Fair enough.

Could your mum have self-taught to "O" level maths? French? German? Geography? Physics? Chemistry? Biology?

Mine certainly couldn't, and without those subjects, not many discoveries would be made today.

Of course my mum grounded me in reading and number, but once I went to school they took over and she backed them up.

And there are literally MILLIONS of mums who either can't, or won't teach their kids anything.

But hey...teachers aren't important to them?

 

Nah those mums who can't teach certain subjects are not important because theyre most likely the types who didnt do jack all at school anyway and probably do see them as childcare people rather than a tutor

Seriously though. I have a very good knowledge of Geography and Id say 90% of it is self taught. My schooling was rubbish in terms of language, I did Spanish for 3 years. Although I spent 3 months in Latin America and basically self taught myself Spanish on that basis with just interacting with locals and "trying".

I'm not disregarding the importance of teacher, on the contary. Just saying that the majority of what you learn at school is immaterial. I find it more of a way of a child to learn what they find interesting to make an educated decision of where they might want to further their education for a career later in life... And that can only come from an influential teacher - most of which IMO are not.

I guess what I am trying to say is being a teacher is not a job - but they see it as such. Being a teacher should be a lifestyle choice.

 

I am none the wiser.
Am I reading that you are saying
- a teacher will get an average of 50% of their wage over the years (40/80) if they complete forty years of service?
- it is not a final salary scheme?

Has this always been the case, or was it previously more generous?
If so when did it change and also could you tell me if there are future changes being proposed as we speak.

I realise I could probably find this out myself, but I would be grateful if you could be the horses mouth for me.

ps your typo deication looks very close to deification - I wonder what Dr Freud would have to say.

 

Many a true word!!!!

 

The police

But don't get us started on our pensions!!! I was due to retire at 58 after 30 years, but now they are looking at adding another 10 years on top (68). No finally salary pension but an average of your career pay which they have now stopped any incremental pay rises. Pension contributions are now 14% (from 11%) and they are taking about phasing out any lump sum payments.

Quite a few have dropped out of the scheme and bought property

 

Indeed, I think anybody starting out would be best advised to strongly consider this or similar options.

 

Went to my 3 youngest parents evening yesterday, all the three teachers were fantastic committed individuals

And on the pensions note - 99% of pensions are the biggest financial confidence trick in the world

Most people are going to have to get used to a pretty poverty stricken old age

 

No Teacher has yet answered my question:-

Why not strike on an INSET Day?

This way you will not hurt the kids but still send a message to the Government.

That said, you do realise that the games up, don't you? You will be dragged into the real world come hell or high water ..... that's the world everyone else (except maybe Firemen) have lived for decades.

 

politicians seem to have working practises that date back to the 18th century

why can't they simply do a 40hr week with 25 odd days holiday like the rest of us

 

Of course.......but you SIGNED UP to it, knowing that YOUR world would be filled with people breaking laws.

Teachers didn't. THEY signed up to educate kids, NOT to be:

Childminders,
Social Services,
Police,
Child Services,
Food providers,

etc etc.

You WOULD NOT believe the sort of stuff my Mrs is now expected to do as head of a local primary.
And the **** the government have dished out, year on year, making the school the mouthpiece for more and more of their mad policies.

 

Many older teachers loathe the so called Baker-Days. They were stolen from teachers' holiday entitlements to prevent them from striking on those very days, which they gave up voluntarily in the past.

do your homework Pete. you are more intelligent than this.

 

I agree mate, this is the job i signed into - i was merely answering your question.

I think teachers work very hard and are dedicated to the cause. I watched my uncle have a nervous breakdown from the strains that being a teacher caused; so i think its a very special person that can become one.

And i also agree that teachers do a lot more than just teach kids, in a way the roles you listed are similar to the ones we do

Its a kick in the teeth for all of us in roles such as these where our pensions are being moved to the point where we question whether to continue in the role. And then you here that MP's are getting a 10% pay rise which they can't prevent as its to far through the system to stop it.

 

 

Teachers don't know they are born , I've not got any time whatsoever to listen about poor pay , working hours , conditions
They should keep there heads down , mouths shut , and thank **** they don't work in the real world

 

you know what at one time i would agree,but as a country i think we are eager too put another person down,we have this jealously if someone wants to do better.We drag each other down so much,and the powers that be love it.
Its the same all the time,tanker drivers go on strike,an outrage,firefighters go on strike,etc etc..bla bla feckin blaaaaa. why don't we race to the top...

 

It's nothing to do with dragging anyone down or jealousy

It's very simple , a fair days pay for a fair days work

And IMO this phrase isn't applicable to teachers

 

Unfair in this context just means you see someone not having to suffer as much as you, and you therefore resent them.

 

Whatever

 

Go on Einstien carry on and tell me and everyone how I don't know , then I'll tell you how I do

Lol what a fecking turnip

 

I can see what you mean but my comments don't come from a comparison to me
I enjoy what I do and think I get rewarded accordingly ( otherwise I wouldn't do it )
If you look at the bigger picture and compare other jobs it puts it into perspective
How about drawing a comparison with the armed forces
Or folks that care for the elderly
Or the folks that care for people with mental or physical illness
Some of these people are very poorly paid for what they do

Yes they may have chosen to do these jobs by choice , but it doesn't mean they deserve less pay , niether do you see them going on or threatening strike action every other week

 

Go on then toneh...I'll bite.

 

Toneh, isnt that list comparing skilled with unskilled?

 

I've worked at
Belper school
Arnold hill school
Two of our best mates ( who we holiday with on occasion ) are teachers , one is now head teacher
My cousin is a teacher
I live in school house , which is incorporated within the local primary and have regular contact with the teachers ( when they are there )
IMO as far as attendance /working hours go
It's pi$$ poor

Now I'm sure your gonna tell me about how they are bogged down with work after or away from school
If that's the case how come out of all our friends the ones that are teachers have the most free time and holidays
And when you live in a school , it becomes quite shocking how often it's closed for one reason or another



And they still moan about pay

 

It depends what you class as a skill
because your in care for the elderly or disabled or in the armed forces doesn't mean you are unskilled , it depends on what level your at
And still have to put extra hours in doing certain training and gaining additional qualifications if you wish which can help you climb the ladder

I have a friend who teaches offenders in a secure hospital


She's been assaulted numerous times
Is very often at risk
Most of the time she feels unappreciated by both the managment and pupils ( prisoners)
There are no half terms or 6 week summer holidays
But she enjoys it
All for around 16k a year

Yeah poor old teachers

 

As far as I am aware anyone can walk into those jobs without prerequisite qualifications. Teachers along with doctors et al require certain higher level qualifications and rightfully are paid accordingly.

 

So your saying that the pay awarded to teachers should be based on qualifications attained , not on hours worked or how they perform

 

I was following on from your comment, "it doesn't mean they deserve less pay" and was disagreeing, but no, where jobs such as teaching are concerned I do not think that wages should reflect hours worked.

 

Why not , just because someone trained studied 3/4 years don't in my book make them a special case , that amount of training /studying is very common for many jobs/trades
And I always read comparisons to doctors on this site
I'm pretty sure training to become a doctor /gp requires a lot more training than most other jobs / professions ,including teachers

 

I agree, I think that doctors do train more/harder than teachers but at the same time I think that the level of training and accountability that teachers have is reflected in what they get paid.

There are many professions that do get paid, in my opinion, disproportionate amounts to each other. I know financial advisers, IT techs, bankers who get paid a lot more than teachers, often with no additional qualifications. This of course in accordance with my own set of values. If you don't place much value on the education of people who will be taking this country forward in the next generation then I can understand your objections.

 

Totally agree with the banker , I.t wages it's ludicrous
As regards the education now of future generations , I think we're fecked on that one
The number of youngsters that come into my trade with little or no knowledge of maths , English , history , geography , is shocking
Yet have gcse's to prove it , how can this be ?
Out latest starter ( straight from school) didn't know what world war 2 was ( I'm not joking)

Here's another example ,my mate is in his early 20's and his mrs the same
Both mr and mr average both an average education

She said to him " I saw some ducks down the road this morning "
She said " how would they get there "
My mate said they would have flown , I kid you not this is the reply
" what ducks can't fly " my mate " of course they can "
" well what about swans " yes swans can fly as well
" stop telling lies " , I'm not telling lies ,they can fly
"honestly "
Yes
" well I never knew that "
Do you know what she does for a living , a nursery assistant
So what a fantastic start our youngsters are getting with this one
And what a fantastic education she must have had