trionic

What size turbine are you using to drive each of these compressor wheels when used on a 2.0L engine? Also of use would be pointers to compressor maps for both these turbochargers.

Thanks

john banks

18G compressor map is like gold dust.

Don't know of anyone using big 16G - most are using small.

Most are using TD05H turbine in 7cm2 housing for 16G small and 20G. The 20G requires a ported wastegate on some cars to avoid boost creep.

Compressor maps for 16G and 20G are easy to find with Google.

trionic

I was concerned about boost threshold using a 20G on a 2.0L. Wouldn't that arrangement (with suitable turbine) raise the threshold quite high?

callum Sti02

I think you are quite correct to be asking questions re the 16 & 18's. Having fitted a Garrett 20G with an A/R 60 housing on mine the spool point was, IMHO, too high for an everyday road car at 3800 to 4100 for 1bar in 4th depending on downpipe and exhaust leaks. I was well warned that this may be the case before purchasing but took no heed In hindsight, I would not go this route again but would certainly consider an 18 or smaller where top end is not a priority.

callum

john banks

The turbine has more effect on boost threshold than the compressor.

16G reaches 1 bar in top gear at about 2700 RPM, 20 G at about 2900 RPM, add 200 RPM if using aftermarket headers.

The US guys like to use an 06H turbine (2 sizes bigger than 05H) and 8cm2 housing (size of the discharge nozzle of the turbine scroll onto turbine wheel), but they don't seem to be getting the return on their investment they make with increased boost threshold.

Andy.F

Callum

Do you mean a P20 ? not a 20G
P20 is an IHI turbine housing, a big one, frequently used on the garrett/IHI hybrid.
The 20G is a different turbo, it refers to the compressor wheel size/trim

Andy

john banks

Note the above comparison with a hybrid TD04 with headers against a TD05H-20G with ported OEM headers. The small gain at the bottom end may be due to slightly more conservative weights used on the TD04 car or the freed up exhaust off boost plus OEM headers bottom end response. Whatever, the calibration is not way off.

I won't pretend that in 2nd gear before 4000 RPM that the transients are electrifying. At 5000 RPM in any gear there is very little lag. Boost threshold is about 200 RPM higher each gear you drop lower.

If you were only getting 1 bar at 3800-4100 RPM in 4th gear you either had a bad leak, inadequate boost control or a badly setup example of a 16/18/20G IMHO.

callum Sti02

Apologies for spreading misinformation - I had a feeling I was out of my depth

Andy,
You are obviously correct, it did not register that Matthew was only asking about a TD series (20G) rather than a VF (P20) like mine. Just proves that I still haven't got my head around turbo classification numbers yet! I have no experience of the 20G and so am not able to comment.

John,
I'm sure you remember the leaks which I refered to but I'm still pretty sure that my P20 would never have satisfied my goals even if you had the opportunity to optimise the map. You may have achieved 1bar at 3600 but that would surely have been the best achievable spool point.

I was offered a free exchange to a P18 housing after better results with a very similar setup to mine but refused as I think the next stage will see vastly improved results with my current turbo.

Thanks to good advice & encouragement from Andy to take some brave pills my Garrett has now been stripped, ported and will soon be back together

john banks

Sorry Callum with the new user name I didn't realise it was you!

I never feel we got representative spool up because of the leak, but agree with your thoughts for a 2.0. I am wondering if this sort of turbo would suit the 2.5 but am being cautious until I see comparative results of 20G and P20/Garrett on the same rollers.

TopBanana

Will the 18g compressor wheel fit inside the standard housing? If so, is it a DIY job or will the turbo require re-balancing?

TopBanana

trionic

So, back to the original question: what sized turbine wheels have you found to work well with 16G and 18G compressors on a 2.0L?

john banks

"Most are using TD05H turbine in 7cm2 housing for 16G small and 20G."

Does this not answer your question?

Only aware of Moray who uses/has used an 18G and I believe that is an 05H as well.

MorayMackenzie

The following may be of help:

Found here : http://www.wrxworld.com/projects/AVOTurbo/

Quote begins:

For reference: (From a most recent i-club post by hotrod)

Stock Turbo 360 CFM at 14.7 PSI
T3 60 trim 400 CFM at 14.7 PSI
IHI VF 23/24 423 CFM at 14.7 PSI
STOCK HYBRID 430 CFM at 14.7 PSI
IHI VF-22 435 CFM at 14.7 PSI
SR 30 435 CFM at 14.7 PSI
T04E 40 trim 460 CFM at 14.7 PSI
Small 16G 505 CFM at 14.7 PSI
Large 16G 550 CFM at 14.7 PSI
SR 40 595 CFM at 14.7 PSI
18G 600 CFM at 14.7 PSI
PE 1820 630 CFM at 14.7 PSI
20G 650 CFM at 14.7 PSI
SR 50 710 CFM at 14.7 PSI
GT-30 725 CFM at 14.7 PSI
60-1 725 CFM at 14.7 PSI
GT-35R 820 CFM at 14.7 PSI
T72 920 CFM at 14.7 PSI

IHI VF 23/24 388 CFM at 18 PSI
T3 60 trim 410 CFM at 20 PSI
IHI VF-22 460 CFM at 18.0 PSI
AVO 320HP 465 CFM at 17.5 PSI
T04E 40 trim 465 CFM at 22 PSI
SR 30 490 CFM at 22 PSI
Small 16G 490 CFM at 22 PSI
Large 16G 520 CFM at 22 PSI
AVO 400HP 580 CFM at 17.5 PSI
PE 1820 600 CFM at 22 PSI
AVO 450HP 650 CFM at 20.0 PSI
SR 40 650 CFM at 22 PSI
20G 695 CFM at 20.0 PSI
AVO 500HP 725 CFM at 23.0 PSI
SR 50 770 CFM at 22 PSI
GT-30 790 CFM at 22 PSI
60-1 800 CFM at 22 PSI
GT-35R 880 CFM at 22 PSI
T72 1000 CFM at 22 PSI

HKS GT2835 Turbo about 400 hp approx 580 CFM, pressure not specified
HKS GT3037 Turbo about 460 hp approx 670 CFM, pressure not specified
HKS GT3040 Turbo about 490 hp approx 710 CFM, pressure not specified
HKS GT3240 Turbo about 570 hp approx 830 CFM, pressure not specified

Quote ends.

trionic

Sorry yes it did... I read the thread yesterday and replied today

TopBanana

So is fitting an 18g or 20g compressor wheel to a standard TD05 turbo fairly straightforward?

dowser

LOL - if you have the compressor cover as well, yes...otherwise it gets a little tricky....certainly with the 20G wheel

EMS

Isnīt it possible with a hammer?

Mark.