OllyK

That's fine as long as a genetic defect didn't contribute to the "accident", broken leg due to falling down stairs in part due to a genetic eye defect resulting in a lesser ability to judge distance etc. Bit of a ficle example, but you get the idea!

FrenchBoy

Absolutely!

FrenchBoy

So the next thing to think about is:

does genetic improvement necessarily lead to an improved quality of life?

Obviously it does to those that are suffering from genetic defects but the fact is that our lives can also improve in the way that we lead them - as a soceity - ie. caring for the sick, looking out for those who suffer from misfortunes etc.

Genetic improvement isn't the only way forward in order for us to advance as a race/species.

Personally i think throwing off the shackles of religion and superstition would be of more benefit but thats a whole other argument!

Andrew Dixon

Is it possible that the human race has now evolved past the point of genetic selection of physical attributes?

What I'm getting at is that 100,000s of year ago human had to have certain physical strengths in order to survive. These strengths were persisted through natural selection. However nowadays we are increasingly living in a world where it is 'knowledge' are keeping us alive. Knowledge in the form of science, medicine, technology, etc., and it is this knowledge that undergoes a form of natural selection in order to ensure survival of the human race.

Or maybe not?

OllyK

If you mean quality of life in a non materilistic sense, in which case the answer is yes, otherwise no

You are mixing survival with the "being comfortable". Natural genetic improvement will do squat for those already suffering with a detrimental genetic condition. Science may however be able to correct it. Nature would remove that person from the gene pool so that the defect is not carried forward. Science cures it in that person (but possibly only the symptoms) which allows it to propogate in to future generations.

In the short term that is true, but in the long time we must adapt to the environment or we will perish. The dinosaurs were not able to adapt fast enough and look what happened to them.

Again, in the short term, I couldn't agree more!!

OllyK

Yes knowledge is currently keeping us alive as we are not letting natural selection work. The question is "is that sustainable indefinately"?

We are artifically sustaining genetic defects that deterimental rather than beneficial. Consider something like Asthma (OK not confirmed as genetic, but suspected). Without treatement an asthma sufferer stands a good chance of having a severe attack that may well kill them. In so doing it removes them from the gene pool and prevents that gene from propogating. Now it may well be that it will always re-occur due to mutation or due to the breeding of 2 carriers for example. However, sufferers are far more likely if not certain to pass the defect on than a carrier in a form that it is apparent rather than dormant carrier. So by keeping this person in the gene pool we increase the chance of an increased number of suffers in the next generation. If this goes unchecked, in enough time everybody will be asthmatic. OK we can treat it, but would we not be better removing the genes that cause it from the gene pool, which is what natural selection would do. OK, not suggestion a cull of Asthmatics (the Mrs wouldn't be too happy for a start ) but the same applies to all the other genetic diseases.

FrenchBoy

I dont think genetic adaptation would be an effective solution to any environmental problems/pressures we face. Any solution to those problems will have to be scientific/lifestyle based (if you believe that there is anything we can actually do about the environment - again thats another argument).

But we're getting picky now as i dont see a lot of difference between our views.

OllyK

Indeed science HAS to play a part, it is perpetuating genes that otherwise would not exist, so it is required to maintain them going forward. The problem is that those deficient genes become more widespread as a result. You also have to consider the genetic adaptation in terms of environmental pressure is not a quick process, it takes many many generations, it is a slow process. Genetics will not help with the day to day changes to the environment - and yes we are affecting the environment (not necessarily in a positive way) and so making things even more difficult for us and making us more dependant on science. The fact that other species still exist and are doing quite well suggests they are adapting naturally and most of them can survive in the current environment. Many humans could not survive naturally and the number that could is decreasing.

They are similar I grant you!!