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Osama Bin Laden is DEAD :)

Old May 4, 2011 | 04:27 PM
  #331  
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the simple way of solving this whole issue is pull the troops out of the Muslim countries let them sort there own problems out. why should my hard earned be wasted there.

Islam doesn't agree with terrorism many scholars have said it's forbidden, jihad means when your been oppressed youfight back and that means you can't go to a country where there is peace and cause havoc it's forbidden. it's basic Muslim knowledge, yes there is some nutters out there who do things in the name of Islam but in 29 years I'm yet to come across one.

Islamism isnt the problem or the route of the problem it's the individuals weather Osama existed or not mr Obama. it'll be so nice to chuck em all in one room and let them fight it put between them lol

Last edited by Mus; May 4, 2011 at 04:41 PM.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 04:34 PM
  #332  
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Let's try and remember this wasn't just any ordinary criminal, it was one of the world's biggest (ever) known terrorists. Although he wasn't obviously armed, he may have had a trigger device concealed on his person somewhere, and had the whole compound rigged to blow sky-high in case of imminent capture. I don't think there ever much chance he'd make it out alive unless he was making his intention to surrender very, very clear, which reports seem to suggest he wasn't.

Also worth pointing out, when the SAS went into the Iranian Embassy to end the siege, at least one of the hostage-takers actually did try to surrender, but in all the smoke and chaos from the flash-bang grenades and shooting it was apparently too big a chance to take to allow him to. None of the bad guys made it out alive that day.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 04:53 PM
  #333  
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So is the picture plastered all over the internet of a dead OBL a fake?
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:07 PM
  #334  
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Originally Posted by jonc
C'mon, TDW surely you are intelligent enough to work it out! Iraq being 97% Muslim doesn't ring a bell?
So what? Why does it logically follow that just because a country happens to be Muslim that Muslims 1000's of miles away are entitled to be angry and seek vengeance?
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:13 PM
  #335  
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Originally Posted by f1_fan
OH FFS not this **** again. Banny you got the RTM button to hand?

Why shoudl I view Ialam critically because a few extremists claim to be acting in the name of it. It's like tarnishing the whole of the Cathiolic religion because the IRA bombers were Catholic.
The IRA never claimed to be acting on behalf of Catholicism FFS, it was just incidental/accidental that they were Catholics, their ideology was more extreme left than anything else.

I'm just baffled that you can't see how it follows that Islamic terrorism makes people vary of Islam.

It's very simple.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:15 PM
  #336  
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Originally Posted by f1_fan
No he's not quite right, there are some extremists who claim to be acting in the name of Islam which is subtley but importantly different!
Maybe, but ultimately anyone who claims to be a Muslim, christian, whatever is just 'claiming'.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:18 PM
  #337  
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Originally Posted by f1_fan
Well not sure about that. Tony quite clearly said that Islam has an extremist problem and therefore we should not be surprised if people view Islam critically and suspiciously.... I take that to mean all of Islam not just the extremists especially as he went on to trot out the line that Islam (i.e. all of it) is anti West, anti Capitalist and has imperialist ambitions over the West therefore by implication I don't think he is saying Islam is good do you?
No I said Islamism.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:18 PM
  #338  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
So what? Why does it logically follow that just because a country happens to be Muslim that Muslims 1000's of miles away are entitled to be angry and seek vengeance?
Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
The IRA never claimed to be acting on behalf of Catholicism FFS, it was just incidental/accidental that they were Catholics, their ideology was more extreme left than anything else.

I'm just baffled that you can't see how it follows that Islamic terrorism makes people vary of Islam.

It's very simple.
Big own goal here

So it doesn't follow that because an invaded country is Muslim Muslims in other parts of the world should be upset about it yet it does follow that because some terrorists claim to be acting in the name of Islam we should be wary of Islam

Hmmmm... how do you rationalise those two completely opposing views?
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:21 PM
  #339  
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Originally Posted by Mus
the simple way of solving this whole issue is pull the troops out of the Muslim countries let them sort there own problems out. why should my hard earned be wasted there.

Islam doesn't agree with terrorism many scholars have said it's forbidden, jihad means when your been oppressed youfight back and that means you can't go to a country where there is peace and cause havoc it's forbidden. it's basic Muslim knowledge, yes there is some nutters out there who do things in the name of Islam but in 29 years I'm yet to come across one.

Islamism isnt the problem or the route of the problem it's the individuals weather Osama existed or not mr Obama. it'll be so nice to chuck em all in one room and let them fight it put between them lol
Right so the 7/7 bombers were somehow 'oppressed' by the invasion of Iraq even though they live 1000's of miles away and have no relations in Iraq?!

You need to do better Mus.

That is unreasonable.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:23 PM
  #340  
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Originally Posted by Kieran_Burns
You make very tenuous links between individuals, countries and religions. Your logic would dictate that Christianity has massive extremist issues because so many previous terrorists have come from 'Christian' countries.

It seems to me reading this thread that people are not reading what is being written or are purposely putting a disingenuous slant on their interpretation of the same.

I would like to remind the people presently flooding the Mods forum with RTM posts that it is not a tool for complaining about a point of view you don't like, and that those complaining are (from reading this thread) at least as guilty of the actions they are complaining about.

I think some of the comments being made (conspiracy theory type) are in some cases laughable (that's my PERSONAL opinion) and would like to see some evidence to back these ideas up.

Oh, and can we NOT have this turn into another "Islam is responsible for the all the evil in the World" thread again? The point regarding NI was well made and extremely relevant. I genuinely feared for my life when visiting Belfast during the troubles - I'm an English Catholic.

If we could PLEASE restrict this IBL and his evil (plus CIA / US / legalities etc) it would be really appreciated.

Oh, and as to the whole shooting him when he was unarmed - what differentiates a society against the evil of an individual is due process. You have to ask yourself if due process was followed when executing him ('cos that's what it was)
There is absolutely nothing tenuous about the links of the 9/11 bombers, 7/7 bombers, Madrid bombers, Bali Bombers and Islam.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:25 PM
  #341  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
No I said Islamism.
Actually you said Islamist.

Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
You still seem to be in total denial that Islam has this extremist problem, it's manifest in your unreasonable incredulity that people should view Islam criticaslly and perhaps a little supiciously when a whole miitant/extremist movement plans and plots outragenous in the name of Islam, not to mention the larger Islamist movement which is anti-west, anti-capitalist and in some cases has imperialist ambitions over western countries.
So you don't mean Islamist as in a follower of Islam, but rather a promoter of Islamism?
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:26 PM
  #342  
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Originally Posted by f1_fan
Big own goal here

So it doesn't follow that because an invaded country is Muslim Muslims in other parts of the world should be upset about it yet it does follow that because some terrorists claim to be acting in the name of Islam we should be wary of Islam

Hmmmm... how do you rationalise those two completely opposing views?
That doesn't make any sense F1.

The US never invaded Iraq because it was a 'Muslim country' (whatever that means). I don't see all the mosques burned down and replaced with Churches.

In actual facts perhaps Christians are entitled to all feel angry because Iraq also has a Christian population!
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:30 PM
  #343  
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Originally Posted by f1_fan
Actually you said Islamist.



So you don't mean Islamist as in a follower of Islam, but rather a promoter of Islamism?
Indeed.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:33 PM
  #344  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
Right so the 7/7 bombers were somehow 'oppressed' by the invasion of Iraq even though they live 1000's of miles away and have no relations in Iraq?!

You need to do better Mus.

That is unreasonable.
read my comments again I clearly stated there is "NUTTERS" I just think this whole terrorist thing is over hyped.

your answer to terrorism is simple all out war!!!! when really you need to look study and understand the route of the problem why is there terrorist today? how can we stop it in a peaceful cost effective manor. violence doesn't solve everything.

no one will wake up and decide they would want to blow things for no reason.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:36 PM
  #345  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
That doesn't make any sense F1.

The US never invaded Iraq because it was a 'Muslim country' (whatever that means). I don't see all the mosques burned down and replaced with Churches.

In actual facts perhaps Christians are entitled to all feel angry because Iraq also has a Christian population!

so the us took over to help for free???? nothing is free in this world the USA used weapon of mass destruction malaki to steal oil.

end off
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:42 PM
  #346  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
That doesn't make any sense F1.

The US never invaded Iraq because it was a 'Muslim country' (whatever that means). I don't see all the mosques burned down and replaced with Churches.

In actual facts perhaps Christians are entitled to all feel angry because Iraq also has a Christian population!
Nothing to do with that. You said the fact that Iraq was a Muslim country was no reason other Muslims should be upset about it being invaded. Then you said that because some extremists act in the name of Islam we should be wary of all Islam. Those two statements are obviously diametrically opposed!
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:50 PM
  #347  
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Originally Posted by f1_fan
Nothing to do with that. You said the fact that Iraq was a Muslim country was no reason other Muslims should be upset about it being invaded. Then you said that because some extremists act in the name of Islam we should be wary of all Islam. Those two statements are obviously diametrically opposed!
I don't believe they are.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 06:53 PM
  #348  
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Originally Posted by Mus
violence doesn't solve everything.
Tell that to the Founders of Carthage!
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Old May 4, 2011 | 07:00 PM
  #349  
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Originally Posted by JTaylor
Some of these conspiracy theories are superb.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 07:03 PM
  #350  
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Some of the lefties on this board who find some appeal in the standard conspiracy theories (such as 9/11 being an inside job) - should know that these theories originate from the American extreme right...the militia movements etc. It's ironic.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 07:23 PM
  #351  
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Originally Posted by markjmd
.

. None of the bad guys made it out alive that day.
I am not sure that is correct, five were shot and killed, one survived posing a hostage

but I agree with the sentiment

anyway -- in life you generally find what you are looking for

if you want to see the world in terms of some sort of global jihad/conflict/crusade, with extremists plotting to turn your local pub into a mosque, (or your mosque into a lap dancing club) then I am afraid that is exactly what you will see.

and it will frame your every thought, bit of a sad life if you ask me


anyway in before the lock

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Old May 4, 2011 | 07:31 PM
  #352  
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They're not gonna release pics of the body, sensible if ya asks me.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 07:47 PM
  #353  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
I don't believe they are.
Well that is no great surprise given your usual agenda
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Old May 4, 2011 | 08:21 PM
  #354  
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Some people on this thread need to 'wake up and small the bacon', how do people on here try to defend these nutty countries(unless that's where you're from)
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Old May 4, 2011 | 08:26 PM
  #355  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
So what? Why does it logically follow that just because a country happens to be Muslim that Muslims 1000's of miles away are entitled to be angry and seek vengeance?
I'll leave to Mohammad Sidique Khan to answer that for you.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/new...news=1&bbcws=1
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Old May 4, 2011 | 08:31 PM
  #356  
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Originally Posted by jonc
I'll leave to Mohammad Sidique Khan to answer that for you.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/new...news=1&bbcws=1
Another Nutter Full Of Sh*t
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Old May 4, 2011 | 08:39 PM
  #357  
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just for tdw ,
quick history lesson , every single war the yanks have been involved in has been preeceded by a big event
ww1 lucatainia sets sail from new york to ireland , 1200people on board after being told by the yanks in a formal letter from the germans in the new york times, do not do this you will be sailing through a war zone and are likely to be sunk , guess what it was sunk by uboats all aboard lost , uproar in america and in they came . point proven , it has been dived on since and has shell cases and munnitions on board the wreck to this day , not bad for a civi boat
ww2 pearl harbour . the yanks knew 3weeks before that the japs where planning something and even knew when the japanese fleet set sail .
vietnam , all because a few pt boats wher sunk by the north vietnmese (supposedly)
iraq . 9/11 well that needs no mention . way to much hardcore evidence against the us goverment on that one
fleet of suvs seen by loads of people leaving the are 10-15mins before
millions of dollars transfered out hours before 1st plane hit , even the german company contracted to retrieve mainframe information said it looked as if people knew it was going to happen .
thermited steel coloums in all 3 buildings with photos
no windows in any of the planes that hit the towers /
as for the pentagon , well a perfect 16ft round hole , if you didnt know a 737 has a 147ft wingspan 2x6tonne engines at least 40ft apart traveling at 350-400mph would make a hole a little bit bigger than 16ft dont you think , very strange that a cruise missle is almost 16ft round in diameter . at the end of the day its been said many times WHAT IS THE BEST WAY FOR A GOVERMENT TO CONTROL ITS PEOPLE , THE ANSWER EVERY TIME FEAR
as for the conspiricy thing whats the easiset way to live a lie . answer easy every time someone questions your action CALL THEM A LIAR .
there is way to much evidence freely available but of course denied for my liking one last thing the phone calls from flight 93 upuntil 2006 it was almost impossable to make a call from a plane above 3000feet chance of 1in a thousand of being connected , unyet calls took place for minutes not seconds , one of which the mother after being told by her son his plane had been hijacked asked WHO ARE THEY 3TIMES his reply 3times you do believe me mum dont you almost like a recording .which tey are able to do with only a 10second sample of your voice .
take the time to watch zeitgeist 9/11 and then loose change on youtube . after watching if you still think ime talking bollocks then all i can say is good luck oh and if you want to loose a fiver ile bet you now something happens within 6-8weeks and terrorists from syria iran or pakistan are blamed
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Old May 4, 2011 | 09:00 PM
  #358  
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Originally Posted by madscoob
just for tdw ,
quick history lesson , every single war the yanks have been involved in has been preeceded by a big event
ww1 lucatainia sets sail from new york to ireland , 1200people on board after being told by the yanks in a formal letter from the germans in the new york times, do not do this you will be sailing through a war zone and are likely to be sunk , guess what it was sunk by uboats all aboard lost , uproar in america and in they came . point proven , it has been dived on since and has shell cases and munnitions on board the wreck to this day , not bad for a civi boat
ww2 pearl harbour . the yanks knew 3weeks before that the japs where planning something and even knew when the japanese fleet set sail .
vietnam , all because a few pt boats wher sunk by the north vietnmese (supposedly)
iraq . 9/11 well that needs no mention . way to much hardcore evidence against the us goverment on that one
fleet of suvs seen by loads of people leaving the are 10-15mins before
millions of dollars transfered out hours before 1st plane hit , even the german company contracted to retrieve mainframe information said it looked as if people knew it was going to happen .
thermited steel coloums in all 3 buildings with photos
no windows in any of the planes that hit the towers /
as for the pentagon , well a perfect 16ft round hole , if you didnt know a 737 has a 147ft wingspan 2x6tonne engines at least 40ft apart traveling at 350-400mph would make a hole a little bit bigger than 16ft dont you think , very strange that a cruise missle is almost 16ft round in diameter . at the end of the day its been said many times WHAT IS THE BEST WAY FOR A GOVERMENT TO CONTROL ITS PEOPLE , THE ANSWER EVERY TIME FEAR
as for the conspiricy thing whats the easiset way to live a lie . answer easy every time someone questions your action CALL THEM A LIAR .
there is way to much evidence freely available but of course denied for my liking one last thing the phone calls from flight 93 upuntil 2006 it was almost impossable to make a call from a plane above 3000feet chance of 1in a thousand of being connected , unyet calls took place for minutes not seconds , one of which the mother after being told by her son his plane had been hijacked asked WHO ARE THEY 3TIMES his reply 3times you do believe me mum dont you almost like a recording .which tey are able to do with only a 10second sample of your voice .
take the time to watch zeitgeist 9/11 and then loose change on youtube . after watching if you still think ime talking bollocks then all i can say is good luck oh and if you want to loose a fiver ile bet you now something happens within 6-8weeks and terrorists from syria iran or pakistan are blamed
How has the US government kept quiet this conspiracy which has been going on for more than a century? In your opinion of course?

....and your realise all you 'evidence' such as the 'thermited columns' is disputed by experts some of whom are not just far right youtube video makers? How many demolition jobs do you know of that have used thermite?

...and yes you use classic leaps of logic and demagoguery such as throwing in undisputed facts to give plausibility to your 'grand narrative'. Most historians agree the Lucitania did have weapons OB but then there was a war on! A massive conspiracy does not follow from that fact.

It's really amazing you subscribe to this scapagoating narrative.

Last edited by tony de wonderful; May 4, 2011 at 09:05 PM.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 09:00 PM
  #359  
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Originally Posted by madscoob
just for tdw ,
quick history lesson , every single war the yanks have been involved in has been preeceded by a big event
ww1 lucatainia sets sail from new york to ireland , 1200people on board after being told by the yanks in a formal letter from the germans in the new york times, do not do this you will be sailing through a war zone and are likely to be sunk , guess what it was sunk by uboats all aboard lost , uproar in america and in they came . point proven , it has been dived on since and has shell cases and munnitions on board the wreck to this day , not bad for a civi boat
ww2 pearl harbour . the yanks knew 3weeks before that the japs where planning something and even knew when the japanese fleet set sail .
vietnam , all because a few pt boats wher sunk by the north vietnmese (supposedly)
iraq . 9/11 well that needs no mention . way to much hardcore evidence against the us goverment on that one
fleet of suvs seen by loads of people leaving the are 10-15mins before
millions of dollars transfered out hours before 1st plane hit , even the german company contracted to retrieve mainframe information said it looked as if people knew it was going to happen .
thermited steel coloums in all 3 buildings with photos
no windows in any of the planes that hit the towers /
as for the pentagon , well a perfect 16ft round hole , if you didnt know a 737 has a 147ft wingspan 2x6tonne engines at least 40ft apart traveling at 350-400mph would make a hole a little bit bigger than 16ft dont you think , very strange that a cruise missle is almost 16ft round in diameter . at the end of the day its been said many times WHAT IS THE BEST WAY FOR A GOVERMENT TO CONTROL ITS PEOPLE , THE ANSWER EVERY TIME FEAR
as for the conspiricy thing whats the easiset way to live a lie . answer easy every time someone questions your action CALL THEM A LIAR .
there is way to much evidence freely available but of course denied for my liking one last thing the phone calls from flight 93 upuntil 2006 it was almost impossable to make a call from a plane above 3000feet chance of 1in a thousand of being connected , unyet calls took place for minutes not seconds , one of which the mother after being told by her son his plane had been hijacked asked WHO ARE THEY 3TIMES his reply 3times you do believe me mum dont you almost like a recording .which tey are able to do with only a 10second sample of your voice .
take the time to watch zeitgeist 9/11 and then loose change on youtube . after watching if you still think ime talking bollocks then all i can say is good luck oh and if you want to loose a fiver ile bet you now something happens within 6-8weeks and terrorists from syria iran or pakistan are blamed
Also when I speak to my mum on the phone I never relay my full name.
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Old May 4, 2011 | 09:01 PM
  #360  
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Originally Posted by tony de wonderful
How has the US government kept quiet this conspiracy which has been going on for more than a century? In your opinion of course?
Because people like you take what they say as gospel. I wonder why?
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