissions than 95RON?

 

Just to follow on from Clarence I think ALL Porsche 911's are required to use 98 Octane aswell.

 

What about my 98 WRX then? Presumably (especially from the rolling road results of similar WRXs), this will suffer the same fate as the STis given that it produces around about the same power?!

Does this mean that UK turbos have stronger pistons / different ignition? If the pistons are getting hot enough to deform, why does the petrol not predetonate??

If anyone can shed some light on this, I (and many others) would be very grateful.

 

Clarence,

Last I heard, 98RON was loaded up with benzine to get the higher octane rating. Don't know if that's still the case, but it was basically worse than leaded - ie. if it was a choice between spuing out benzine or lead emissions, the former would be preferable!

I think that's the case - someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

In short - yes, 98 is worse than 95RON (in terms of emmissions).


P.S. I wonder if the new fuel is going to be called "Petrol 2000" or "Euro-RON" :-]


[This message has been edited by brumster (edited 16-03-99).]

 

As far as I am aware Super Unleaded is to be phased out soon after Leaded fuel (Dec 31st 1999) and it is the Germans that are pushing this through because of the high benzine levels, and yes these are more dangerous than lead.
All modern day Audis/VWs/BMWs/Porches etc. will quite happily run on 95 octane fuel with no piston problems only a reduction in power, even if 98 is recommended.

[This message has been edited by DavieR (edited 16-03-99).]

 

When I first saw this post, I was a little concerned.

But my dealer has stated to me that running on 95 RON in my STi 5 is fine, and that they'll honour the warranty (he also said he really doesn't expect to have to honour the warranty....).

Personally, I'd be MUCH happier running on 98 RON/super-unleaded but they don't sell it here AT ALL.

 

AnthonyJ,

An (unmodified) UK turbo runs with lower boost pressure and slightly more retarded ignition timing resulting in the detonation point being "further away" than for the STI - thus allowing a fuel with less "anti-knock" performance (i.e. RON) to be used.

 

What I have heard is that the extra benzine from 98RON will only be emitted before the cat has reached it's operating temperature, 95RON fuel has lots of benzine as well. Benzine can cause cancer and it's harmful to breathe in petrol vapour as well, so put on a face mask when you fill-up the car next time!
As for phasing out 98RON, I have not heard anything about it. The only thing I have heard is a new standard for sulphur level in 2000, in order to lower emissions. In most places in the Far East, the only unleaded fuel available is 98RON. Someone said the Japanese emissions regs are much more stringent compared to the current EU standards, so I guess if 100RON is good for them, it must be good for us, as long as the cat has reached it operating temp.

 

Careful boys. It would appear that anything remotely amusing is not in keeping with the image this BBS is trying to project so therefore gets kicked into touch.
I just hope someone asks about floormats again!!

 

So an STi driver pulls over to the side of the road, the engine blown and smoking. At the point where he stops there's an old tramp lying in the gutter who asks the Scooby owner :
"What's up mate?" to which the degected Scooby owber replies :
"Piston broke."
The tramp replies "Yeah, me too!"

Is this off-thread?

 

Boom Boom!! :-))

 

I agree with you Nigel (again)

I saw nothiong wrong with the way that thread was progressing, nobody was being particularly irresponsible.

(Unless a club member or BBS visitor genuinely owns a Hercules C130 of course)!!!

Until that stage I was visiting that thread knowing that somebody was going to succeed in making me laugh.

Disappointed of Nottingham.

 

Incidentally, I was about to post a more serious response to the "how fast" thread (which I've emailed directly to stapper).

Basically, I think the MY99 is less fast than the MY97 and MY98 that I test drove. I think it accelerates more smoothly than either of them, and doesn't provide the kick in the guts that the MY97 in particular gave. However, I suspect the engine's youth (1500 miles) is a major factor and that it will free up over time.

I still think that "how fast - very fast" is one of the funniest exchanges I have seen on this web site.

Rob. (now seriously guilty of going off-thread, but the thread I was on has now been closed and I didn't know where else to post)

 

Lets close this thread.

An Englishman, Irishman and Scotsman walk into the pub where their Surrey SIDC meet is taking place, walk up to the bar whereupon the barman says, "What's this? Some kind of joke?"

 

Oh god, I'll probably get banned for this but I'm only trying to cheer up Mike Tuckwood

An Englishman, a Scotsman and Cindy Crawford are on a train when it suddenly goes through a tunnel. All that can be heard in the darkness is a kissing noise. When the train finally comes out of the tunnel the Scotsman is rubbing a very red looking face and thinking to himself:
"That Englishman must have tried to kiss Cindy Crawford and she slapped me by mistake"
Cindy Crawford meanwhile is thinking:
"That Scotsman must have tried to kiss me but kissed the Englishman by mistake"
The Englishman however is thinking:
"Great...I cant wait for another tunnel, then I can make a kissing noise and slap that Scottish git again"

No offense meant to all the Scottish contingent by the way.

 

Rob, is it significant that 'one of the funniest threads you've read on the BBS' was kicked off by an Irishman

Dave O'Smith

[This message has been edited by Dave S (edited 17-03-99).]

 

Benny Boy.

Very sharp, excellent.

Nigel.
Spot on, it worked. If you get banned for that I will send in my membership card also.

 

On a more serious note does anyone know wether Sti series 2 260 ps engines are susceptible to this problem ?