scoobyclinics turbo's just got billet I mean better!
08 January 2014, 08:50 PM
#4561
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08 January 2014, 10:19 PM
#4562
I had given a lot of thought towards an sc46 billet, then I hear things like this and find it rather in nerving. I'm also on a forged 2.5, but I don't want to go past 450bhp as I'm on an open deck block. Maybe a sc42 looks a better option. Surely that should make full boost nice and early on a 2.5
Joe
08 January 2014, 10:26 PM
#4563
I think AJ/MJ and DOB state that a SC42 (Billet version) and the 2.5 is a veritable marriage made in heaven. 
Also, with that in mind, what will the latest SC42 Billet + be like on a 2.5! Plus, going by the graph posted up by Kev, looks like that turbo will claw back any 'lost' bhp (re. old 42 billet vs old 46 billet).
Looks like it could be a win-win...
Also, with that in mind, what will the latest SC42 Billet + be like on a 2.5! Plus, going by the graph posted up by Kev, looks like that turbo will claw back any 'lost' bhp (re. old 42 billet vs old 46 billet).
Looks like it could be a win-win...
Last edited by joz8968; 08 January 2014 at 10:42 PM.
08 January 2014, 10:37 PM
#4564
Scooby Regular
Surely for the ultimate road set up you should all be looking at the torque graphs. Still think the ultimate road turbo will be the SC38BB. Kev any news on this? Think it was expected in December but got delayed.
Last edited by terzoscooby; 08 January 2014 at 11:08 PM.
09 January 2014, 12:44 AM
#4566
Scooby Regular
I had given a lot of thought towards an sc46 billet, then I hear things like this and find it rather in nerving. I'm also on a forged 2.5, but I don't want to go past 450bhp as I'm on an open deck block. Maybe a sc42 looks a better option. Surely that should make full boost nice and early on a 2.5
Joe
Joe
overall setup has a big impact, what works with a certain intake or exhaust, or manifold etc may not work with another one.
All i can tell you is mine goes off like a scalded cat (even more now lol), if your ever in the area let me know and i'll take you out in it see what you think
09 January 2014, 06:03 AM
#4567
fmic will allways introduce more lag its simple science
tmic x amount of capacity to pressurise
fmic poss double the amount to pressurise
simplified pressurise a 6cm2 balloon
pressurise a 12cm2 balloon with same method of inflation
the 12cm2 ballon will take longer
and imho for a road car if i was doing it again wld have gone smaller turbo and used tmic
i mulled over the md321 and the sc46 and was swayed by feedback but just saying with fmic i can be a bit laggy and those graphs show nearly 2 bar of boost thru standard engine??
power made is restricted by the flow capable and the point at which a turbo is just blowing hot air
spoke to another mapper who said he has rarely seen 460 from the sc46 and said the norm is about 445-455
tmic x amount of capacity to pressurise
fmic poss double the amount to pressurise
simplified pressurise a 6cm2 balloon
pressurise a 12cm2 balloon with same method of inflation
the 12cm2 ballon will take longer
and imho for a road car if i was doing it again wld have gone smaller turbo and used tmic
i mulled over the md321 and the sc46 and was swayed by feedback but just saying with fmic i can be a bit laggy and those graphs show nearly 2 bar of boost thru standard engine??
power made is restricted by the flow capable and the point at which a turbo is just blowing hot air
spoke to another mapper who said he has rarely seen 460 from the sc46 and said the norm is about 445-455
09 January 2014, 07:50 AM
#4568
Scooby Regular
fmic will allways introduce more lag its simple science
tmic x amount of capacity to pressurise
fmic poss double the amount to pressurise
simplified pressurise a 6cm2 balloon
pressurise a 12cm2 balloon with same method of inflation
the 12cm2 ballon will take longer
and imho for a road car if i was doing it again wld have gone smaller turbo and used tmic
i mulled over the md321 and the sc46 and was swayed by feedback but just saying with fmic i can be a bit laggy and those graphs show nearly 2 bar of boost thru standard engine??
power made is restricted by the flow capable and the point at which a turbo is just blowing hot air
spoke to another mapper who said he has rarely seen 460 from the sc46 and said the norm is about 445-455
tmic x amount of capacity to pressurise
fmic poss double the amount to pressurise
simplified pressurise a 6cm2 balloon
pressurise a 12cm2 balloon with same method of inflation
the 12cm2 ballon will take longer
and imho for a road car if i was doing it again wld have gone smaller turbo and used tmic
i mulled over the md321 and the sc46 and was swayed by feedback but just saying with fmic i can be a bit laggy and those graphs show nearly 2 bar of boost thru standard engine??
power made is restricted by the flow capable and the point at which a turbo is just blowing hot air
spoke to another mapper who said he has rarely seen 460 from the sc46 and said the norm is about 445-455
09 January 2014, 10:12 AM
#4569
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i went for the billet sc46 on my forged 2,5 with full supporting mods and have been dissapointed in the spool and power achieved tbh
mine is a ej257 cdb forged build with rcm headers/fuel rails/injectors/reg/pump/tgv delete/harvey uppipe /hdi fmic and intake /perrin turbo pipe/simtek and only achvd 445bhp and noticeable lag
mapped by steve simpson so doubt its the mapping
mine is a ej257 cdb forged build with rcm headers/fuel rails/injectors/reg/pump/tgv delete/harvey uppipe /hdi fmic and intake /perrin turbo pipe/simtek and only achvd 445bhp and noticeable lag
mapped by steve simpson so doubt its the mapping
pop in for a FREE dyno run, lets see just how laggy it really is, if at all.
Cheers
Kev
09 January 2014, 10:17 AM
#4570
09 January 2014, 01:20 PM
#4571
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Hi,
dealing in tuning and supplying tuning products like turbochargers we see a lot of people straight away pointing the finger of blame towards the turbo should their car not make the power they expected.
True you can get the odd one that has an issue but its usually down to supporting mods, air leaks, faulty dump valves bleeding boost away, poor mapping and various other reasons such as up pipes, down pipes and the biggest killer of all oil feeds.
Some of the sleeve bearing turbos have been fitted to cars which previously had ball bearing turbos, the oil restrictor not being removed, sleeve bearing turbos need more oil than the ball bearing cored ones and the core soon siezes up if this has not been addressed.
Vice versa, ball bearing cores need less oil and a restrictor is supplied, some fitters remove it and over oil the core this doesn’t usually do damage but believe it or not it slugs spool quiet badly.
So many variables which is why any new design is tested on our own cars, then if successful they get strapped to one of our race cars and blasted round a track being pushed until we are satisfied the design is ready for release to the retail world, not many other tuners or tuning suppliers can claim they do the same.
Someone mentioned boost on the test SC42, yes we pushed it, its one of our own cars so we can push as hard as we like, someone has to test the turbo and the high boost test was to see if the new design exhaust housing chokes up, it didn’t.
Cheers
Kev
dealing in tuning and supplying tuning products like turbochargers we see a lot of people straight away pointing the finger of blame towards the turbo should their car not make the power they expected.
True you can get the odd one that has an issue but its usually down to supporting mods, air leaks, faulty dump valves bleeding boost away, poor mapping and various other reasons such as up pipes, down pipes and the biggest killer of all oil feeds.
Some of the sleeve bearing turbos have been fitted to cars which previously had ball bearing turbos, the oil restrictor not being removed, sleeve bearing turbos need more oil than the ball bearing cored ones and the core soon siezes up if this has not been addressed.
Vice versa, ball bearing cores need less oil and a restrictor is supplied, some fitters remove it and over oil the core this doesn’t usually do damage but believe it or not it slugs spool quiet badly.
So many variables which is why any new design is tested on our own cars, then if successful they get strapped to one of our race cars and blasted round a track being pushed until we are satisfied the design is ready for release to the retail world, not many other tuners or tuning suppliers can claim they do the same.
Someone mentioned boost on the test SC42, yes we pushed it, its one of our own cars so we can push as hard as we like, someone has to test the turbo and the high boost test was to see if the new design exhaust housing chokes up, it didn’t.
Cheers
Kev
09 January 2014, 02:02 PM
#4572
to put it into context
it achieves and holds the desired boost so no leaks and it wasnt meant to be a criticism more a fotnote that tmic and turbo is best for spool up and that fmic will increase xtra lag due extra volume of pipework
tbh ime prob going to go rotated with a gt30 with a .63 ar as next step anyway
steve simpson was ampping the car so i doubt he wld have missed anything
gaffer too far away or i wld take u up on ur offer tks
kev can u pm me a price for a rotated gt30 with .63ar incl pipework fitted tks
it achieves and holds the desired boost so no leaks and it wasnt meant to be a criticism more a fotnote that tmic and turbo is best for spool up and that fmic will increase xtra lag due extra volume of pipework
tbh ime prob going to go rotated with a gt30 with a .63 ar as next step anyway
steve simpson was ampping the car so i doubt he wld have missed anything
gaffer too far away or i wld take u up on ur offer tks
kev can u pm me a price for a rotated gt30 with .63ar incl pipework fitted tks
Last edited by p1junkie; 09 January 2014 at 02:09 PM.
09 January 2014, 04:12 PM
#4573
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to put it into context
it achieves and holds the desired boost so no leaks and it wasnt meant to be a criticism more a fotnote that tmic and turbo is best for spool up and that fmic will increase xtra lag due extra volume of pipework
tbh ime prob going to go rotated with a gt30 with a .63 ar as next step anyway
steve simpson was ampping the car so i doubt he wld have missed anything
gaffer too far away or i wld take u up on ur offer tks
kev can u pm me a price for a rotated gt30 with .63ar incl pipework fitted tks
it achieves and holds the desired boost so no leaks and it wasnt meant to be a criticism more a fotnote that tmic and turbo is best for spool up and that fmic will increase xtra lag due extra volume of pipework
tbh ime prob going to go rotated with a gt30 with a .63 ar as next step anyway
steve simpson was ampping the car so i doubt he wld have missed anything
gaffer too far away or i wld take u up on ur offer tks
kev can u pm me a price for a rotated gt30 with .63ar incl pipework fitted tks
didn’t take it as criticism but all constructive criticism welcome.
We see it a lot where BHP figures become obsessive, recently a car with a top mount and an SC38 billet made 380 BHP and on the road was stunning, fantastic spool and plenty of power, it certainly out performed the brakes and suspension.
However, customer had told his mates that he was going to get over 400 BHP, the 380BHP on the top mount wasn’t good enough, we advised he would introduce lag and costs associated with an FMIC and we were unsure that the SC38 Billet would make 400 BHP, some engines with one do and some don’t, as they say "horse to water" etc. but he wasn’t listening to us and went for an FMIC, a big FMIC, God knows where he got it from but it was a huge core.
Against all our advice we ended up fitting it and addressing the map, we got more power but not the 400, we got a tad over 390 BHP and lost 400 RPM's worth of spool, car was no longer nice to drive as it was before and still it had not managed the 400 BHP he needed to see.
Next step he asked us to put on a bigger blower as in SC40 Billet, we did and 400 BHP was seen at the cost of another 350 RPM of spool, I cannot deny it, car was quick but spool and hence road drivability was shocking, not something we were happy with or would recommend but customer.....OVERJOYED, loved it
Gt30 .63 and a rotated kit, now we are getting serious, allow £2124.00 + vat for the pair, discount available if you take both the pipe work and the turbo .
Cheers
Kev
09 January 2014, 07:48 PM
#4575
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,on std heads/cams, power was on 20% meth, this 30 billet was the 1st version they did.
This one was on a 2.1 again but with ported heads and kelford 264 cams, power was on just v-power only at just under 2 bar, this 30 billet was the newer version.
09 January 2014, 07:53 PM
#4576
I'v had 2 cars now with this ^ spec (rotated), here is the 1st one done by clinic ,mapped by pat on a (noisy/suspicious engine) so i'm not sure if pat felt confident to push it ,
on std heads/cams, power was on 20% meth, this 30 billet was the 1st version they did.
This one was on a 2.1 again but with ported heads and kelford 264 cams, power was on just v-power only at just under 2 bar, this 30 billet was the newer version.
,on std heads/cams, power was on 20% meth, this 30 billet was the 1st version they did.
This one was on a 2.1 again but with ported heads and kelford 264 cams, power was on just v-power only at just under 2 bar, this 30 billet was the newer version.
09 January 2014, 09:04 PM
#4581
lol @ joz...No i was replying to veerinder9 mate,but that reply would be valid in response to shreksta`s question also buddy
Most uprated cams should give you improvements all through the range mate,but some specific profile cams are also available to give better performance in just a certain areas.
Most uprated cams should give you improvements all through the range mate,but some specific profile cams are also available to give better performance in just a certain areas.
09 January 2014, 09:08 PM
#4582
lol @ joz...No i was replying to veerinder9 mate,but that reply would be valid in response to shreksta`s question also buddy
Most uprated cams should give you improvements all through the range mate,but some specific profile cams are also available to give better performance in just a certain areas.
Most uprated cams should give you improvements all through the range mate,but some specific profile cams are also available to give better performance in just a certain areas.
09 January 2014, 09:09 PM
#4584
lol @ joz...No i was replying to veerinder9 mate,but that reply would be valid in response to shreksta`s question also buddy
Most uprated cams should give you improvements all through the range mate,but some specific profile cams are also available to give better performance in just a certain areas.
Most uprated cams should give you improvements all through the range mate,but some specific profile cams are also available to give better performance in just a certain areas.
09 January 2014, 09:18 PM
#4588
Indeed! Full frame rotated kits not for the faint of wallet.
But compared to the OEM position versions, I believe you can expect spool to be anything up to 1000rpm sooner on their rotated counterparts.
But compared to the OEM position versions, I believe you can expect spool to be anything up to 1000rpm sooner on their rotated counterparts.
Last edited by joz8968; 09 January 2014 at 09:24 PM.
09 January 2014, 09:24 PM
#4589
I'v had 2 cars now with this ^ spec (rotated), here is the 1st one done by clinic ,mapped by pat on a (noisy/suspicious engine) so i'm not sure if pat felt confident to push it ,
on std heads/cams, power was on 20% meth, this 30 billet was the 1st version they did.
This one was on a 2.1 again but with ported heads and kelford 264 cams, power was on just v-power only at just under 2 bar, this 30 billet was the newer version.
,on std heads/cams, power was on 20% meth, this 30 billet was the 1st version they did.
This one was on a 2.1 again but with ported heads and kelford 264 cams, power was on just v-power only at just under 2 bar, this 30 billet was the newer version.