eClaire

Oh **** I feel sick.

Jerome

Tragic that political games have cost the lives of these 3 (not to mention the one killed on the journey there). And people in the UK (and SN) still think Bush is wonderful and that Blair can do no wrong by poodling up to him...

As for WWII, the Yanks only joined in after Pearl Harbour. They were quite happy to sit back and watch Europe go to war up until then.

I am still at a loss why they are even needed there. If the Yanks can't find 850 troops when they have 130,000 plus out there (some of whom have had their tour extended), it doesn't say much for Yanks logistics or planning.

And as for their choice in being there, I doubt many soldiers had the kind of bullsh1t that they are getting in Iraq in mind when signing up.

moses

jerome its so sad last week i was watching some of them scots boys getting interviewed u could see the fear in their eyes they were only young and just pi55ed off they were getting sent to baghdad , specially after what the usa has done in fallujah and they were not looking forward to the backlash in baghdad against the blackwatch, their faces were like ghosts

Markus

Have to echo those sentiments Jerome.

Our lads are not needed there, if the US wants a war, let them have it, and let them do it on their own.

Why are our lads their? Because they were ordered to go there, don't think they have a lot of choice in the matter, poor sods.

Maybe our boys should indulge in a bit of friendly fire to pass the time, not like the yanks haven't accidentialy killed a few of our chaps, and who really cares about a few dead redneck yank soldiers anyway?

moses

markus when i watched fahrenheit 911 i wished the american soldiers who celebrate the death and gunotting of innocents and think their rambo i wish they go back in bodybags, when they were taking the mickey of the deadbody he still has a hard on, sick dogs they were and boasting about the music they play while shooting down people burn motherfeckers burn motherfeckers song

Mitchy260

Soldiers who sign up to infantry regiments sign up to go to war. No doubting that, but they sign up believing in protecting queen and country.

Yes queen and country!! THIS COUNTRY. We live in the UK and from what i can see the middle east poses no threat to the UK mainland.

War on terror, what a lot of pish, Northern Ireland spring to mind?

These guys have signed up to defend britain if it should come under attack not to go where a US president tells them to go.

Soldiers do as they're told. Tiggs you have the choice, a soldier does not! You can go to work tomorrow and tell your boss to shove his job up his **** and move onto a different career a week later. A soldier needs to give 1 years notice! It's do as your told, or spend the rest of your time in military prison.

Soldiers have not signed up for a so called war on terror, like i said if they were killed in action fighting for queen and country and these deaths would have been honourable. What have they died for however?

It makes me sick to the stomach.

Taff107

Is it as bad for the 5 million that went 'missing' under Saddams rule?


Nothing more than to show US 'support' to the world IMO


When 6 of my colleagues were killed, we were all urged to phone home as soon as possible to allay fears. There are many faults with the Army but they have a pretty good compassionate system. The family of the guys killed would have been told pretty soon after the incident.

harvey

iTrader: (48)

My heart goes out to the members of the Black Watch Regiment, their families and loved ones.
This war was ill conceived, badly planned both for the invasion and the aftermath. We, the public, were misled as to the need for the war and the country was taken to war without a UN mandate.
The British Army had its own theatre, in the South of the country under control. A further deployment several hundred Ks North, extended supply lines, communications and unfamiliar teritory made no sense militarily.
Why did the U.S. so badly need a British Group. Only 800 men, pretty small in comparison to the U.S. presence. Why did our government agree. Why, when this was first mooted, was the possibility of this deployment, let out in dribs and drabs with denials from Hoon and others that the decision was already taken.
I am sad, upset and very angry.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Unfortunately in this line of work these things happen
Yet this brings the number of dead to 73....
Thats not bad considering when i was out in west germany in 87-89, on average there would be 1 death per unit per year on exercises, and there were alot of units out there in the late 80's, something you dont hear about too much, and i even lost one of my mates this way, killed a few hours before the exercise finished.....

As for what these guys do.....
I remember the cadre who took us for basic training in 85, they told us about the falklands and how each guy in their unit had volunteered, i thought it was bull until 1990 and the first gulf war, every guy at my unit volunteered to go, even me, and why you ask?
Because thats what we did (even though i was signals).
I did 2 years in NI, 6 months in Bosnia (and not the nice parts either!, good for a diet, i lost 1 stone )
Ok, i had nearly 3 years in Cyprus (i suppose that made up for it ) but it was the job, and where the job took you, you went and you carried it out.
And for all you people who say its Blair/Bush..... these terrorists have been around alot longer than the 2 above, and doing similar things, if not on a smaller scale.
And considering for years, we have been attacked by terrorists, killing soldiers and innocent civilians, think about the families they had.
Terrorism needs to be stamped out, and unfortunately there is no easy way (you cant make an omlette without breaking eggs comes to mind )

Tony

unclebuck

Lets hope some good may come of this - Hopefully in form of the 'great' British public (represented on this forum by the likes of pslewis and others) realising we need to get this incompetant government out of office at the earliest possible opportunity. I'll be interested in the reaction of those on Question Time in about half an hour.

UB

Markus

with you on that matey! I've met a fair few US troops and must say, the sterotypical view of them is, on the whole, pretty true. "I'm going out and going to shoot me an Iraqi!" (said in a southern drawl). Totally sure that what they are doing out there is justified and right, and Bush is a hero, blah, blah, blah.

OK, I'm not saying some of our lads don't feel the same way, we all know there is also a sterotypical squaddie image, but there is, as far as I can see, no reason why our lads should be out there in the first place.

If the US is so powerful then surley it does not need the support of any other country to fight a war?

pslewis

What a bunch of girls blouses you lot are .... playing little war games on your PS2's .... think you know what you're talking about .... believing some TV programme about there being no terrorists

Soldiers signed up to fight, wherever and whenever required ... they did NOT, repeat did NOT sign up with the clause that they will only fight when and where they feel like it ..... they go where the leaders of this country send them - the leaders of whom were voted in by the voters of the country.

I wonder how many complaining about Blair actually bothered to vote?? Bit busy that day were we?? had a PS2 game to finish did we?? wanted to watch a program about terror not existing did we??

If you are brave enough to hold your hand up and say you didn't bother to vote, than I have only one thing to say to you ............... you have NO right whatsoever to question the decisions of a government that you didn't even bother to vote for or against!!

Pete

unclebuck

Stop now Pete. You are in serious danger of making a fool of yourself (again).

pslewis

No UB, its my opinion and I'll voice it!

I consider YOU to be way off!

Easy for us here to slag off everyone but ourselves .... sitting at our PC's all warm and cozy .... what I'm saying is there are those for whom it was a little too chilly or inconvenient to vote, who are bad mouthing our leaders ..

AND THATS WAY OUT OF ORDER!!

Pete

gsm1

It's five million now is it??? Just pluck a figure out of the air, why don't ya, hasn't stopped Blair and Bush.

I agree that as many or more soldiers do die in exercises and soldiers do sign up knowing they may be killed. However, these guys died for nothing but lies.

Or as the slogan goes: Blair lied, people died.

BOB.T

Yes I would but then the USA isn't a fecking war zone!

The Yanks need our help cos they're dumb and can't figure out for themselves why the people of Iraq get p*ssed off when they get shot! They're too keen to go in guns blazing and shoot anything that moves and then ask questions later

I think either we should get out and let the yanks deal with it as they see fit, most likely nuke the place or they should get out and fund us to clear up after them, at least we'd do a proper job of it!

johnfelstead

And that is why it is only when absolutely necessary and as a last resort that we send our armed forces into harms way.



This war in Iraq is the only time our forces have been sent to war based on intelligence; this was a pre-emptive strike and not a reaction to being attacked, unlike the Falklands or Gulf War one. We have no UN mandate and the reason given for our troops being sent into this pre-emptive war has been proven to be false. Some would say the intelligence was wrong, I don’t accept that, I believe the intelligence was selected to fit the mandate.



There are people on this thread that are angry who have done far more than sat in front of a PS2 playing games, there are also plenty of people who have not served in the forces who still have the right and in fact duty to say what they feel is right.

pslewis

I will repeat a fact of life:-

If you can't be bothered to vote - you have NO RIGHT to question what happens in your name by the leaders YOU allowed to take power by NOT voting!!

It cheeses me right off those for whom its a little difficult to walk to their village hall on a cold evening to vote, and then start commenting on people actually doing something to make this world a better place for THEM!!

Pete

hawkthescoobslayer

agree with you totally John

WELL SAID

my great concern is watching the Sh[t hit the fan now Bush has got in for another 4 years. That man could be the death of us all

Tiggs

whats all this "soilders have no choice stuff" they sign up to do as they are told. again. ITS GRIM they are killed but soilders have a long history of being sent where they may not like it.......i wouldnt be one and i hope my kids never even consider it. Im also thankfull there are those that do......i assume they know the risk. No one joins up and says "i'll only fight in X y Z country"

pslewis

Exactly WHY can Bush be the death of YOU?! Hello? Planet earth calling!!

Pete

gsm1

Moses, yes I was sickened by those American troops as well but you'll see many letters (on Moore's site and Veterans against the war) from American soldiers, stationed in Iraq, who are sickened by the actions of their fellow gung-ho soldiers and officers.
I have a friend in America and her husband is in the US military. They both hate Bush and they both know this war is a crock of sh*t but there is little he can do about it, he has to serve.
The British army are not exactly squeaky clean either, there are plenty of nutters within the Brit army that the MoD fails to discipline. We've seen plenty of incidents, at home and in Iraq.
There was a British soldier who was found shot recently within the Brit camp in Basra. The MOD say they are 'investigating' her death...hmm.

hawkthescoobslayer

that's your view and I accept it pete, however I didn't vote for Blair and the ****** still got it and is screwing this country to crap......... hmmm should I say oh dear my party didn't get in therefore blairs ok???

should i hell blair and bush could get us into SERIOUS trouble nothing like we've experienced before. Iran no doubt will be next then who???

seems a bit like ethnic/political cleansing to me?

paul

Jerome

Here we go, pissy pants is trolling again. Time to change the colostomy bag and tuck up in bed, it's way past the bedtime of a coffin dodger.

hawkthescoobslayer

you obviously haven't watched the same new channels as me then??

First Afghanistan (eventually ooh let's send less troops in than they have POLICE IN NEW YORK 3 weeks later)

Secondly Iraq -here we go again

Third Iran?


Fourth China?


Fifth WTF

when will this war on terror ever end....... bush's administration has people so wound up about terror I can't see it coming to an end.

paul


ps did anyone else think it highly LUCKY for bush that bin laden came oon tv days before election day when everyone is paranoid about terror???

pslewis

Paul, if you actually voted then I have every respect for your point of view.

What I am saying, and they KNOW who they are!! I will NOT embarass them here, who have stated in past posts that they couldn't be 4rsed to vote!

Now, to my mind, you can turn up and destroy your ballot paper .... the fact is that you actually TURNED UP!

Many good people died to allow us the freedom to vote - not to take it is an absolute disgrace ........... and those people should SHUT UP!!

Pete

hawkthescoobslayer

is that aimed at me?

hawkthescoobslayer

that I agree with.

gsm1

I voted for that scum bag Blair, I'll say what I like.

pslewis

You weren't old enough to vote at the last election, remember???

Pete