You've got your digits mixed up there .... it is actually 1265 hours, not 1625.

And, yes, Directed Time 'could' be used up in Prizegivings, Parents Evenings, etc. - but, most Senior Managers in Schools would want the time spent in front of the pupils in the Classroom. Therefore, to deliver the best Teaching opportunities to the children, the Management allocated the time to Lessons (and quite rightly so, in my opinion).

Therefore, in reality, Teachers can choose whether to stay for Prizegiving or any other 'out of hours' activity.

The School Teachers’ Pay and Conditions Document (STPCD) sets out the working time arrangements for teachers. Paragraph 62.4 on page 101 says:

A teacher employed full-time must be available to perform such duties at such times and such places as may be specified by the headteacher ... for 1265 hours in any school year, those hours to be allocated reasonably throughout those days in the school year on which the teacher is required to be available for work.

Anyway, the real purpose of this thread was to express my annoyance that Teachers are willing to strike in a greedy attempt to retain Pensions that the country cannot afford anymore. In the very same way that I, and many others, are losing their Pension rights ....... and having to accept the new order in the world.

IMO Teachers should not strike for such a benefit which everyone else has had to sacrifice on the alter of an extended life expectancy.

 

The 26 hours a week comes from taking the general populations working year.

Most people get 4 weeks leave a year. Which means that they are available for work for 48 weeks of the year - their Directed Time if you will.

Now, if the general population had the same Directed time as Teachers - 1265 hours per year and were expected to be Directed for 48 weeks, then they would be expected to work for 1265/48 hours per week = 26 hours a week.

Of course, Teachers get far more leave than just the 4 weeks which is what most workers have to accept - in fact they receive around 14 weeks ..... which makes their Directed Hours 'appear' more than 26 a week!

It's smoke and mirrors to those outside of the Education system so, to enable the average worker (who pays for Teachers pay and Pensions) to understand the hours worked it needs to be put in the context of their working life and working hours. Which the 26 hours does, quite nicely.

 

Funny how it's always the people who cannot be quickly or easily replaced and whos strike actions has serious consequences for the rest of the country.

Teachers, London tube drivers, baggage handlers, FIREFIGHTERS!

Office staff, waiters/waitresses, factory workers, shop staff.

They know that they have us over a barrel and frankly it is abusing the system, it is abusing trust and it is abusing us.

We get caught in the cross fire of their childish tantrums. They make the majority suffer to make a point to the minority.

We get used for them to demonstrate the "power" they hold over the powers that be, we are innocent in all this but they do not care. As I said before, it is childish tantrums.

They are cutting our nose off to spite their face.

All of those people who strike are a disgrace to themselves, a disgrace to their families, a disgrace to us and a disgrace to the country.

These people are going to strike again, again and again. Anytime they feel hard done by.

My solution, they are going to strike anyway - sack the lot of them. Make the point that striking will not work.
Take your pick from the thousands upon thousands of un-employed, of all the university leavers looking for work and put all of these twits out to pasture.

****ing useless sonsofbitches. Don't want to work? FINE. Don't. **** off.

 

My next door neighbour is a head of Dept, he has been teaching for nearly 20 years, he does not earn that much. You are quoting figures unfairly, based upon large schools.

Also, the school he teaches at is in an area that is not the best, shall we say. The abuse and hassle he gets is something I will never have to worry about, nor will most employees. He makes the most of his holidays, electing not to take on any extra during them, but he leaves the house before I do in the morning, and he always gets home after me.

As for people who say teachers don't have an idea what it's like in the real world, that's just rubbish. So do lots of other careers in that case. I know of companies who historically did jobs for life (I worked for one), and until relatively recently, professions like doctors/nurses/army/firemen/police also were guaranteed.

I do agree with you though that they shouldn't moan about pensions. Everyone has been screwed in that way, and by your beloved NL , so they should just shut up about that!

Geezer

 

If he is a Head of Department it will be a Secondary School for 11 year olds and upwards, I have news for you .... he will be on £50k or thereabouts.

If he has been Teaching for 20 years he will be on UPS3 - in North Wales that will be £36,756. As a Head of Department he will be getting a TLR payment of £12,393.

Add those two together and you get £49,149 ..... OK, a bit less than £50k - but not much!!!

This information is available in the Public Domain for those who wish to check.

 

You are quoting generic figures at my school - 1800 pupils in the most deprived electorial ward in the South East you will find HoDs on TLR payments of 2c/1a. HoFs are on 1c/1d.

Our head is on approx £98k based on the advert for his position 3 years ago. School budget is in the Millions and he has approx 300 staff he is directly responsible for along with 1800 pupils - what would a private sector employee with that level of responsibility be on I wonder?

Correct Payscales info:

http://www.tda.gov.uk/get-into-teach...ry-scales.aspx

Remember that most schools with squeezed budgets will be paying the minimums!

 

I bow to your real experience since I am not in a position to say otherwise.

I did a lot of teaching of both ab initio students and also experienced ones as part of my job. I found it a satisfying part of my life when I saw those students learn and understand the lessons and were able to apply that knowledge practically.

I think teachers are on a hiding to nothing in many cases when they have to cope with disruptive students who will deliberately disturb a class of students and even threaten a teacher with violence because they know that the PC Plonkers dictate that children may not be physically punished or even taken by the arm and escorted out of the classroom without the likelihood of being accused of assault. They are likely to be supported by feckless parents who have never done anything to bring them up in a proper manner.

I was surprised to see PSL's diatribe against teachers but assumed that because he is or was associated with schooling and consequently knew a lot more than I do.

Les

 

Assumption is the mother of all **** ups, Les, didn't you know that

 

Well I did learn that very early in my career COB, luckily by other peoples' example.

I still think it is reasonable to expect someone with the backgroung he has to know what he is talking about when it comes to facts and figures etc.

I would not class him as a liar. That would be another assumption.

Les

 

PSL, I cant be arsed to read all the nonsense you've written on here.

My wife's a teacher, let me straighten a couple of things out for you:

1. There's no £35k basic
2. They probably work more hours than most other professions. Yes they get alot of holiday, but they dont get to chose when it is. They'll sped most evenings marking work and lesson planning
3. They have to put up with 'YOUR' disrespectful, ****ty children whilst trying to educate them. In my eyes, that makes them saints.

 

As I understand it, the heart of the striking problems lies with the teaching unions. They appear to be looking for any excuse, most likely for political reasons.

Apparenttly they even instituted a strike where when their requirements were met, the teachers actually got less pay!

Les

 

Unions are bull****, full of people who want their cake and eat it. I haven't got time for people like that.

 

I haven't got time for folk who make generalisations about union members

I'm in unite but certainly wouldn't be out on strike just 'cos we're feeing the economic pinch a bit

 

Same figures as I have been quoting ..... and your statement that schools will be paying the minimum levels is just plain typical of a NUT Member ..... it is a straightforward LIE!!!

How can the Teachers be paid the minimum when they MOVE UP THE SCALES!!?? You have, sadly, shown yourself up massively!! Which is a shame as you were actually putting a reasoned argument together initially!!

Schools will only have NQT's on the minimums!! The rest of the staff will be charging full pelt up the ranges annually, but you know this anyway - don't you?

 

Les

For your information - I know MUCH more than most posters on here ..... there is a reason that they are not in the Management of Schools - the evidence is here in this thread.

I suggest that the Management of schools know far more than the Teachers - the Teachers do not see what the other staff are being paid ...... I can only assume that any Teacher who thinks Teaching is underpaid is being paid less than most others for a very good reason!

Don't listen to the monkey when the Organ Grinder is talking

 

Doesn't each point on the scale in fact cover a bracket of possible remuneration, as opposed to one specific amount of salary?

 

Each point is a pay point - every Teacher moves up through the pay steps annually (something they don't like those who pay their wages to know) .... getting TWO payrises a year wouldn't sit well with those receiving NOTHING - would it now?

 

I was refering to the TLR scheme not the payscales as any intellegent person knows they are fixed although some schools do choose appointments with some consideration to costs e.g. NQTs or less experianced teachers can be chosen over more experianced teachers when appointing staff.

 

Well that is why I said what I did about your knowledge of the situation which is far greater than mine of course.

Les