john banks

Only if you post a video of you running with cats.

JTaylor

I'm glad you get it, Ding'. TDW sees the injustice and protests, you've taken advantage of it. It could so easily have been the other way round in a different life.

Dingdongler

I get it alright. However the thing is

1) TDW doesn't 'protest' he just moans on a japanese car forum.

2) How far do you want to take this 'injustice' concept? Forget people struggling to get on the housing ladder here how about the billions starving all across the world?

3) Saying I (or others) have taken 'advantage' of it over simplifies it somewhat. It seems to imply there was no hard graft, no sacrifice, no risk and no talent involved.
If I mention this then TDW labels it as being grandiose, self obsessed, bourgeois etc.
Also please note I have NEVER really given any details as to what I earn, what I own etc. So in many ways it's a hypothetical discussion, I'm defending the rights of others to profit from such activities rather than talking about myself most of the time.

When I've said I don't agree with the 50% tax rate for example I've never said it actually applies to me.

4) Yes it could have been so easily been the other way round, or perhaps it actually was? What I mean by this is that how do we know that TDW (for example) wasn't actually born into a more fortunate position than me?

JTaylor

All fair enough, I actually see it from both sides. I just think and feel that we don't live in a true meritocracy, fortune plays a significant part in our lot and it's worth considering this when people like TDW protest (moan) about the "Ponzi scheme".

Dingdongler

I agree. The biggest issue I have is that it seems in this country social mobility is getting worse rather than better. This needs to be addressed. 'In my day' you could come from a very poor and disadvantaged background and still really make something of your life, I'm not sure it's as easy these days.

As for the global Ponzi scheme that is fiat currency, property, debt etc it is truly frightening

Maz

iTrader: (34)

TDW can't be that hard up. Having owned an Impreza followed by a VW Golf R 32, I would consider him well off. If memory serves me correctly he's also worked on some foreign oil rig. This being the case I find his protests (moans) hard to take seriously. It's no use blowing your money on trinkets and then moaning you can't afford to buy a house. Live within your means. House aside my motto is buy something only if you can afford to buy it twice.

JTaylor

I think you've missed the point. Rather than moaning about his lot I think TDW's objection is to the way the housing market is being manipulated by the state and the way that BTLers profit from this and often (not always) simply because they were in the right place at the right time when the music stopped. Until Ding' posted above I thought it was only Hodgy that had grasped TDW's perspective. No wonder TDW bangs on about it.

LSherratt

iTrader: (1)

What about cars paid in cash?

tony de wonderful

Well it's not really about me, but I could have saved more, but I could also have saved less. I've enough saved up for a 50% LTV mortgage on a 300 k property but that doesn't get you much where I live. I'm 35 and wish I had bought in 2003/2004 but the fact was I wasn't ready to 'settle down' and buy a house. Frame it as an investment and sure it would have paid off, but back in 2003 if I had bought 150 k worth of pork bellies with a load of debt, people would have thought me mad. I still think not buying was the wrong decision investment wise, but for the right reasons; throwing all your money on one investment with leverage is a hell of a risk. It has all sorts of wrong written all over it.

hodgy0_2

yes, quite

I remember listening to the radio in the run up to the last election - and a guy came on asking what the Government was going to do to help him buy a house, he lived in London and where he wanted to buy - Ealing / Acton he simply could not afford

now this guy was married, in his 40's and an accountant (certainly a professional of some sort) and obviously not on the breadline
but now he wants to settle down with darling wife and start a family in the leafy environs of Ealing

except he couldn’t and he wanted the Government to do something about it – for him

it was a whinge of the most epic and pathetic proportions – as I suspect he had probably driven brand new or nearly new cars all life – you know the DINKY good like all thru his 20, and 30's - plenty of skiing plenty of scuba diving

the most I have ever spent on a car is 8k, and that was a few years ago – I always prioritised a house to live in and as an investment, making/earning money is hard and I don't like to throw it away

I simply can’t mentally justify the monetary loss you get from buying stuff like cars, I have chatted to colleagues about cars and heard them talk of losses running into the 50K as they chop and change brand new cars every 3 years – they don’t see it though coz they just roll over the finance – just seems utter utter madness to me

JTaylor

I used to 'protest' about it quite regularly.

https://www.scoobynet.com/showpost.p...5&postcount=63

https://www.scoobynet.com/showpost.p...1&postcount=64

https://www.scoobynet.com/showpost.p...4&postcount=18

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I think a point that is being somewhat missed here is the cost of land, materials ,labour, project manager,site foreman and architect as well as legal fees etc,etc to build a house, also the availability of land in prime locations or more to the point the lack there of.

All aspects of this are market led, plumbers and electricians on £50/70k pa, plasterers also do pretty well along with tilers, ok in a recession you can find people that will work slightly cheaper but quality will suffer, also the price of reasonable quality kitchens and bathrooms has risen considerably in the last 10yrs.

How much spare land is there close to city centres or built up areas in general that have good transport links, not very much where I live and none in the area I sold my last house in, these are factors in pricing.

Ultimately houses will always have to be worth in the region of 25% more than the cost to build and as that cost rises so will the price of houses.

Edit to add; have you seen the price of a good quality brick?

Matteeboy

I think TDW is quite well off; big savings, etc?!

I love doing things differently more to annoy others than anything else. The amount of time keyboard warriors tell me we're "stupid" for the way we do things is hilarious.

We are just so bloody obsessed with property. Yet it's so bloody boring.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Fair play to you if you have a job that means you can afford to rent and have £100k+ in savings well done, some of us myself included never made enough to be able to afford to do that, so I made the roof over my head my savings account and pension plan.

Many ways to skin a cat and all that.

Matteeboy

No insults or anything? I need a little sit down...!

We don't actually earn all that much but when you run your own business, you can make SO much more out of every pound your company makes. Really makes a huge difference.

hodgy0_2

agreed

no right or wrong way to do this - every persons situation and aspirations (needs/wants/desires) are different

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I'm cool with you dude, just not wild about BMW's.

Matteeboy

Join many others! They certainly don't suit everyone and the styling upsets many! Hopefully the van offends you less ;-)

I like all sorts TBH; Audi annoys me a bit but that's about it.

DYK

I been looking at the BMW 1series coupe,still undecided on it... ?

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Love the van, I used to have the low rent version 4x4 Mazda Bongo with the same style roof with a bed in it great leisure vehicle, I've had a T4 crew cab pickup syncro for 4yrs now that I use to get all my materials for this place, it's had a few small problems nothing major but it is 16yrs old and done 250km still a few left in the old girl yet.

Matteeboy

Ditchy; wow those syncro pick ups are damn cool!

Dingdongler

That's why I've made a point of pointing this out recently. There was an assumption by some that people like me have no concept of the history of money, debt, banking etc. That we don't read, investigate or question economic policy, that we are blinkered sheep.

Trust me, it's not true and it's rather patronising. I've spent years on sites that have talked about nothing other than these matters ie hpc and zero hedge, I know how the world works.
Search back, at one point I was so convinced the whole monetary system would collapse that I invested heavily in gold thinking all my hard earned paper money savings could worthless

It took a while to realise the extent to which governments and central banks would go to in manipulating the so called 'free market'. When the penny finally dropped I radically changed my investment tactics.

And yes of course the housing market is manipulated, just look at the boom we're having in house prices at the moment (in London anyway)

As I've said before everything is a bubble, you just need to know when to get on and off. But this involves time, effort and risk taking, it doesn't just happen. You can't begrudge people when they get this right. TDW says there is no risk, it is all state backed now, this is rubbish.

Finally, I don't feel TDW in pure ethical terms is truly any more opposed to the unfairness of the 'system' than me. It's just that he made the 'wrong' choices and now vilifies anybody who made more profitable ones. (and I'm not necessarily talking about me)

As they say...'don't hate the playah, hate the game'

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

You taking the p!ss, it will be cool if I chop my caravan in half and bolt it on the back in a few years when I have some time on my hands.

Mind you it is rare as rocking horse poo with diamond studs, and it's a left hooker.

JTaylor

Interesting post, I remember the gold rush:

https://www.scoobynet.com/non-scooby...highlight=Gold

As for TDW, if he has £150k to throw at bricks and mortar I think he'll be in a fairly strong position in ten years time, but get his frustration at not having bought ten years earlier. His point that he did the wrong thing for the right reason is a fair one in my view.

hodgy0_2

What I find fascinating is how few alternate views regarding the nature of this "ponzi scheme" economy are put forward

The narrative is so closely controlled

And as I said in another post

He who controls the past controls the future, he who controls the present controls the past

Which leads me to repeat - role on the status quo

Dingdongler

Of course, but this is also called good/bad luck. I've made decisions based on the right reasons many times that have then turned out to be wrong. This also includes property when I stayed out of the market during part of the last boom because the fundamentals just didn't stack up.(Even though I had money to invest)

What I realised is that there are no fundamentals when it comes to UK property, or they can change rapidly.
Bad luck on my part, a few choice investments at that time with money I had available could have meant me being able to retire in my late forties.

No point crying about it or vilifying the people I know (including some who aren't very bright but just followed the market blindly) who are now in that position. I tried my best, that's all I can do.


It's always interesting to look back at old posts. Your post at the time states gold was $1360, it went as high as $1900, if only I sold at that point

I sold most at about $1500 fyi so still made a decent return. I held onto some and the price is currently about $1250. Not quite sure what to do with this remaining amount.

Anyway, I find it fascinating investing in these unique economic times we live in . I could prattle on about it all day.....

JTaylor

I don't know a lot about it, I'm just a bed salesman.

john banks

I had a happy time with gold from $800 to $1200, repeatedly spread betting similar ranges over and over again, but index linked certificates instead of UK housing did well too.

Dingdongler

Oh yes, I had forgotten about all that. Funny how we all mellow with age

JTaylor

Quite. I've finished my return to education now, too, so may go back in to estate agency as per the early part of my 'career'. If only I knew then what I know etc. etc...