Just to burst Z75s bubble....

I used to own an E36 323i Coupe - which I bought for all the reasons quoted above. Then I discovered Sti. When I did, I didn't get into the Beemer for over three months

Also I had a lot of problems with the Beemer, not least of which it sagged by one inch on the drivers side and replacing the springs did not fix it - the brilliant service manager said it was because I did a lot of driving on my own (I weigh 80kgs!!!).

Anyway, having been TOTALLY disillusioned with the Beemer, I then had a merc alongside the STI.

Anyway earlier this year I needed to change again, usual suspects driven and decided against a second Scoob - but just for a laugh tried the 330i Beemer. What a car - excellent handling, superb balance and composure, surprisingly quick (EVO mag 0-60, 5.9s) enough to worry a Boxster.

Also the car is enjoyable to drive with the traction control switchable, if you want, but even experienced drivers would say that on the road it is quicker and at least as much fun with it on. Certianly it will let you slide the car around without getting all nanny on you.

I recently went to a Scoob event in a little convoy along some windy lanes and driven hard it kept up easily - but there again the scoobs were driving hard too. Oh, and it was wet, and the rear was sliding about, but in a good benign way.

So now I have two superb cars in my drive, an Sti with a few extra ponies, and a BMW which I vowed I would never have, which is fun to drive, very quick, econmical and makes the P1 look like daylight robbery in terms of quality AND content.

I paid £29k for a 330CI SPORT, which with lots as standard, and I had a few other extras thtrown in - it is about £33k retail now for the same spec.

Highly recommended.

Trout

 

Oh, and it is interesting that Autocar and others are completely raving about the new 3 series steering set up to make it 'heavier'.

I have a pre-modded car, which at first seemed light, but once used to it, feels sublimely accurate and balanced. Also CAR magazine think the modification is crap, with artificial heaviness corrupting the feel.

Trout

 

Can't sit back and watch all that money go to waste...

Try a Legacy B4 - makes the packaging of the BM3 look a little less great (even poor). The B4 is quiet and fast - is moddable for fun if not fast enough already and does everything well, and nothing poorly.

If you need more turn in, less roll, better braking, etc., almost all the simple tunes and tweaks of the Imprezza work on the Legacy too (parts not interchangeable though).

As std the car gives the BMs a big run already...once tweaked a bit murders it. Not sure about the price differential, but somewhere around 8 to 10 thousand quid I guess.

Q factor is very good, fuel usage as you would expect, but can be good with a sympathetic foot (not near a diesel of course). For ICE, the McIntosh audio version is a winner (and quieter inside due to sound tuning/interior tweaks).

Give it a try, you may be surprised...it is THE PERFECT route if you think you are growing out of an Impreza (in age and size terms ).

Cheers.

 

911

Do not listen to opinion of people who have not owned BMW - I always hated them until I got one!!

I have 330i Touring with Sports suspension, 18", leather and lots more and an RB5 with lots of mods.

Both are fantastic cars in their own way - BMW does 40000 miles PA fantasically well (much better than my old MY98) and RB5 likes to come out and play at the weekend.

BMW is not as quick acceleration wise but beats RB5 above 100mph - this has been tested and is fact (in the correct conditions and where the law allows of course!)

BMW can be snappy at the rear in the current weather conditions without provocation but not dangerous and TCS is very good.

My first impreza lost me my liscence and the second has just been caught whilst on Network Q. BMW is much more stealthy!

Hope this helps
Paul

 

It depends what your after. I'd certainly never drive a BMW as they are so common even if they are good. its our standard company car. Unfortunately as good as the cars are there are a high proportion of people within unpleasant driving habits driving BMWs and I'd not want to be associated with these bell-ends.

They certainly seem quiet nice inside but our 318 and 320s have been very unreliable with nearly all of them needing to go back for engine, and electrical work within the first few months.

My next door neighbour has an STI Type R and sold this a year ago a repalced it with a 330 touring. Looked great but he's now sold this to buy another Scoob.

If it was me I'd definitely look at the Legacy B4. Interior is much better than the Impreza and its far rarer too.


AllanB

 

AJ,

if I only had to have one car and it wasn't a Scoob (!!!!!!) then I think your advice is spot on. I do have the luxury of having (needing) two and so I have two cars which are excellent to drive and are the perfect complement to each other.

I posted as many people on this board slag off Beemers without driving them, and imply they are bad cars because they are common.

So what, if something is good it deserves to be popular - how many people here bought Scoobs because they read that they were good.

If you have one, enjoy, if you don't then enjoy your Scoob.

Trout

 

I think the front looks lovely thats the only view I ever get when I look in the rear view mirror

 

This Legacy B4, what sort of performance are we looking at with that?

 

Don't believe it!

I swapped my MY99,PPP,DP,IK,ETC for a 330d touring auto almost a year ago. Not one regret

And the money I have SAVED by changing to the 330d has paid for a 330bhp/tonne westie as well


I looked at a 330 petrol and was planning to go for one until the dealer bet me £1000 off the price of the petrol if I didn't prefer the diesel in a back to back test. I bought the 'd'

In 30000 miles I have had to buy 2 tyres (through punctures), spent less than £200 on servicing (i.e. less than £500) and averaged over 550 miles per £45 tankful (frequently over 600 ). The car has lost just £3700 in value (ie what my dealer would give me for it in PX today). In other words the car has cost me just over £6500 in 12 months/30k miles

My last 30000 miles in the Impreza cost 3 set of tyres, over £500 in servicing, £300 on brake wear (i.e. c£2500) and averaged 300 miles per £50 tankful. The car lost on average £9375 per year in depreciation. In other words the car cost me over £16500 in 12 months/30k miles AND that is before the cost of the Mods

Which is more expensive?

 

Gary

My dealer has said the bottom has now fallen out of the 330D market. They just cant shift them, and have 5 new ones in stock. Not sure if the recent upgrade of the 320D has signaled its demise ?. My dealer has been caught out by this sudden fall from grace.

Jonathan

 

911boy
I have a 330 Coupe as a company car. Hard to compare with the scooby but I don't think you were looking for a comparison? It's a lovely car to drive, and my wife rates it as well. I know it's a bit more than £25k but you wouldn't be disappointed.

 

Has anyone tried the A4 2.5 TDI QUATTRO, a very good alternative to a Scoob!!

 

Looked at both the A4 and A6 2.5TDI, but they are league behind. Quite noisy compared ot the 330d and lacking in performance (even the 180). Furthermore they were too 'numb' to drive



The saloons and manuals have been hit, but the auto and especially auto touring models are still in high demand, hence the offer on Saturday

 

GaryC,

I get the jist about what your saying but are all these figures correct

£200 for servicing the BMW over 30K seems quite low for me, especially for a 330D. Also the depreciation as an average for your Impreza? Did you do 30K in the first year before you sold it? If so did you lose nearly 10K on the list price after 1 year?

I'm not saying these are wrong, as you've had both the cars, but would be grateful for a wee bit clarification over these two points LOL

 

My 330d had a £74 oil service after about 13500, then a full £134 service at about 27000 miles - the next service is due at about 39000 (the car tells you when it needs a service), so it has actually cost £208, not £200

I had the Impreza for 16 months, did 42000miles (30k in last 12 months) and lost £12500 from purchase price to sale price about £2k more if you include 'toys' was good fun though

 

Cheers GaryC.....I see what you mean about the costs now

 

Another car which I thought might be fun to try out was an Evo....now I know you lot won't like this , but is the Evo a better car then an STI for example?

I've read a couple of reports and most of them say its better .

 

Yes 911Boy,

I've had a Scooby and an Evo and I'd definitely say the Evo was the superior car. Both a lot different from a 330 though!

 

As Son of Sam says, you can't really compare a Subaru/Evo with a 330 (i or d), they are totally different animals, and have many USPs above the other.

The 330i/d is a quick car and in a straight line, not much different to a std UK WRX, but beyond that they are pretty much chalk and cheese.

The BMW will not give the thrills/noise/flattering/'racing driver' feel/drive for the sheer hell of it/every drive is an event that the Scooby does, but...
The Scooby can't compete on build quality/comfort/mile-munching ability/running costs/support/equipment/reliability/anonymity/practicality that the BMW offers

I guess you have to choose which set of criteria are more important

Now a 330d AND a Westie......that's the combination

 

Have a relation who has recently bought a 330 - he has just realised that there is no comparison to an Evo VII and gets his new evo in January (BTW he has had BMs for the last 10 years, alpina, M3 you name it, hes had it)

Thank god hes finally seen the truth

 

Gary

Always one to disagree with you on the 330

When it comes to reliability, BMW still could learn some thing from Subaru. My M3 goes in for its 1200 mile service with a couple of faults, and as many rattles as all my 6 Scoobies put together. Mine is not alone in this, with other owners I know having problems. A quick visit to the M3 BBS would also substantiate this. Also as far as dealers go for service, my old Subaru dealership knocks BMW into a tin hat.

The car however as a drivers car is superb. As Birdy says anyone can buy an EVO and Subaru and drive quickly. BMW require more driver skill (something I'm lacking - thank God for DSC).

Jonathan

 

model T of the 21st century

 

This Legacy B4, what sort of performance are we looking at with that?
================================================== ===========
Swapped my company 323i (BMW not Mazda!!) for a new Legacy B4 RSK 3 months ago. No regrets whatsoever.

23k gets you: 280 bhp (twin turbo) 0-60 in 5.9 secs (if you really want !!). It has a much more comfortable ride than any Impreza (I do lots of miles, so this matters), is quiet, refined, has excellent handling (certainly compared to the sports suspension on the BMWs), and is a prime Q-car. The interior is streets ahead of the Impreza, boot is a proper size, and if you want even more space there's the GT-B (ie the Legacy Estate).

Down sides are: drinks fuel, only available as import, so only specialists will touch them (though thats not particularly bad), and err.....thats it.

Try one out - you'll be very pleasantly surprised

SB

 

I have likewise heard problem stories about the M3, but then any n/a engine with almost 110bhp per litre is going to have certain 'issues' with everyday use! I am however told the rewards more than make up for it?

I'm not saying BMs are faultless, far from it, but my 330d (and every 330i/d I know about) has been fault-free. A very important trait when you cover 30k/yr! My subaru was pretty good, just the odd overboost issue and wastegate 'clog' - but then the Subaru got serviced 5 times in its first 30000 miles, my 330d has only just had its 2nd service in 30k

 

Up until yesterday I'd have agreed with you, however my new boss here has a 330iC and yesterday it immobalised itself outside a shop. BMW assist came out couldn't do a thing and had to tow it to the nearest dealer. It spent the day there getting everything remapped etc as it was completely shafted.

Normally I wouldn't find this amusing but he'd been ragging me about the superior quality etc of the BM over my UK300 on Monday so I found it very satisfying. There must be a God afterall.

 

If you want something a little different - less 'run-of-the-mill' then you could do still do a lot worse than the new WRX. It is a vastly improved car over the old model - certainly more refined, better handling and better built. I'm not pretending it is a BMW in terms of ultimate build quality but it is an extremly good car.

That said, I was also deeply impressed with MattOz's 330D - truely stunning car and to be honest the only BMW I would consider owning other than an M3. Seem to remember him embarrassing the BMW (M5) Ring Taxi at Nurburgring???

Just my 2 cents worth...

Chris

 

Just picked up my Autocar yestarday and read the report on the new WRX (i.e. 60K report or whatever). Jesus, it does seem a bit pricy on fuel/servicing etc. compared to the Type R accord and the Jag X-typre!!!

 

Compare it to an Evo - that's scary The way I see it, based on my average mileage, the car will be serviced twice a year - which means two oil changes and that's not a bad thing.

Chris

 

Don't get a BM until you've tried the Legacy!

I think Ian Litchfield is the best place to go for a new one - he's much cheaper than Park Lane.

- also check out the b4 yahoogroup - get some unbiased opinions from UK B4 owners - many have traded up from imprezas. You might find someone local who can give you a spin.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/legacyb4/

The B4 is cheaper to buy, quicker, more comfortable (compared with the 330 "sports" suspension. If you want an impreza with a decent interior, more space, better handling...

The 330 has a fantastic engine, which also sounds great (these things are important you know), but I'm quite partial to the flat-4 noise.

The Legacy would cost you lots more to run though.... service every 6K, fuel consumption in mid 20's, & possibly expensive if it goes wrong.

Mind you, I've never believed the myth about BM's being reliable.

Ed

 

Easy on the Beemers! Although they are probably as likely to be rattly and have minor faults as any other car, I've had enough very high milers to know that they are built to last. Three series are common, but that's only down to the car's success - they must be doing something right considering they're not the cheapest. BMW produce some of the finest engines in the world, as well as being the benchmark that other prestige car manufacturers consistently try (and struggle) to keep up with.

I could rave on and on, but in short, don't discount BMs 'til you've driven one and you know what you're talking about, and don't judge the cars by the inordinate number of arseholes that seem to drive them .

Cheers, and have a great Crimble

Deano

(Loving my Scoob, but love my BMs more!)