Alternative to FMIC
10 July 2002, 04:57 PM
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Just another quick thought for the day.
As i can't afford a front mount intercooler as yet, and do not want to go to the extremes of David Wallis, would the following work on a uk my00 turbo.
creating some sort of ducting from front of car, prob orange bits under indicator, to underneath or around the tmic.
just thought it might be a cheaper alternative and a quick one at that??
As i can't afford a front mount intercooler as yet, and do not want to go to the extremes of David Wallis, would the following work on a uk my00 turbo.
creating some sort of ducting from front of car, prob orange bits under indicator, to underneath or around the tmic.
just thought it might be a cheaper alternative and a quick one at that??
To route air to it..........
10 July 2002, 05:14 PM
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i know thats what the scoop is for, but there are some suggestions that aerodynamics and all that at certain speeds can cut off supply to scoop!
also thought more air it gets the more the i/c is working, as it only appears to be half used at the moment from the scoop.
also thought more air it gets the more the i/c is working, as it only appears to be half used at the moment from the scoop.
10 July 2002, 05:21 PM
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Tests have been carried out that disprove the airflow theory.
Air should only enter the intercooler from the top, if you direct air underneath it will obstruct the correct airflow coming through the intercooler.
Air should only enter the intercooler from the top, if you direct air underneath it will obstruct the correct airflow coming through the intercooler.
10 July 2002, 05:34 PM
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But if you get more cold air into the engine bay in general or figure some way to get the hot air out (both would be ideal) you would improve the cooling overall and that should help (how much is up for debate). I can't remember the figures but there is a table that shows the amount of bhp per degree reduction (I guess it's general as opposed to exact).
Having said that, I wouldn't be convinced that air from below would have a detrimental effect on cooling the IC. Just don't know if it would improve matters.
Having said that, I wouldn't be convinced that air from below would have a detrimental effect on cooling the IC. Just don't know if it would improve matters.
10 July 2002, 05:45 PM
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The air has to pass through the cooler some how any obstructions, ie air coming the other way, will have a detrimental effect.
Reducing underbonnet temps is a great idea but how you go about it is another matter.
Reducing underbonnet temps is a great idea but how you go about it is another matter.
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10 July 2002, 06:26 PM
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I'd have thought that there are 2 things that should be done - one is to keep as much engine-bay heat away from the intercooler as possible, the other is to make sure that there's a good airflow through it.
So, that's the 'bleeding obvious' then
...
Is there any particular reason (aside from where would it go?) that no-one has ever put some sort of heat-reflective box around the sides of the intercooler, like the ones designed to keep heat away from an under-bonnet induction kit? There's the heat-shield above the turbo which we all know isn't just warm & is smack next to the intercooler.
Next (
); air flow. How good is the feed from the bonnet scoop at actually getting pushed through the intercooler? A seal of some form would enable more air to get through. As far as I remember, the actual 'funnel' size only needs to be 40% of the total frontal area of the intercooler anyway ('cos of air flow/turbulence & whatnot) so the scoop size isn't really really bad (just not very good ), but efficiency can be raised by 10-20% by correctly flowing the air. And then there's the area behind - it's just as important to allow the air to 'get out' than to 'get in' - usually it needs to fight it's way past its own tubing & then over the, err, is that the gearbox there? Anyway, another big thing. How about ducting it down to join the airflow under the car - it might even act as a very slight 'sucky' mechanism.
I'd have thought that this sort of thing could help increase the efficiency of the oem intercooler. And only take about 200 hours to fix something up
Anyone else got any stupid comments
So, that's the 'bleeding obvious' then
...Is there any particular reason (aside from where would it go?) that no-one has ever put some sort of heat-reflective box around the sides of the intercooler, like the ones designed to keep heat away from an under-bonnet induction kit? There's the heat-shield above the turbo which we all know isn't just warm & is smack next to the intercooler.
Next (
); air flow. How good is the feed from the bonnet scoop at actually getting pushed through the intercooler? A seal of some form would enable more air to get through. As far as I remember, the actual 'funnel' size only needs to be 40% of the total frontal area of the intercooler anyway ('cos of air flow/turbulence & whatnot) so the scoop size isn't really really bad (just not very good ), but efficiency can be raised by 10-20% by correctly flowing the air. And then there's the area behind - it's just as important to allow the air to 'get out' than to 'get in' - usually it needs to fight it's way past its own tubing & then over the, err, is that the gearbox there? Anyway, another big thing. How about ducting it down to join the airflow under the car - it might even act as a very slight 'sucky' mechanism.I'd have thought that this sort of thing could help increase the efficiency of the oem intercooler. And only take about 200 hours to fix something up
Anyone else got any stupid comments
10 July 2002, 06:32 PM
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Michael Ferries, I think, makes a nice splitter for the Subaru i/c inlet which directs flow over the entire surface - I guess he still makes them, got mine a few years ago. Someone must have a link to his website?
To test airflow around/into the intercooler scoop, attach little 3-5cm long bits of cotton or wool around the general area and drive at high speed while someone checks what happens to the airflow (out of the sunroof looking down would be best position, but a little suspect at over 200km/h).
I'd like to be able to say I went to the trouble of doing this...I didn't, I bought a digital thermometer with k-type probes and will measure i/c output temps instead (you must then factor turbo efficiency too....but I've got 2 probes....).
Richard
To test airflow around/into the intercooler scoop, attach little 3-5cm long bits of cotton or wool around the general area and drive at high speed while someone checks what happens to the airflow (out of the sunroof looking down would be best position, but a little suspect at over 200km/h
).I'd like to be able to say I went to the trouble of doing this...I didn't, I bought a digital thermometer with k-type probes and will measure i/c output temps instead (you must then factor turbo efficiency too....but I've got 2 probes....).
Richard
10 July 2002, 07:50 PM
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If interested I am thinking of gettting one of these, don't know how effective they are but claim a big reduction in temperature at the intercooler thus more power.
heres the link :
http://www.nitrousexpress.com/productdisplay.php?sku=5183&hdwt=31101&loc=101
heres the link :
http://www.nitrousexpress.com/productdisplay.php?sku=5183&hdwt=31101&loc=101
11 July 2002, 10:52 AM
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Yeah - I have the Michael Ferries intercooler splitter too - on the normal design only the back half of the intercooler appears to be used but with the splitter it routes some of the air over the front too.......
12 July 2002, 03:17 AM
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Legacy Turbos have a charge cooler as Standard.
Dunno how effective it is in comparison (god knows it weighs a load more) and any comments here would be welcome. Am considering various ways of improving the coolant flow / fitting larger water-air charge radiator. The aussie websites seem to rave about doing this. Just my two-pence worth.
Dunno how effective it is in comparison (god knows it weighs a load more) and any comments here would be welcome. Am considering various ways of improving the coolant flow / fitting larger water-air charge radiator. The aussie websites seem to rave about doing this. Just my two-pence worth.
12 July 2002, 10:54 AM
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The charge-cooler jobbies work well for road use - they cool very well, but only until the water gets hot, which isn't very long... Advantage is that you can stick'em wherever & they only need a small oil-cooler size radiator (normally!) as when off boost, the charge-cooler actually helps cool the coolant rather than the other way round... So not too good for track days! Unless you fancy carrying round a bootfull of water
12 July 2002, 03:14 PM
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Ohhh....so as a hard driver (you mean the go pedal comes OFF the floor?) an FMIC is actually going to be more benefical to my bhp than a charge cooler? Oohh... How about just getting a bigger water/air radiator? Or perhaps I should go start a new thread?
http://www.scoobynet.co.uk/bbs/thread.asp?ThreadID=112689
:-)
http://www.scoobynet.co.uk/bbs/thread.asp?ThreadID=112689
:-)
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