View Poll Results: Would you report an illegal immigrant?
Yes, damn right I would, we've enough here already.
138
95.83%
No, I say live and let live.
6
4.17%
Voters: 144. You may not vote on this poll
would you report an illegal immigrant?
29 January 2008, 01:54 PM
#241
To accept JC is the son of God and our saviour, requires thought about religion and faith, therefore, making a person Christian when they accept this. I firmly believe, while this is the basic requirement of Christianity, following a lifestyle in line with this is needed to be truely Christian.
I think what makes me feel this is no longer a Christian country is many people do not follow that way of life. Many would not give a great deal of time to thinking about whether Jesus is their saviour, and just get on with day to day life, religion rarely being factored in to it. Yet, when asked what religious group they fall into, unless they say none, many people would be inclined to say Christianity, because perhaps their parents were, or because they celebrate Christmas etc. It is not because they necessarily are Christian or even give it any thought, but it is the closest group they would say they fell into.
I think what makes me feel this is no longer a Christian country is many people do not follow that way of life. Many would not give a great deal of time to thinking about whether Jesus is their saviour, and just get on with day to day life, religion rarely being factored in to it. Yet, when asked what religious group they fall into, unless they say none, many people would be inclined to say Christianity, because perhaps their parents were, or because they celebrate Christmas etc. It is not because they necessarily are Christian or even give it any thought, but it is the closest group they would say they fell into.
29 January 2008, 01:59 PM
#242
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My feel for this is, if you ask people in this country is JC our saviour they tend to recoil. Ask the same question is parts of the US for example you'd get a very different response, hence their high church attendance
29 January 2008, 01:59 PM
#243
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Theism is a positive belief, you have to believe in a god or gods. Atheism just requires that you don't believe in a god, no matter what the reason, choice, ignorance, or anything else. There are lots of things I haven't even considered because I don't know anything about them and I don't believe in those either.
29 January 2008, 02:02 PM
#244
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would you report an illegal immigrant?
looks at thread title again. Seems we have gone a touch off piste, oops! Sorry!
FWIW, if you have reasonable grounds to believe that she is genuinely illegal, I'd make a phone call and make my concerns known, being clear you may be wrong. Otherwise, leave it alone.
FWIW, if you have reasonable grounds to believe that she is genuinely illegal, I'd make a phone call and make my concerns known, being clear you may be wrong. Otherwise, leave it alone.
29 January 2008, 02:02 PM
#245
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FFS any chance you girls can get back on topic - or maybe start a thread or revieve on of the many, many religious threads already covered.
agree to disagree or something
agree to disagree or something
29 January 2008, 02:07 PM
#247
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What do you mean instead, it's not either or. Agnosticism isn't the middle ground on a linear transition from theism to atheism, it's orthogonal.
Theism is a positive belief, you have to believe in a god or gods. Atheism just requires that you don't believe in a god, no matter what the reason, choice, ignorance, or anything else. There are lots of things I haven't even considered because I don't know anything about them and I don't believe in those either.
Theism is a positive belief, you have to believe in a god or gods. Atheism just requires that you don't believe in a god, no matter what the reason, choice, ignorance, or anything else. There are lots of things I haven't even considered because I don't know anything about them and I don't believe in those either.
I've attached a definition which hopefully clears things up
Atheism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
29 January 2008, 02:07 PM
#248
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I gave my very basic definition of a Christian, is it everybody's? I doubt it. What I'm getting at is that the best person to determin a person beliefs / faith is that person and they may have a different definition to me. As is my way, my definition is rather abrupt and yes you may get a shocked response if you asked that question directly, but if you asked:
Do you consider yourself to be a Christian
Do you believe God sent his only son JC to earth for the salvation of man kind
Do you believe in JC
Do you believe you will go to heaven through your belief in JC
I suspect you'd get Yes or sort of to most of those question when asking one of our self defined 70%. It boils down to much the same definition, just delivered in a more fluffy way.
29 January 2008, 02:11 PM
#249
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Basically Atheism is a philisophical view, so we are into a debate as to whether a child is capable of a philisophical view about religion/god/spirituality.
I've attached a definition which hopefully clears things up
Atheism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I've attached a definition which hopefully clears things up
Atheism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
An implicit atheist has not thought about belief in gods; such an individual would be described as implicitly without a belief in gods
29 January 2008, 02:12 PM
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29 January 2008, 02:18 PM
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29 January 2008, 02:21 PM
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you got infracted, must have bin an aethiest or an agnostic, or a muslim, or a jew or bhuddist or a.......
I blame religion or a lack of it in some cases
29 January 2008, 02:32 PM
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As far back as 1772, d'Holbach said that "All children are born Atheists; they have no idea of God".[27] Similarly, George H. Smith (1979) suggested that: "The man who is unacquainted with theism is an atheist because he does not believe in a god
29 January 2008, 03:53 PM
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Well maybe you should read the article you refer to, you may find it interesting reading, in particular this section where the very point we are discussing is covered.
I think you need to be less selective.
But I take the point there are some that hold that view, which I didn't know before we had this discussion.
29 January 2008, 04:17 PM
#255
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and is a sub section of the article as whole which is headed by the definition 'Aetheism is a philisophical view'.
That first definition, to me, just reads "Atheism, from a dispassionate perspective,..." which is what considering something philosophically means.
It doesn't say "Atheism is a philosophy" which seems to be what you're reading it as. I do agree that Atheism is something that is discussed at length by Philosophers, but that in itself doesn't make it a belief system or a philosophy.
I think you need to be less selective.
But I take the point there are some that hold that view, which I didn't know before we had this discussion.
29 January 2008, 04:40 PM
#256
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Philosophy isn't a mathematical science, what are you expecting? They've observed, hypothesised and developed a theory, a falsifiable one at that. All you need to do to show he is wrong is find a child who knows about god(s) before they have been told about them by somebody else.
The whole article is Titled "Atheism". The implicit atheism is sub-heading of "Definitions and distinctions " The bit you are referring to is the first definition of Atheism, not the title. And it's "Atheism , as a philisophical view," Note the AS not IS and the comma.
That first definition, to me, just reads "Atheism, from a dispassionate perspective,..." which is what considering something philosophically means.
It doesn't say "Atheism is a philosophy" which seems to be what you're reading it as. I do agree that Atheism is something that is discussed at length by Philosophers, but that in itself doesn't make it a belief system or a philosophy.
The irony!
Well that's progress!
The whole article is Titled "Atheism". The implicit atheism is sub-heading of "Definitions and distinctions " The bit you are referring to is the first definition of Atheism, not the title. And it's "Atheism , as a philisophical view," Note the AS not IS and the comma.
That first definition, to me, just reads "Atheism, from a dispassionate perspective,..." which is what considering something philosophically means.
It doesn't say "Atheism is a philosophy" which seems to be what you're reading it as. I do agree that Atheism is something that is discussed at length by Philosophers, but that in itself doesn't make it a belief system or a philosophy.
The irony!
Well that's progress!
Until next time
29 January 2008, 04:57 PM
#257
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It's certainly a choice once you know there are choices to make.
I guess it proves we're not the only folks to have had this discussion.
But this has been a very interesting discussion and I think I'm a bit more in the middle of the road on the whole aetheist versus agnostic bit now, so cheers.
Until next time
Until next time
29 January 2008, 11:16 PM
#258
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Ive seen you write some rubbish Martin, but this is complete and utter tosh.
You dont have to go to church or even pray to be a christian. You just have to believe in god and celebrate that in some way. That be can be done by celebrating his sons birth at Christmas or maybe his resurrection at Easter. By taking part in any of these you are taking part in the christian way of life.
You only have to look at the schools to see that we are still as a country trying to practice chirstianity singing carols and doing nativity plays. As you get older you forget this as we dont see it as much in our daily lives.
You dont have to go to church or even pray to be a christian. You just have to believe in god and celebrate that in some way. That be can be done by celebrating his sons birth at Christmas or maybe his resurrection at Easter. By taking part in any of these you are taking part in the christian way of life.
You only have to look at the schools to see that we are still as a country trying to practice chirstianity singing carols and doing nativity plays. As you get older you forget this as we dont see it as much in our daily lives.
Easter is the celebration of the goddes of spring, Eostre, again a Pagan festival hijacked by Christianity.
29 January 2008, 11:24 PM
#259
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i know a lot of people who work for immigration, they say its easy to get in this country, they said immigrates come in and then flush there passports down the toliet then by law we have to keep them for months+ to find out where they from which is next to impossiable.
29 January 2008, 11:35 PM
#260
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Martin you are a good person, i see that in yours posts So i will Un-Tosh you 
As for the 'Quoted' above. Isnt that what religion is for nowdays? To give your actions an excuse? Religion is a tool. Muslims have managed to convince many weak minded that it is ok to kill yourself and others in the name of Islam.
So i will Un-Tosh you As for the 'Quoted' above. Isnt that what religion is for nowdays? To give your actions an excuse? Religion is a tool. Muslims have managed to convince many weak minded that it is ok to kill yourself and others in the name of Islam.
Islam, is taught from a very early age. Young muslims have to read the Qua'ran from an early age, and understand it's content and use it as a guide to how to live. This is not a requirement in Christianity.
29 January 2008, 11:46 PM
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30 January 2008, 12:44 AM
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I've never read the Qua'ran (what IS the correct spelling of that? Does anyone know?) but what I DO know is that if you tried to use the Bible as a guide to how to live, you'd pretty soon have a myriad of screwed-up, confused, militaristic, mysogynistic, expansionist, homophobic homicidal maniacs on the streets.
Many cultural skills, language, technology etc were brought to Europe by muslims at a time when Londoners were living in huts. They were stopped in Spain by Christians.
30 January 2008, 12:53 AM
#263
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from the original post ::::
personally i would torture the funker then report them to the authorities theres far far far too many of these "illegals" in our country
personally i would torture the funker then report them to the authorities theres far far far too many of these "illegals" in our country
30 January 2008, 10:28 AM
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No not just treated. They way i see it if they have/do pay tax they get to use the services provided if they dont/havent then they should have to take out insurance Just like everyone else does if they go to a diffrent country. This is the only way things like the nhs can carry on. We are not the worlds health service and can not afford to be, just like we are not the world police like this goverment seem's to think we are. If however someone is ill and can't get the treatment they need as they live in a 3rd world country then if we can CURE them without pushing back someone who has payed in to the service then we should help out just like every other civilized country should. But if they can work they should to help pay for it even by helping out by cleaning the hospital along side the other staff as i know our hosptal find it hard to get and keep staff so they have to hire cleaning firms which costs more which means less money goes where its needed.
But would i report someone who may or may not be an illegal immigrant yes.
But would i report someone who may or may not be an illegal immigrant yes.
30 January 2008, 11:03 AM
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No not just treated. They way i see it if they have/do pay tax they get to use the services provided if they dont/havent then they should have to take out insurance Just like everyone else does if they go to a diffrent country. This is the only way things like the nhs can carry on. We are not the worlds health service and can not afford to be, just like we are not the world police like this goverment seem's to think we are. If however someone is ill and can't get the treatment they need as they live in a 3rd world country then if we can CURE them without pushing back someone who has payed in to the service then we should help out just like every other civilized country should. But if they can work they should to help pay for it even by helping out by cleaning the hospital along side the other staff as i know our hosptal find it hard to get and keep staff so they have to hire cleaning firms which costs more which means less money goes where its needed.
But would i report someone who may or may not be an illegal immigrant yes.
But would i report someone who may or may not be an illegal immigrant yes.
30 January 2008, 11:17 AM
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30 January 2008, 02:11 PM
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Yes, sir.
Quran or Qua'ran are scholastic versions of Koran. To my knowledge, the word itself is spoken as Kuraan by the Middle Eastern and Eastern Islamic population. Eastern words are usually spellified in favour/convenience of tongue-twisting Euro lingos.
Online Etymology Dictionary says:
Quran-
1876, variant spelling (preferred by scholars) of Koran (q.v.), from Arabic qur'an, lit. "book, reading, recitation," from qara'a "to read."[/quote]
