spudgun

after starting a heated debate in another post, i wanted to ask ppp owners if they think its worth the money. posts ive read before appear divided in opinion, so id appreciate any peoples experience of ppp before i shell out £2000.how much is performance improved, fuel consumption, any problems with it, etc.
thanks for the help

Hoppy

Spud, I've got one on my MY00 UK. It's fantastic, and fully warranted of course.

Please phone IM, ask who's got a PPP demonstrator, and go and try it for yourself back to back with a standard car.

Sorry I can't comment on pre-MY99 cars, which are different. If that's you, ask for more feedback from owners here. Stef?

Hoppy

spudgun

cheers. mines a MY00, prodrive suspension, itg filter, ss bacbox, 17 " alloys

Hoppy

Hey, Spud. We've got more in common than I thought. My car's very like yours. Mail me for a test drive if you like, or see you at Dono on 30th.

MY00 UK 4-door. PPP plus ScoobySport downpipe and mid section, ITG filter, ProDrive suspension, AP 4-pots, 17in SO2PPs.

Hoppy

sunilp

I think it is worth it, for the same very good reasons as Gary has already posted.
Certainly i had no problems with it, with my SS exhaust is gave a lovely bark and goes very well from low revs. Cant comment on fuel economy but i dont think it was ever compromised.

As far as imporved performance goes, on PEs rollers before and after my car went from 242bhp and 225lb/ft to 259bhp and 259lb/ft IIRC. This was running the current 97 Ron, see the scoobynet dyno set for the plots. Obviously no rollers are 100% accurate and PEs may read higher than PS's and all that crap and allowing for differing conditions it still gives a good idea of the improvements to be had.

IMHO even a decatt exhaust and induction still wont give the same BHP gains, and whilst the torque is lovely and useable the only downside is that it doesnt hang around at the top end (boost drops off after 5k rpm) but this is probably good for safety and to run within acceptable margins.

Many will say its not worth it. No one likes paying money for anything on this BBS so dont let that sway you, their all just tight buggers

As Gary said, test drive the Prodrive demo car through Mike Wood or see if your local dealer or someone on this BBS close to you has one. As your car is quite new (mileage) it will take some miles for it to feel the same as the Prodrive car which has loosened up very nicely.

Sunil

[This message has been edited by sunilp (edited 23 December 2000).]

Trout

iTrader: (1)

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Hoppy:
<B>Spud, I've got one on my MY00 UK. It's fantastic, and fully warranted of course.
[/quote]

Hoppy,

are you sure that you car retains warranty with a decatted downpipe and mid-section. I have heard that IM are starting to apply the letter rather than the spirit of the warranty.

Spudgun,

IMHO the downpipe will make a big difference to how the car feels on the road, by all means try Hoppy's car, I am sure it will feel VERY torquey, but be aware that at least some of this joy comes from the downpipe - or try a standard PPP car at a dealer.

Also, check out the DYNO site - you will see curves for the PPP cars - top BHP not up much if at all, but mid-range torque and power are much stronger.

Enjoy,

R

GaryC

I have a MY99 PPP

Yes it is expensive, but it IS worth it. I've had no problems, and get better mpg than I got on the std car (except when really pushing )

It is possible to get the similar BHP gains from cheaper means (ie full de-cat exhaust and induction kit) but they won't give the mid range/torque increase the PPP does, PLUS you could still add a full de-cat exhaust and induction kit to further increase the gains (like wot I have ) Plus, the PPP will help re-sale values, recent spec PPP'd cars are currently £1000-£1200 above non-ppp'd cars on the used market. Add in the warrenty issue and it works out as acceptable VFM, but do it for performance reasons.

As mentioned above, get a drive in a PPPd 99/00 car and decide for yourself. Ring Mike Wood at Prodrive, they have a demonstrator which goes round the country, or find a friendly local owner who will take you for a spin

EvilBevel

Just a little factoid: remember that the warrenty part is different for different countries. In the UK, you keep your full Subaru warrenty with the PPP.

In Belgium or Holland, you have to sign a document stating that you acknowledge that you just lost your warrenty.

Never understood why BTW. Maybe because it will not be fitted by Prodrive directly ?

But it puts a different perspective on to things if you want to buy a PPP over here.

Theo

sunilp

But he doesnt so your statement is irrelevant so bugger off you EuroTrash!

EvilBevel

Oh ****-el-pain...

I thought beancounters like yourself would luuurrve the EU

Just trying to put some perspective on things.

StanS

iTrader: (3)

Spudgun - hadn't got £2k so looked out for 2nd hand ECU - got it for £350. Works very well on UK98 - big difference to pull in all gears, works well with SS back box, centre decat pipe and cone filter. All I want from Santa is the SS DP !! (She told me no way !)

Stan

spudgun

thanks for the advice hoppy. sorry, wont be able to make it on the 30th, i work mon-sat every week. hopefully therell be some meets on sundays next year, and i can see u there.
in the meantime my dealer in chelmsford will be trying to get hold of the demonstrator for me.
cheers again

spudgun

where did u get it seconhand stan?

StanS

iTrader: (3)

Spudgun,
Kept looking on the BBS's and finally saw one advertised a couple of weeks ago, and was lucky enough to get it. Went to the Barrett Motorsport guys in Canterbury (very helpful) who fitted/checked it and am really pleased with it.
I don't know about it slackening off after 5K revs (Sunil's comment) - mine keeps pulling - right up to the limit - could be the easy breathing exhaust helping.
Stan
(can't spell)

[This message has been edited by StanS (edited 24 December 2000).]

sunilp

Stan

I had the PPP on my MY99 with SS DP, SS BB and Magnex centre. Also ITG panel filter and BLitz Cone for a while. The boost falls off after 5k rpm, i know because the boost gauge says so!

Sunil

RobJenks

For A$6800 about 2500 quid you can get the APS R version.
Power up from 160 kw standard to 245 kw.Torque quoted @ 380 Nm @ 4000rpm.
Apparently 100 mph in 11.53 secs!

GaryC

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by StanS:
<B>I don't know about it slackening off after 5K revs (Sunil's comment) - mine keeps pulling - right up to the limit - could be the easy breathing exhaust helping.
[/quote]

Boost dropping off doesn't mean it stops 'pulling'. My boost drops off just past 5200, but still pulls strongly to 6k

PPP + DP, SS BB, straight through Centre, induction kit

sunilp

ah, but you know what i mean.

Sunil

StanS

iTrader: (3)

To increase the boost slightly, I remember reading about a little grommit/insert from a P1 that you could replace in a small pipe (turbo boost valve ????) but when I asked at Days they tried hard to find the part but eventually said it was the same part number on a P1 and my UK98.
Anyone know what the part number is - I believe it has a smaller hole so takes longer for the boost to be wasted out, so higher pressure build up ?? (or I may just have had too much pud etc ! but enough of my problems).

Have a good Xmas all !!

Stan

StanS

iTrader: (3)

posted twice !

[This message has been edited by StanS (edited 26 December 2000).]

dowser

Hi All

Definitely worth it on a my00! Especially if buying direct from Prodrive (no dealer commission/VAT/etc) - but you have to be EuroTrash

Haven't been on a rolling road - but difference in driveability is awesome. Mine also pulls well past 6k strongly, even though boost tails off after 5-5.5k.

EvilBevel - did you get yours through your dealer?

Richard

EvilBevel

Richard, I didn't buy it in the end, because the Belgian dealer (Vilvoorde) didn't seem to be intrested at all.

The price they quoted me was BEF 100.000 including VAT - about 4.000 Swiss francs or 1.450 UKP.

They also stated that the PPP worked well on MY98, but not on MY99 ... exactly the opposite of what most UK owners will tell you ...

I went for the Dutch EMS chip in the end, because so many Dutch Scooby owners were using that: good value for money (UKP 450), very good performance ( ), and to my knowledge the first scoob still has to fail because of that (piggybag) chip. Some had done 100.000 km with it before they took it to their next Impreza.

What I meant to say was: 2000 UKP may seem a lot, but for those that want the security of keeping their warrenty, it is an excellent choice IMHO. Like Mike Wood once said, it does what it says on the tin. For me, loosing the warrenty anyway, combined with the less than enthousiastic response from the main dealer, it became less attractive.

But I'm now friggin' around with other hardware (VF23) and the UniChip, because, yes, I'm a sad person

Speling edit.

[This message has been edited by EvilBevel (edited 27 December 2000).]

GrahamF

StanS

Just read this thread and i'm interested in your experience of a secondhand ECU. How much did it cost to have it set up?

Graham

sunilp

There isnt any setting up apart from maybe taking it out and checking boost etc.

Plug and play really

Sunil

sunilp

Theo, i agree - well said mate, can i add one thing?

you definetely are sad EUROTRASH

StanS

iTrader: (3)

GrahamF,- cost £53 incl VAT to fit (10 mins) code the ignition keys (so the fuel doesnt cut off when the ecu doesnt recognise the key) then a test run when "all" the parameters are checked on the "lap top".
Good eh ?? I was chuffed anyway.
Stan.

KPM

StanS -
Part number is 22326AA260. It's a 0.8mm Orifice, The standard UK turbo takes a 1.2mm

Cheers.

StanS

iTrader: (3)

Cheers KPM !!
I was just going to repost the question !

Do you know what boost that will produce - I haven't got any gauges !!
Stan

KPM

Sorry Stan, I don't know. I had a little play with it on my MY00 but the standard ECU continually cut the engine as it was producing too much boost, even when I increased the hole to 1mm, then 1.1mm it still continued to hesitate so I'm back to using the 1.2mm brass restrictor. Looks like I need to upgrade my ECU, I believe the 99 and 2000 ECU's are a lot less flexible with increasing the boost.

StanS

iTrader: (3)

Need to find out if this is going to be a good idea or just hassle so will try to ring round a few people who may know if it works with the PPP ECU and what the boost is.

Thanks

Stan