JackClark

Interesting times ahead. What is telling is the only argument for Windows is market penetration.

Google Apps for business is excellent, such a shame they don't offer it free any more. I tried the free version of Outlook but it sucked.

Galifrey

iTrader: (3)

If all the serious users are doing their programming and testing on OSX and Linux then it explains why windows is so **** sometimes, not enough testing on windows

Shaun

Jack,
Cheap is dear and dear is cheap.

If something is charged for, it has an element of sustainability. That makes perfect business sense, not only from a commercial, but also customer perspective.

It's catch 22 in respects of the "installed userbase" argument being key. It's an obvious argument..... But it's logical. Let's be honest, windows is far from being a turd, and in all honesty is not even an issue. We have far bigger issues in technology and ICT industry.

Like most things, if we actually focused our resource on the things that really drive us forward, we would be far more an advanced society IMO.

JackClark

True. Honestly, I couldn't believe what I was providing for my customers for free, and they couldn't and still can't believe that it's free. Bravo to those who signed up early.

No, Windows is not a turd, it's just my whipping boy. I'm sat here looking at three screens, two are Windows and they're doing something useful, the pretty one is browsing Scoobynet.

hodgy0_2

Yes, interesting times that is for sure

The demise of BB had more to do with corporate hubris than any other factor IMO, demonstrated by the fact that they ordered 3 corporate jets, just before they went bust

It reminded me of the Detroit car executives who flew to Washington in corporate jets to ask for multi billion $ bailouts

They too, like BB had been making irrelevant products for years

I don,t think either Google, Apple or MS are quite as bad in this regard, but any dominate player such as MS present a pretty big target.

And in my view MS usually get it right eventually, (think BPOS, Sharepoint, OCS R2) O365 is taking market share from google - and in my very personal experience several corporates have even chosen the MS product over google - after extensive trials or even moved back to MS after deploying google.

I find the gmail "client" simply unusable

I had a presentation from Apple regarding there corporate strategy last week and they said some interesting stuff, essentially Mobility, mobility mobility, but as we pointed out the presentation was delivered by them from Laptops

JackClark

And I hope they unplugged the laptop and ran around the board room a few times

pimmo2000

iTrader: (6)

Not totally on the point, but around the internet posts

http://socialtimes.com/how-the-inter...graphic_b85877

Shaun

I'm genuinely surprised about your views on the google client. We've migrated 6k users to this and it's been a revelation, productivity wise. Which for business is king. It really has been a major step forward.

What gives you gas specifically with the client?

JackClark

That's good fun.

One question though, what Microsoft and Yahoo sites get visited more than Facebook? I know the stats are a bit old but really??

Here's some up to date data

http://www.ebizmba.com/articles/most-popular-websites

Actually if you lump together a few MS sites maybe it's true.

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

probably already said, but most businesses use windows. Servers etc probably all run Linux, but the apps that companies use are predominately windows based. Here to stay

jonc

The future of the Apple Mac is even bleaker than that of windows. Clearly the future is not with Apple's OSX/Mac PC's.
http://m.digitaltrends.com/computing...on-innovating/

JackClark

Give it up Jon, that was January, have you forgotten what Apple have done this year?

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

I have

JackClark

That's good. You also won't notice when you start using the same tech in two years time.

Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Windows is still years ahead for corporate usage and management on a large scale.

Active Directory is untouched at present and no amount of free versions of excel will make up for it.

We had all this when Open Office went mainstream, MS Office still won out.

Linux/UNIX has its place for web hosting for security reasons, I've never found a decent use for OSX other than looking like a bender in Starbucks.

Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Also I think MS have got a decent charge on with enterprise cloud solutions and hybrid deployments.

Being able to pick and chose whether to utilise exchange, Lync, sharepoint and AD on premise, in Azure or both is pretty powerful for businesses of all sizes.

jonc

Have you forgotten what they haven't been able to do? Whatever they've done this year it hasn't reversed the declining trend through out this year.

In your professional opinion, do you honestly thing OSX will take over from Windows? Corporate and enterprise environments are slow moving markets where PCs generally have a 3 year life cycle (for Lenovo HW). With that in mind, even with "free" OSX upgrades, the hardware needs to be refreshed. The cost involved just on hardware alone makes Mac refreshes stupidly expensive compared to a typical PC. Put simply, Macs are just too expensive. But the main problem is the software support, OSX simply cannot compete with Windows on the neither the development not commercial front. Apple with OSX is simply not geared up for enterprise services like Microsoft, which have AD architecture, Exchange, IIS, terminal, certificate, virtualisation, etc etc. You cannot change an organisation from the bottom up, ie from end user devices, change has to come from the infrastructure side. And this is where I see the change occuring with virtulisation. More and more of the infrastructure is being virtualised and this is filtering down to end user with VDI where users are able to access the corporate network on their home devices via virtualised windows environment and virtualised applications. This is were the future is going decreasing the dependency for desktop and reducing costs and greater security with virtualised Windows.

JackClark

I never said OSX would replace Windows in the corporate environment, I think Chrome OS has a better chance.

JackClark

Declining trend, you mean Windows is declining.

http://blogs.computerworld.com/windo...15-and-falling

jonc

You're right, desktop computing is slowly declining on all fronts except in situations that still requires dedicated hardware. Mobility is massive growth area and we've already facilitated our virtualised Windows corporate environment on tablets and non work devices through BYOD initiatives.

I could be wrong with regards to Chrome OS, but the issues with Apple OSX still applies to Chrome adoption in enterprise. If Apple couldn't do it, I doubt Google could either, it just doesn't have the scalability nor the integration to facilitate such a move that would convince enterprise managers that it is a viable alternative to Windows or even OSX.

JackClark

Apple won't do it as it can't be used on other hardware.

What percentage of corporate users could get by with a browser? Probably incredibly high. Most would just use email, spreadsheets and documents, all work great with Google Apps, which works great with Google Chrome.

jonc

Yes, but its not as simple as just being able to use spreadsheets or documents. There are a huge number of addons, macros, templates and integrated solutions developed in house and from other 3rd party vendors that tie in heavily into the Ms Office suite. It not just corporates that have to be convinced, vendors would also have to invest time and money to allocate resources to develope for Chrome, and if there is little demand for it on the corporate side it wouldn't be financially viable to direct resources for that platform. If Chrome and Google apps can provide a competitive advantage and reduce cost whilst also maintaining full functionatily, manageability, security and support/training that the business requires as with the current Windows platform, then maybe Chrome might have a chance, but it is a massive long shot!!

Shaun

I wouldn't say that desktop computing is declining from a business perspective..... I see it all about adding options to compliment each other.

I'd agree that mobility is a growth area..... it's what the business needs and what the customer wants. It's a shame that most industry software houses haven't caught up yet with what the end-user needs now!!

For once.... the technology is around to support it all.

Shaun

Jack is right - Google Apps (web based client) certainly can meet a good chunk of the business need - just not all of it.

jonc

When I say declining, I don't mean reduction in number of desktops, but increase in product life cycle before they become end of life. We're looking to extend the operating life from 3 years to 4 or 5 years, ie the demand for new PCs has gone down.

Shaun

Ah gotcha - yeah we've gone through a similar process tbh. Ours was previously (currently) 4yrs.... consideration to extend to 5yrs now.

jonc

That is true but there is an even bigger chunk of business that cannot use cloud based solutions for storage or 'software as a service' such as those provided by Google due to regulatory, compliancy and accountability laws in each country. For example Sarbanes-Oxley will determine how and where data is stored and for how long. This will mean, for example, that data for a particular company has to be stored on-site rather than on a cloud service where the data can be stored and accessed outside the jurisdiction of the country the company is operating and could be subject to legislation that falls outside or does not meet SOX compliance. SOX compliance is just one of many regulatory and legislative 'grey areas' that companies have to operate in that will bring many questions in terms of contractual obligations and due diligence of third party providers of cloud based services. Is it worth all the time, effort and resources to look at the legalities surrounding cloud solutions? For some it might, but for the majority, it's hard enough just to maintain compliancy with their current system. This isn't to say that companies won't use cloud solutions, Microsoft already provide SaaS solution to allow companies to utilise cloud technology 'on-premises' with SharePoint 2013 and keep everything in house.

JackClark

I'm looking at Vault for Google apps to enable a company to connect to NHS data. It's looking good so far.

http://www.google.co.uk/intx/en/ente...cts.html#vault

tubbytommy

iTrader: (20)

+10000


who cares, people just buy what they want.

JackClark

No Tellytubby, people often get what they're given.