G_Sleigh_STi

Holy ****! I see. I see. Well thats something to take into account when upgrading performance. Any other little problems like that known?

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Hypereutectic pistons crack quite easily (boost and advance related)...and there's a bit of a discussion raging as to which newage Sti's have hypereutectics and which have forged pistons no body can be completely sure

Andy.F

Yes, indirectly though, ie if you run too much advance and or boost and get detonation.
The std 2.5 sti pistons for example are fine in the high 400's

Andy

ScrappyDoo2

Guys,

I have the TSL kit fitted to my 52 WRX and can safely say so far that the kit (although costly) is superb. As many people will know, TSL are a quality outfit and have spent a long time developing this kit (originally they worked together with Pace on their current kit). The level of testing that went into the chargecooler was incredible and the quality is top notch with Docking (Silverstone) making the aluminium parts for them.

It all looks pretty trick too with the clear coolant hoses passing the fluid around the rad to the topmount, the pump is incredible - take the top off the reservoir tank whilst in operation to see the force in action!!

Now I know from experience that many of you on hear are very technically demanding about the parts you choose for your cars and quite right you are for being that way. My point being that I can't churn out tech data for you on before intercooler/after intercooler temps vs. load vs. boost vs ambient temp etc etc. However I can say that using my PSI3 which reports intake temp the car typically saw between 4-15 deg C above outside temp in late spring weather on regular driving (blasts and normal tootling around). After the new kit on the drive home on a hot day last week (temp 27 deg C) the PSI3 quoted 27 and at one point 26. As well as that, following a post fitting 'spirited run' with Graham driving, we got back, popped the bonnet to a crackling toast cooking engine. You couldn't touch the engine as it was so hot yet the intercooler (still in the usual position) was cold to the touch.

Therefore it works.

I don't know how this compares to a FMIC in temp reduction properties but this seems damn good to me, required no bumper/cross member butchery, no lag and looks much more trick when you lift the bonnet. That was my choice, it may not be everybodies but that is the experience I have had so hope it helps those considering the kit.

Greg

carlos_hiraoka

chargecoolers :

G_Sleigh_STi

Scrappydo2 hey thanks for your little report chap Get some photos of it posted and all fitted then

Sounds good, basically if you dont want front mounted its the perfect way to make sure air intake is always perfectly cold?

Carlos What the hell is that then? LOL

911

Carlos:
Just where do you keep finding this (interesting) stuff from!
Guess that's the water pump where the washer bottle should be?

On this entire subject, don't you need a separate water rad for the cooling water somewhere?

Greg:
A good real world report, nice to read, and can we have some pics?


Graham

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

the rad gets mounted in the front similar to a fmic only its a lot smaller

911

So when the cars standing still the cooling water will pickup heat from the front rad unless there is a fan etc etc ...
Sure this is all worth it?
Graham.

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Graham, the same could be said for a front mount intercooler, but the rad fans help to keep the temps low. All the options will suffer from Heat soak of some form, but neither front mount (intercooler or charge cooler) option will suffer from heat soak like a top mounted intercooler does...Get rigging up some fans mate

911

I think you are probably right Tim. With the big scoop in place there is a barn of a room above the TMIC for some fans to go on top.
One thought is to make a twin set that can be clipped onto the TMIC and plugged into a dash operated switch just for hill climbs.
If I can get a high airflow and water spray then I can chill the TMIC for the 60 secs of a hill climb, but more imortantly for the age I wait on the startline soaking up all that turbo heat..

Has anyone actually tried this and can demonstrate that it will be a benefit?

Graham.

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Andy F has fans under his, erm, 'top mount'

scoobydoo one

a freind of mine has had the tsl chargecooler fitted to his sti 8 and what a differance it has made it's a complete different car to drive hardly any turbo lag it's just great hats off to tsl for a cracking job

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...s/DSCN0873.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...s/DSCN0869.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...s/DSCN0875.jpg

i'd say go for it mate

David_Wallis

hmm..

Andy.F

I don't see the need for a combination system ? The tmic part will still heat soak unless it has a fan on it.
Escort Cosworths came from the factory with a combination system, that is usually the first thing to get removed when upgrading and a big fmic is fitted in its place.

Andy

carlos_hiraoka

Graham for the type of use you give to your car it would be perfect, as you can basically add ice into the chargecooler water deposit so that when car is standing still temps will keep sensible ..... drag guys use this systems without a water radiator for the chargecooler, just use water and loads of ice. But if you are serious about attempting this u will need a small radiator on front. Try asking Andy F. about this. I think that with a good chargecooler (like the one seen on the pic) inlet temps will be still low and a u will still have a sharp throttle response.

carlos_hiraoka

huge FMIC (water radiator) :

carlos_hiraoka

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...9&page=1&pp=25

911

Thanks for the info Carlos.
At the moment I quench the TMIC just before a run with a sponge and very cold water...then add lots of ice to the TMIC water spray tank (the washer bottle) and drown the TMIC right before the run and all the way up the hill. I use about 2 litres of iced water in that period, ie about 2 litres in 50 seconds.
Not very technical but easy.

Graham.

carlos_hiraoka

Graham if possible try to install an air inlet temp sensor after the TMIC, in order to see if the temp gets above 50°C ..... then u will have a better idea if the intercooler is up to job in your "n" minute run, which definetly is a lot longer than the 1/4 mile .

911

Will do.
On a decent hill climb it is about 10 gearshifts and full throttle to-the-red-line blasts so things get hot, hence leaving the water spray on all the time.
Racing this weekend and next so will try to do the measurements.
Graham.

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

I believe that the STi8 TMIC is more than adequate for my needs. If Andy has tested his to 400BHP then I'll be keeping mine for a bit longer too. I have a temp monitoring in the TB and can see what its doing so after some heat soak the temp can rise 20C above ambient but will only take a few hundred yards to cool back to a couple of C's above ambient. I realise this won't help drag queens or hill climbers but will be good enough for real drivers on track If I add fans then this will be even better. I've not even had to use the water spray yet and I've not seen any real rise in temps during a blast. The old TMIC was crap in comparison and would easily rise to +15-20C on a spirited drive with peaks of 70+C on the Ring

F

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Floyd, be careful out on track a top mount will still suffer from heat soak far more than a front mount. On the road this is rarely a problem, unless you like booting the car away from traffic having been stood cooking for a few minutes or more, or even worse really high speed cruising, but on track it can soon become a very big problem.

I used to say that I saw no point in fitting an FMIC kit, it would be laggy and I wouldn't see the benefit...I was so wrong

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Bloody SN breakdowns I've got to write this again

I've been on track many times and I know the implications of heat accumulation. As you know I have a TC in the TB and I can monitor the temps in real time. The new TMIC is way better than the original and I’m amazed at how good it is. I shall reserve judgement for the first track day though, but I anticipate that it will be very good.

My car is doing fine on this TMIC and there’s more improvement to be had. IIRC you achieved 350ish at PE(?) with your FMIC and I’m not miles away on the TMIC . My car also drives as well as the graph predicts with very little lag and certainly better than the TD04. I suggest that I’d need a bigger turbo to fill any FMIC, which would inevitably lead to more lag. Remember that this is a road and track car, not a drag queen machine I don’t want to cut my bumper, I don’t want more cost and I don’t want all that pipework! I’ll see how far I can go on the TMIC first. There is room for more cooling anyway with the TMIC…

I have seen high temps on the old TMIC but little knock activity, so there’s a fair margin for safety to go.

F

911

TMIC + fans + iced water spray = ?
Looks like Bob's or me will be doing it very soon.
I'm getting bored as the car is working and I need to so something to it.
Above seems just the ticket.

The FMIC I think is great, but the cost and having to change other things (inlet/panel filter etc) goes against the grain.

During the 5 RR runs at Well Lane, the power drop-off was put down to the TMIC heating up.Max power was 407 on 3rd run, dropped to 283 on 5th run.
I did not run the TMIC water spray on that day.
I have run the water on hill climbs and without, and could not notice any difference to be honest.

Graham.

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

So Graham, if I'd of had another 2 runs then maybe I would get 400bhp! I can accept that And then I'll switch the water spray on

As for fans, I don't need them yet, also the compromise is that they slow the flow in static mode I fancy a quick shot of Nos onto the TMIC to keep everything in order.

F

911

I would only do the fan mod for the racing. Plan is to make a clip-on module of the fans/housings/12 volt connection.
Arrive to race without the fans on, ie normal TMIC system
Clip-on the fans, connect up and run them only for the hill climb. The speeds attained on the hills is quite low so bonnet airflow slow, so the fans may be better under those circumstances.
Remove fans to go home.(I drive the car to and from the events)

Best find a good scrapyard for some small dia fans/cowls etc.

Graham.

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

I do feel a mini-project coming on

One thing that would worry me is how much the fans restrict airflow when moving and whether the fans are enough to compensate the restriction.

Maybe this is why AndyF has them under the i/c as opposed to on top?

Would have thought that under the i/c would be better as this is also the way the rad cooling fans work,

Bob

911

Understand, but remember why I'm thinking of doing this.
The TMIC get a lot of heat soak at the start line, you can be there ticking over for 5 mins.
I need to chill the whole TMIC prior to the off.
A hill climb is max 60 secs, usually 40secs.
If the fan speed/velocity is better than 'natural' airflow off the scoop then things are better.
If the fans are under the TMIC then the air from the scoop has still to get past the fans if they cannot move the incoming air fast enough.
Then there is the space available to squeeze it all in. More room on top.

Need to think it through a bit more then will start a thread in Projects to bore you all!
Anyone know who sells auxillary (ie Towing) fans cheaper than Demon Tweeks?

Graham.

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Talk to Mark (Lateral) he maybe able to help...

Pacet fans can be bought in relatively thin formats, I would have thought with some clever ducting under the scoop you could create some additional room for fans