Classic HID Projector project
10 March 2011, 06:21 PM
#31
So I see, now I bother to re-read the thread 
So how does the dip work?
I look forward to the beam shots, this is something I mean to do, I already HAVE the crystal lights..........they are up in my loft awaiting some projectors.
Unfortunately, the demise of my car's engine, quickly followed by Gordon's puny £'s demise against the $ put paid to my idea of getting any from America
At least until I can get some more £££ together.
So how does the dip work?
I look forward to the beam shots, this is something I mean to do, I already HAVE the crystal lights..........they are up in my loft awaiting some projectors.
Unfortunately, the demise of my car's engine, quickly followed by Gordon's puny £'s demise against the $ put paid to my idea of getting any from America
At least until I can get some more £££ together.
12 March 2011, 08:44 PM
#32
Ok, had a half hour before it got dark to do some more test fitting.
I still have to mount the wiring and the ballasts properly, but I was a bit concerned the projectors weren't in the right way, as they didn't seem to be sided. The look like they are to me, but if anyone could confirm.
Heres some pics.
On a garage from 20 ft away:
Dipped:
Mains:
On driveway, from around 3ft:
Dipped:
Mains:
On the driveway pics, it looks like some light bleeding from around the edge of the projectors, as seen on the window.
For me though, even with my Morette's, they seem to be a massive improvement. Before, if I were down a badly lit road, I could barely see the ground in front of me. These light up the ground quite well. I've tested them on the roads. They don't seem to shine near the face of oncoming traffic, although the beam seems very high on the pavement, so more likely to blind pedestrians. They will need adjusting though, something I should do tomorrow.
I'm not massively impressed with the full/main beams. They just seem to make the beam higher, but it doesn't have much affect on the distance. I have PIAA driving lights, so not too fussed about that.
Seem good value for money though, so far.
The projector kit cost me 70 odd quid and it just needed ballasts.
I got some very cheap slim ones for 25 quid. For that price, I will get a couple spare ones, just in case.
So less then a hundred quid for this setup.
I do love my morettes though. So I will make projectors fit in them next.
I still have to mount the wiring and the ballasts properly, but I was a bit concerned the projectors weren't in the right way, as they didn't seem to be sided. The look like they are to me, but if anyone could confirm.
Heres some pics.
On a garage from 20 ft away:
Dipped:
Mains:
On driveway, from around 3ft:
Dipped:
Mains:
On the driveway pics, it looks like some light bleeding from around the edge of the projectors, as seen on the window.
For me though, even with my Morette's, they seem to be a massive improvement. Before, if I were down a badly lit road, I could barely see the ground in front of me. These light up the ground quite well. I've tested them on the roads. They don't seem to shine near the face of oncoming traffic, although the beam seems very high on the pavement, so more likely to blind pedestrians. They will need adjusting though, something I should do tomorrow.
I'm not massively impressed with the full/main beams. They just seem to make the beam higher, but it doesn't have much affect on the distance. I have PIAA driving lights, so not too fussed about that.
Seem good value for money though, so far.
The projector kit cost me 70 odd quid and it just needed ballasts.
I got some very cheap slim ones for 25 quid. For that price, I will get a couple spare ones, just in case.
So less then a hundred quid for this setup.
I do love my morettes though. So I will make projectors fit in them next.
12 March 2011, 09:24 PM
#33
Not impressive, are they?
On dip, where the beam pattern ought to be flat, with a kick-up to the left, it's one long slope up to the left, meaning the foreground is not fully lit
On main beam, the kick-up is STILL visible and shouldn't be, the lights have little or no focus and scatter everywhere. Very poor.
Yes, there WILL be more light than OE Scoob lights, because an HID lamp is LOADS brighter, but it could be SO much better.......
I'll NOT be buying any like that.
On dip, where the beam pattern ought to be flat, with a kick-up to the left, it's one long slope up to the left, meaning the foreground is not fully lit
On main beam, the kick-up is STILL visible and shouldn't be, the lights have little or no focus and scatter everywhere. Very poor.
Yes, there WILL be more light than OE Scoob lights, because an HID lamp is LOADS brighter, but it could be SO much better.......
I'll NOT be buying any like that.
12 March 2011, 09:30 PM
#34
I see what you mean, they should be like \_ _ _ \_ _ _
Its not like I could adjust them, because the projector unit fits into the H4 location holes, so they can only go in one way.
But you would at least agree they are beter than regular HID kits in a OE lens?
Its not like I could adjust them, because the projector unit fits into the H4 location holes, so they can only go in one way.
But you would at least agree they are beter than regular HID kits in a OE lens?
13 March 2011, 03:19 PM
#36
Hmm, something isn't right with that dipped-cut off. I'd hazard it would dazzle on comming cars on right hand bends due that weird kick up.
Take a look at the attached pics:
First one is a VW MKV Golf's HIDs took the night after I checked and readjusted the beam aim (because they self adjust, the one has a habit of the aim "drifting" a bit, so one ended up being lower than the other).
Second one is a view though the bulb fixing on a BMW e39 with the same style of projector unit. The cut off plate is at the bottom, this blocks light from the bulb and rear reflector, the lens in front of this reverses the beam so what is projected is reversed top-to-bottom so light will be at the bottom, and be blocked at the top) and creates the beam pattern as seen in the first picture. I belive the problem with Joey's beam aim is the cut-off plate isn't shaped or positioned like the one in the second picture.
Third picture is just for reference; Its the same projector unit with the continental adapter lever activated. This allows the car to be driven in countries that drive on the right without dazzling oncomming traffic. This removes the kick-up so the beam is dead straight across the entire width (note the cut-off plate is supposed to be perfectly horizontal, but the camera wasn't level
)
Inccidentally the BMW and VW's projectors are the same, but I couldn't get a pic of the internal view of the VW one as I needed to remove the headlamp to get the camera in. BMW had plenty of space so I could do it with the headlamp in situ
Take a look at the attached pics:
First one is a VW MKV Golf's HIDs took the night after I checked and readjusted the beam aim (because they self adjust, the one has a habit of the aim "drifting" a bit, so one ended up being lower than the other).
Second one is a view though the bulb fixing on a BMW e39 with the same style of projector unit. The cut off plate is at the bottom, this blocks light from the bulb and rear reflector, the lens in front of this reverses the beam so what is projected is reversed top-to-bottom so light will be at the bottom, and be blocked at the top) and creates the beam pattern as seen in the first picture. I belive the problem with Joey's beam aim is the cut-off plate isn't shaped or positioned like the one in the second picture.
Third picture is just for reference; Its the same projector unit with the continental adapter lever activated. This allows the car to be driven in countries that drive on the right without dazzling oncomming traffic. This removes the kick-up so the beam is dead straight across the entire width (note the cut-off plate is supposed to be perfectly horizontal, but the camera wasn't level
)Inccidentally the BMW and VW's projectors are the same, but I couldn't get a pic of the internal view of the VW one as I needed to remove the headlamp to get the camera in. BMW had plenty of space so I could do it with the headlamp in situ
Last edited by ALi-B; 29 April 2012 at 02:36 PM. Reason: top to bottom, not left tp right
13 March 2011, 09:50 PM
#38
OK thanks for the info guys. I'm still happy with them at the moment, as I can see.
Like I say, I am going to look into doing the same for my morettes, but will give those projectors a try that vindaloo posted up.
At least with them there are pics of the beam, and they look better.
alcazar, as for the moral. Its not always an option, as you can see buy the amount of people that have retro fitted OEM projectors from top marques.
Too much cutting, too much time, and above all, too much dosh.
Like I say, I am going to look into doing the same for my morettes, but will give those projectors a try that vindaloo posted up.
At least with them there are pics of the beam, and they look better.
alcazar, as for the moral. Its not always an option, as you can see buy the amount of people that have retro fitted OEM projectors from top marques.
Too much cutting, too much time, and above all, too much dosh.
13 March 2011, 11:28 PM
#39
Oh, I see WHY people don't do it properly. As I've said, I got as far as buying the crystal headlights, then an engine failure happened, and before I'd paid for THAT, so did Gordon's puny £ and I now can't AFFORD any decent projectors from the USA:
And even when I DO get some dosh saved up, I STILL need the rear arches done and the rear bumper fixed and resprayed
So MY HID retrofit is ages away............
:And even when I DO get some dosh saved up, I STILL need the rear arches done and the rear bumper fixed and resprayed
So MY HID retrofit is ages away............
14 March 2011, 11:01 AM
#40
Well I have to give these guys an email about these projectors that vindaloo suggested: http://www.theretrofitsource.com/pro...roducts_id=236
Thats just to see the postage price. I suppose it would be rude not to ask about a group discount. You can see from the pictures and comments, that those look a lot better.
Thats just to see the postage price. I suppose it would be rude not to ask about a group discount. You can see from the pictures and comments, that those look a lot better.
14 March 2011, 03:51 PM
#44
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Erm...
Those projectors look like they're set up for LHD use. BUT: They have been installed (by you) or otherwise (by the manufacturer) with about a 30 degree tilt.
The pattern I'm seeing there is an American DOT style cutoff rotated to give an approximation of an RHD setup.
Shamelessly nicked from whereever I found it. American DOT projector output showing cutoff.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...4/bbbbbml1.jpg
The EURO style beam pattern for dipped.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...4/S5000010.jpg
^^^ Crap example, but it shows the kick up at about 30 degrees. With a projector, there would be a fuller, more even light distribution.
Both examples, LHD.
J.
14 March 2011, 03:57 PM
#45
Erm...
The EURO style beam pattern for dipped.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...4/S5000010.jpg
^^^ Crap example, but it shows the kick up at about 30 degrees. With a projector, there would be a fuller, more even light distribution.
The EURO style beam pattern for dipped.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...4/S5000010.jpg
^^^ Crap example, but it shows the kick up at about 30 degrees. With a projector, there would be a fuller, more even light distribution.
To be pedantic, most EURO projectors do not have this beam pattern; they are usually as per my pictures.
The link in the above quote is usually what is found with Fresnel lens (old school) or Complex surface reflectors (crystal).
Last edited by ALi-B; 14 March 2011 at 04:00 PM.
14 March 2011, 04:01 PM
#46
Erm...
Those projectors look like they're set up for LHD use. BUT: They have been installed (by you) or otherwise (by the manufacturer) with about a 30 degree tilt.
The pattern I'm seeing there is an American DOT style cutoff rotated to give an approximation of an RHD setup.
Those projectors look like they're set up for LHD use. BUT: They have been installed (by you) or otherwise (by the manufacturer) with about a 30 degree tilt.
The pattern I'm seeing there is an American DOT style cutoff rotated to give an approximation of an RHD setup.
14 March 2011, 04:03 PM
#47
2x projectors,
2x shrouds,
2x ballasts,
2x bulbs,
..........and paid P&P for that little lot from the USA, PLUS any tax the government decides to throw at you at this end PLUS any extra charges for delivery that DHL etc chuck at you this end.............
Well, even without the last two, you won't have much change from £300
14 March 2011, 04:11 PM
#48
The tilt must be from the manufacturer, because these kits have H4 locating rings, so there was no otherway to fit these.
Perhaps they did it this way, so they appear to not look a specific beam pattern.
Originally Posted by alcazar
Aye, but once you have bought:
2x projectors,
2x shrouds,
2x ballasts,
2x bulbs,
..........and paid P&P for that little lot from the USA, PLUS any tax the government decides to throw at you at this end PLUS any extra charges for delivery that DHL etc chuck at you this end.............
Well, even without the last two, you won't have much change from £300
2x projectors,
2x shrouds,
2x ballasts,
2x bulbs,
..........and paid P&P for that little lot from the USA, PLUS any tax the government decides to throw at you at this end PLUS any extra charges for delivery that DHL etc chuck at you this end.............
Well, even without the last two, you won't have much change from £300
http://www.theretrofitsource.com/pro...roducts_id=237
295USd, I make that about 180GBP, excluding the shipping and customs though.
).
15 March 2011, 02:50 AM
#53
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Their view is it's WORSE putting HID into crystal or clear than into old style fresnel lensed HLs.
J.
15 March 2011, 01:22 PM
#54
Yeah, the particular thread was about approximating projector cutoff patterns on old headlights on old USA pickups. In fact that "euro" pic was of a fresnel lens on an old rectanglular pickup or bronco.
Their view is it's WORSE putting HID into crystal or clear than into old style fresnel lensed HLs.
J.
Their view is it's WORSE putting HID into crystal or clear than into old style fresnel lensed HLs.
J.
15 March 2011, 09:36 PM
#55
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It's all rebased into H4s stuff, so none of it is erm... optimal...
http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f62/wa...4-97-a-424965/
J.
http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f62/wa...4-97-a-424965/
J.
16 March 2011, 04:58 PM
#57
Just had a response from The Retrofit source: to do mine with the BEST projectors, all inclusive of shipping, around £223.
Using the NEXT best projector would be £214.
BUT: the second best projector requires NO cutting of the headlight reflector, it fits in place of the H4 bulb and has a screwed lockring on the rear. It would still require the lights split and resealed.
It is still OE on some cars and produces 90% of the light output of the best, the so-called F-XR.
For those who need to know, yes, it's Japanese and is called the Morimoto Mini. The also make the bulbs and ballasts.
Using the NEXT best projector would be £214.
BUT: the second best projector requires NO cutting of the headlight reflector, it fits in place of the H4 bulb and has a screwed lockring on the rear. It would still require the lights split and resealed.
It is still OE on some cars and produces 90% of the light output of the best, the so-called F-XR.
For those who need to know, yes, it's Japanese and is called the Morimoto Mini. The also make the bulbs and ballasts.
16 March 2011, 05:39 PM
#58
I had a simular email, they were mentioning the H1 based setup is better, but will require enlarging the H4 bulb holder, so for that reason I'd prefer the the second best one.
I've asked a couple of times about discount prices, which they do, but they haven't got back to me regarding that yet. If it looks good, I could look into a group buy.
I've asked a couple of times about discount prices, which they do, but they haven't got back to me regarding that yet. If it looks good, I could look into a group buy.
17 March 2011, 10:23 PM
#60
Well he does seem to talk about it like it does. As he keeps mentioning the H1 setup will fit fine in the h4 casing. I've asked him directly, so will let you know.
Anyway, I got some good prices based on 10+ purchases. 205USd shipped. Thats 130 quid. Yeah there will be some customs, maybe 20 quid. But thats a full HID projector setup for 150 quid.
Think its worth setting up a group buy?
Anyway, I got some good prices based on 10+ purchases. 205USd shipped. Thats 130 quid. Yeah there will be some customs, maybe 20 quid. But thats a full HID projector setup for 150 quid.
Think its worth setting up a group buy?