Roland

Help Im having white oil smoke on my exhaust it sure smells like oil. It hapens when its cold and also when its warm. After hard driving the smoke disapears but right after a few minutes on idle it starts smoking again. I hope its not the turbo I actually fitted a boost controller (Greddy) on it and I just boosted 1.1 frm .9 bar . cCould that have been the case? Another is could it be that I over filled the oil actually there is lots of oil present on the inter cooler could that be it? help

firefox

Hi there,

It could be a variety of things...maybe the seals in the turbo have gone. When did you fill up with oil ? Where is it on the dip-stick ?

Personally if the smoke stops then I would say it wasnt due to being filled up (puzzled how that would work). It is possible for too much oil to get into the intake system)

How long has it been smoking for ? Have you tried lowering the boost back to standard ? does it still smoke ?

more info....more info....more info...

J.

ps - I'm in the process of acquiring and fitting an oil catch tank - only required for high boost pressures (and modified engines). Not a good idea having oil in the engine (not in the cylinders anyway).

[This message has been edited by firefox (edited 09-09-1999).]

Roland

Firefox

The car is in the shop now and they opened the turbo theres a small gash on the bearing. The bad thing is my car ran only 10,000km and when I added the boost controller boosting at 1.1bar this happned . would you still recomend me using the boost controller? the shop who sold me the boost controller blamed me on the oil Im using . but its the same synthetic oil as what others are using.

The intercooler hose has some Oil in it maybe your right I will put a catch can for the oil so it wont goback to the engine.

firefox

Hi there,

There will always be a little oil in the air system. The trick is to keep it "alittle" There are breather pipes that feed back into the air system - thats how the oil gets in there.

Where exactly on the bearing was the fault ?

Sounds like you have some ****e in your turbo ? did they find any fragments ? I assume the turbo itself is ok (turbines, housing).

A boost controller will be fine, and the boost level isnt that high. Personally I would think its something else that has caused the problem. Chances are you will never find what caused it. If its oil related fragments, change your oil and filter.

Some people (with modified engines and turbos) fit an extra fine oil filter before the turbo. Some filter down to 7microns (not sure about flow rates).

Cheers,

J.


ps - You worry when you start getting oil in the cylinders - not in the intercooler pipework


[This message has been edited by firefox (edited 10-09-1999).]

Roland

Im goin to the shop to get my car today but they already put back the turbo so i didn't see the problem my self. although they said there is a small gash near the turbo bearing . They fitted back everything cleaned the intercooler and fixed that gash ( I really dont know what they did to fix it) . They started it and no more white smoke! but I have to see it and use it hard today , Ill get back to you . thanks!

Roland

Firefox

I got my car . No more smoke! they told me they repaired the turbo but now there is a strange whinne like those air raid horns that I hear from the turbo . could it be the gasket in the turbo? and my theory acctually it was just an over fill of oil that went thru the intake. but the shop still opened my turbo maybe just to check since everything was already dismantled, They saw traces of oil but they dont want to tell me what was done to the turbo they just said it was reapired!. But now no more smoke but the acceleration is quite slow could it be I changed oil to 20w-50? to thick? thanks

firefox

Hi there,

A whinning noise ? when do you get it ? All the time ? only on boost ?

Is it a whinning noise ? or like blowing over an empty bottle ? lol

They stripped down the turbo ? remember turbos spin at around 100,000 rpm. They should only be stripped and repaired/rebuilt by specialists.

If they have changed any parts (wheels, bearings, seals) the turbo should be rebalanced.


Cheers,

J.

Roland

Fire fox

the whinning sound happens only when the turbo spools but at high rpm around 5000 the whinning will thin out you wont hear it. Its not the blow off since we can hear it on the turbo and it happens when I step on the accelerator. Isint it you can hear the "blowing over a bottle noise" when you let of the accelerator? The whinning sound only happens on boosting. They opened the tubo but balancing it again I dont know.

I think the turbo is ok I just raced with my friend who changed his exhaust and downpipe. I could pace him ( so I belive the turbo is fine...for now) I dont have mods yet xcept I removed the catalitic and the boost controller.

thanks

Roland

Firefox

Im trying to figure out the whinning sound and Ive asked several people about it some say its the turbo some say its the blow off. It only happens when its boosting from 0 bar to .06 after the sound will be faint at .9(maybe becasue of the high rpm of the impeller) . I hear it at the right side of the car where the turbo is.

Where is the blow off of the MY97?

If its the blow off valve should I hear hear it even on high rev? I dont loose any boost although I notived that torque is not as good as it used to be.

could it be turbo or blow off valve?

firefox

Howdy

The blowoff is on the left hand side of the intercooler (passenger side). You will see a black pipe coming off the front of the intercooler...and bending around and underneath it, this goes to the dump valve (black plastic round shape, with another thick pipe coming off it).

The noise is high pitch ? is it boost or rev specific (high revs and low boost)?

Chances are it could be the turbo... but I wouldnt like to say without hearing it personally.

Have you got an induction kit fitted or the original airbox ? If you've still got the airbox you shouldnt hear anything from the blowoff/DV... if you have got an induction kit then you'll hear the valve venting (but should only be on gear changes).

If you're not happy take it back to your dealer and tell them so.

Cheers,
J.

[This message has been edited by firefox (edited 25-09-1999).]

Stef

Roland.

Is it not just the air being sucked through the air-filter, as I remember that made a similar noise to my induction kit under acceleration, only quieter.

Stef.

KRIS

...hello...in your original message you said the smoke was white.If this is the case it wont be oil as this will have a blueness to it. a similiar thing happened to my renault 5 turbo and the dealer sorted it. have you checked your head gasket?

firefox

Hi Kris..

I believe he's had the smoke problem cured.. it was the turbo...

Hes now concerened about the whinning noise...

Chances are its just the noise from the turbo and dump valve... thats why I asked about induction kit or panel filter.

Cheers,

J.

DYNT

The winning noise comes from the turbo inducer spooling up .... acuator won't be happy though.

As for the safe boost to play with ..MY97 would be 1.15bar...without mapping the ECU.

The Turbocharger can only handle 1.0bar .. go more then that ... won't last long and the shaft might break.

Cheers.

malique

That's contradictory DYNT. On one hand you say MY97 safe boost levels are 1.15 bar and on the other you say expect the turbo to pop above 1 bar, don't you mean 1.2 bar before turbo blades start flying?

Can I have my EBU back soon?

Children of the sea.

[This message has been edited by malique (edited 28-09-1999).]

firefox

children...children....

Hows it going malique and DYNT...

I havent spoke to you in a while ? you have seemed quiet...or is it just be being loud ?

Cheers...

J.

ps - All Turbos have a nominal boost/power rating... if you exceed that, then of course you are making the turbo work very hard, and this in turn will shorten the life of it.

pat

If you wanna know where the noise is coming from, why not pop the car on the rollers? :-)

Odds are that it is the turbo. There's three sorts of noise you might expect from a turbo. You might get a sort of whistle from the intake side, used to get this en masse from an MR2 Turbo with Mitsubishi Heavy Industries turbocharger.

You might get a sort of whining sound from the exhaust side... you'll hear this with a decent (read: Scoobysport :-) downpipe... very nice indeed!

Finally you might have a turbo that's out of dynamic balance. This is a Very Bad Thing(TM) which can cause catastrophic failure of the turbo. The energy in the unit when it's spinning at 100k RPM is phenomenal; you do NOT want to be anywhere near it when it goes pop! It will probably turn the compressor housing into shrapnel.... (sp?)

As for the useful range of a turbocharger.... there comes a point where increasing the spindle speed has little or no effect on mass air flow. The effect is merely to increase the air temperature (by friction between the air and the impeller). At this point, the only way to get more flow is to go for a larger turbo (or esoteric means such as supercharger feeding). It is possible that the later (read: smaller) turbos are coming close to this point at 1 bar boost, thus running any higher may a) not result in further power/torque gain and/or b) shorten the life of the turbo.

The safe operating range of the engine is a different parameter. The internals of the UK spec EJ20 engine may allow it to run boost up to 1.25 bar without causing excessive wear / placing undue load on the stressed components. Running the turbo at the boost level may be overstressing it, though.

Cheers,

Pat.

AlexM

Pat,

Where did the figure of 1.25bar (18.4Psi) come from?. I'm just curious, as I'm thinking about having boost increased on my UK MY98.

Boost currently peaks at 14Psi, and holds 12. I was looking to have a sustained boost of 14/15Psi, which hopefully shouldn't over-stretch the turbo. The engine is only ever on peak boost for short periods anyway. Don't get to drive on autobahns too often....

Regards,

Alex

Roland

Pat

Thanks for the info I was testing my turbo last night and was pushing 1.05 bar (hold) overboosting for a second at 1.2 bar . The whinning sound is still there and people told me its really the Turbo so I got a bigger turbo a VF23 STI (its on the way from Japan!) so I wanted to push my present TD04 turbo to the limit. Never did I gte the idea that it might shear of damaging the engine. SO maybe Ill just baby this turbo until I get the new one.

Would you know whats a safe max boost for my new VF23 turbo? thanks

Roland

VF23 coz they say with this you dont need to change the ECU and I want my engine to be more relaiable because I go on long trips.

we order it from our friend in Japan who is a mecahnic for a racing team itss going to cost around US$500

firefox

Howdy...

You wont have to remap, unless you up the boost.

Although its best to check on a RR afterwards.

Thats a cheap price for the 23...is it new ?

Where are you based ? Phillipines ?

J.

firefox

Howdy...

I'm running mine at 1.4 bar..although it struggles to obtain this... I would say 1.25 - 1.3 bar is its limit.

Who have you ordered it off ? How much ?

Why the 23 ? why not the 22 ?

cheers,

J.

Roland

Ok I have a Greddy Profec B Boost Controller
do I have to do anything to the ECU like re map it if I have this?

Yup Pilippines

The local distribtor got European Sbaru Imprezas for our country because its left hand drive here. So its about the same specs with you guys.

to give you an idea here there are only 13 Imprezas here minus 1 coz it got totalled . So the owners know each other by name .There are about 60 up Mitsubishi EVO4 5,6 here
so that makes our cars very rare!

A friend of mine is getting a 22B from prodrive Id sure wana ride in that car!!

firefox

Hi,

Boost controllers are fab.. if used correctly.

They will allow boost to build up as quickly as possible and maintain it until your turbo screams "no more" or your ECU cuts in.

Your ECU is stock (un modified)??

If so, then it will still have its limits. Therefore you wont be able to increase the boost much, only a couple of PSI.

The reason these limits are set, is to stop you passing a certain point. The ECU can only cope with fuelling/boost upto a predetermined point (the limit). If you cross this (by removing the boost limit), the ECU will not be able to inject the correct/right ratio of fuel for the increased boost. At this point you need to look at a remap or a fuel computer.

If your are going to be doing future mods and altering parts on a regular basis, then I would suggest you get an aftermarket reprogrammable ECU (Link, Apexi, HKS, Autronic, Haltech, etc). A remap will only be optimum for the setup it was mapped for...as soon as you change the exhaust, airfilter, turbo, engine internals they you will be deviating from the optimum configuration. And eventually you will need another remap.

Get all the work/mods done first.. then have it mapped

Hope this helps..

J.

Roland

Im using only a stock ECU. Im not thinking of changing it yet coz I want the car to be reliable. Would you know if the MY97 have better Piston and Condrod than the 96 version?

DYNT

Piston for MY97 is Cast Alloy .. same goes with the MY96.

Con-Rods is the same too...... U can buy the STI piston (FORGED) ... not to worry about the rings cos it used the same piston ring.

U can buy the STI Metal Headgasket to replace the original unit.

Do worry about Ur lifter ... is not solid so High Reving might be a problem. Get this change.

If U want to play with the internal mods. .. please get a mechanic which have work on the engine or the car itself for at least 4 years. Is different way of opening the engine ..... serious thing.... He will need manual for it.

Cheers.

firefox

Hi there..

I would go one step farther than DYNT.... Dont bother with the STI Pistons...go for JE or Cosworth or HKS forged items.... these are better than the STI ones...

Definately change the rods and their bolts..the crank is ok... As stated the hydraulic lifters will cause a problem at hig revs (pumping) - change these for the solid STI items...

I would suggest the STI or HKS metal head gaskets..

J.

ps - Difficult and special tool required to open the engine ? Its called a Stihl saw

[This message has been edited by firefox (edited 04-10-1999).]

malique

firefox: so u disagree? Breach of contract!

firefox

Malique you bloody trouble maker...

I dont disagree...and no I am not breaking the contract..

I am adding to the "contract"... theres always small print.... and it says "fit JE, Cosworth, or HKS pistons...they are better than the STI ones....".

J.

ps - Always read the small print in contracts...

AlexM

Hi All,

Does anyone know of a web resource showing an EJ20 in bits?. I'm just curious - not likely to disassemble my engine on the kitchen table. If I did, I would probably end up with a Subaru/Kenwood hybrid

Maybe someone should take some piccies when they are doing their next rebuild - DYNT, J, Malique?. From the boost levels some people are running, a rebuild can't be too far away

Cheers,

Alex


[This message has been edited by AlexM (edited 05-10-1999).]