CraigH

That'd only apply if:

a) the company was Ltd and trading insolvent
or
b) the soletrader was taking money under false pretences, ie, money for goods which the could not supply due to reason xyz.

I think?

David_Wallis

Simon, Can I rtm due to advertising

Please get a banner ad.. and help fund the bbs..

Webmaster.. please moderate simons posts more closely

PS see bugs and feature requests..



David

Adam M

I must admit to thinking the same thing as JF did.

Personally I think its a great idea and am excited to see if they can deliver on their promises.

I would ask simon, from the beginning, if you are going to be setting up shop premises, can you make them london based? it would help me out a lot

In all seriousness, if you can improve the handling by using the type r dccd, that would be great, you should be aware that active systems have found that the old shape dccd tends to over heat when used in its locked position. The newer style apparently is more robust.

I was hoping a company would do this kind of thing, but figured it was way too specialised for anyone to take it on. I don't know if you recall the many threads involving you me JF and moray among others relating to doing this kind of thing. We did conclude we would need to retro fit wheel speed sensors, g sensors, and steering angle/ rate sensors. If this is something that your lot are looking into then I remain very keen to see what can be done.

I would ask that you keep your engineers well and truly focussed ont he market being for tarmac rather than loose serface!

With regard to the scoobysport name, regardless of what has happened before, I think itis probably fair to say that it is one of the most recognised aftermarket subaru tuning companies in the world, and bad press is far exceeded by good press. With this in mind, and the open publishing of the "under new management" sign, I think the name must have considerable worth and in your position, think it was a fortunate but also wise move.

At least this way you start on the basis of a recognised foothold. You need far less publicity for market awareness of the company. Starting from scratch you could easily be lost in the ether, and be just another of the many tuning companies that have popped up.

Given the potential benefit to all us type r owners, I look forward to seeing what can be done.

ex-webby

ROFL @ David Wallis (Will look now)

Adam

Shop premises. No. Their initial focus is for research and development and then to manufacture the products. We intend to offer the sale / fitting of the products to a dealer network.

There will be some exciting opportunities for those that have them fitted though.. I've just typed an example... but I really don't think I am able to say too much right now. Trust me, it is fabulous though, and one of the reasons I finally agreed to get involved.

I am hoping to have a meeting with one of the key engineers today, so may be able to say more later today (probably tomorrow morning for UK).

Agreed. And I think this is the problem in fairness. This kind of technology is generally only available to this extent within WRC, and the top engineers within WRC tend not to be interested in road car development because the end result products are just not as exciting. The difference here is that we have WRC experience in-house, and the engineers are happy as they're developing the absolute pinnacle of equipment. Then they have the investment on top of that. It has all just come together really well.

I personally felt that the wheel speed sensors would not be 100% necessary. But I'm sure we'll find out soon enough. The steering sensor is absolutely necessary though. They also felt that a brake pressure sensor is necessary, but I suggested it wasn't as most people would want a completely open diff on braking for safety and stability in a road car... but again, that decision is ultimately down to them, the test drivers, WRC drivers, and enthusiast drivers (all 3 groups will be used for the development and test driving).

All the best

Simon

cefski

Simon - As an 'enthusiast driver', I'll gladly, erm, "test" a semi de-cat SsII exhaust on my relatively standard 00MY turb. **** it. I'm feeling tatry so I'll "test" anything you're willing to throw at me . What are my chances?

Back to reality (and sobriety) for a mo... All this talk of WRC bods working their magic on road cars is, quite frankly, the stuff of dreams. So I really do hope that you pull it off. But am I right in presuming that any new developments for our beloved Imp will be aimed mainly at the new models? If so, how will the all new Scoobysport cater for owners of the classic model, if at all?

Cheers

Kev

ex-webby

Kev

Well one thing you have going for you on that, is that I personally own a classic shape.. and I want all the goodies too!! LOL

In all seriousness.. some of the equipment will be phased in terms of which models it will be available for. So you might find that some kit arrives one month for the later model cars, and then a couple of months later for earlier models, etc.

Equipment like the Active Diff system for the DCCD cars will be fairly universal, and will just require different maps.

Regarding "the stuff of dreams". You can probably start to see why I was so keen on it all .

All the best

Simon

thecirsch

Probably explains why this thread went completley unnoticed or not commented on:

http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthread.php?t=316121

ex-webby

thecirsch

Wasn't unnoticed. The question was answered in another thread. The account is disabled which means there is no way to see the products on the site, unless you put the exact url in with the product id.

Regards

Simon

thecirsch

Simon,

Apologies,

Ed

harvey

iTrader: (48)

Simon:
Are you suggesting I have no idea what is involved in creating an efficient exhaust system ? Where did the welding a few pipes together come from?

By editing what I said and quoting only a part of the relevant paragraph you have put the wrong slant on what I said.

Hayward and Scott, original designers and manufacturers of the Scoobysport exhaust have been doing this sort of work for many years for numerous car companies including Jaguar and Aston Martin and with their years of experience they know a thing or two about building capable exhaust sysytems. In the same way Janspeed know their business and have the ability to produce capable systems. However I am sure that neither would suggest it was rocket science.

As I already said there are a number of capable systems available but there are some rubbish systems out there too.
Are you implying there is something unique to the Scoobysport/Hayward and Scott system?

ex-webby

harvey

If you stand by your statement, yes. Maybe you have some qualifications I am unaware of. I do know however that you contradict one of the most respected and successful WRC engineers who specialise in this very field. But possibly, you are equally, or more qualified?

They are not the original designers of the scoobysport exhaust. In addition, the system they produced (and still produce) is not the same as the current ScoobySport system manufactured for scoobysport by Janspeed.

I am not sure why you keep bringing hayward and scott into it though, nobody, especially me are saying anything about whether they are capable or not of producing a good exhaust system.

What differentiates a good or bad system? Possibly design is one of the main elements? So possibly a cleverly designed system is a good one, and badly designed system is a bad one?

To be honest, I do not personally know what these elements are. I do know however, that I would rather trust this statement containing the sentiment of a highly respected WRC engineer, than your statement that it should not be "swallowed" except by naive people.

All the best

Simon

hoskib

iTrader: (1)

'We have also paid over the odds for the name,'

who owned the scoobysport name?

Phil

Pete Croney?

ex-webby

The receivers

Phil

of course

Phil

Then my answer would have been correct

ex-webby

Sorry, as the question was "who's the lucky soul then" I assumed the question was to find out who got the money.

All the best

Simon

scoobyexhausts

For anyone who is interested we ( Hayward and Scott) were approached by Pete Croney back in 1997 and ask to design a free flowing performance back box for the Impreza which WE did.As time went on and Scoobysport was born we did the de-cat centre and then design the open mouth de-cat down pipe.
You are saying that we didn,t design it ,THEN WHO DID !!!!.

Ian

ex-webby

Ian

I don't think it is in anyone's interest to get into all of this. The facts are these :

1) The final scoobysport system that you produced for scoobysport was not designed by you. Quite possibly the scoobysport design was based on a design you had produced. But that does not mean the final design was yours.

2) The system manufactured currently by Janspeed for ScoobySport (the official scoobysport exhaust system) is not the same design as yours and they both perform AND sound differently.

I'm sure your system is excellent, so this is not a mud slinging competition.. all I was clarifying was that it is not the same.

All the best

Simon

scoobyexhausts

1) The final scoobysport system that you produced for scoobysport was not designed by you. Simon[/QUOTE]


Simon

Up to and including the last exhaust that Scoobysport sold under the Hayward and Scott name WAS desigened by us and nobody else.
Janspeed copied our exhaust and made very subtle changes to make it different but at the end of the day it was basically the same.
No one is "slinging mud " but lets get the facts right.

Ian

harvey

iTrader: (48)

Simon : You have now heard from the Managing Director of Hayward & Scott stating categorically that they designed and manufactured the Scoobysport exhaust up until last Summer. At that time Croney made other arrangements with Janspeed. I hope that has cleared up the desigin of the original Scoobysport exhaust. Perhaps you were misled.
I have the highest regard for Janspeed and do not doubt that they have incorporated their knowledge gained over many years in the Scoobysport exhaust they manufactured off and on since last Summer, however, designing and manufacturing exhausts is not rocket science nor is it just welding a few pipes together. Your words not mine.
I stand by exactly what I have said and you are free to suggest I have no idea what is involved in creating an efficient exhaust system however I guess my results must be a big fluke and I must be a bit thick if I have not learned anything from testing numerous systems over the last two years. www.geocities.com/harveysmith3000 .

There are a number of good exhausts available and even amongst the good systems there are variations in performance. The Scoobysport exhaust system from Janspeed does not have unique properties to endow superior performance.

In my quest for usable power I am always open to alternative products. I am quite happy to buy a system from your new venture providing it produces more power than my current system. Let me know when it is available and I can visit you via G-Force or Power Engineering and after fitment, hopefully the same day a second power run can show the benefits of your system. Obviously I would be happy to publicise the results to the masses on Scoobynet.

As regards your new venture I would like to wish you well in bringing new performance products or improved products to the Subaru market. This can only be good for enthusiastic Subaru owners. I understand there are a number of rally personnel looking for employment because of changes in the rally world so now is obviously a good time to plug into their knowledge but the new venture will be hard pressed to sell adequate volume of product at competative prices so good luck with it.

One thing to bear in mind however is just because something is good on a rally car does not mean it has a direct application on a road car with a much longer life expectancy but I expect you are fully aware of that.

ex-webby

OK

I think we should just leave it there as this is going round in circles.

All the best Ian and harvey

Simon

scoobyexhausts

QUOTE

"You are saying that we didn,t design it ,THEN WHO DID !!!!."

You still haven,t answer the question Simon !!

Ian

ex-webby

QUOTE

"I think we should just leave it there as this is going round in circles."

But seeing as you want to continue it.. My understanding (and this is supported by a number of people, including Pete), the system was originally specified by pete, you put together a prototype, then he made alterations to it including providing you with drawings, etc.

So, to my mind, that means pete was the driving force behind anything happening at all, and the one who specified / designed the specific system.

Anyway, like I said.. I think we should just leave it there.. I wish you all the best and success for your product. But please do not state that it is the same as the scoobysport system, as it is not.

All the best

Simon

scoobyexhausts

I will say it again , Pete had nothing to do with the design of the exhaust we didn't make a protype the first one we made was the same as the last one we made for Scoobysport NO difference.We certaintly never got a drawing from Pete or anyone else and never made any "alterations " during us suppling Scoobysport.
This subject came up in the court case we had with Pete about who designed the SCOOBYSPORT EXHAUST and he never contested it then.
We shall however keep calling the exhaust "THE ORGINAL SCOOBYSPORT EXHAUST "

Danny B

I thought it was common knowledge that the SS exhaust was designed & made by H&S for and behalf of Scoobysport.

SDB

OK Ian

I really am going to leave it there as this is going nowhere. I would double check with your lawyers before continuing to call your system what you are suggesting.

Regards

Simon

Butty

iTrader: (2)

This is the messy part of what happens when taking over titles and ownership to trademarks etc in takerovers and aquisitions- things are never as always as straight forward as they appear.
I'm surprised that the Scoobysport name has reappeared so quickly for this reason and due to the long list of customers left in the dark.

Nick

nom

I think the reason this keeps going round in circles is that ScoobySport got its name from having 'the' exhaust system; in effect, to the masses, ScoobySport was the exhaust system. Key marketing point. And key to H&S, who seem to now be being told that their system isn't actually theirs at all? A sore point, I'd have thought, quite reasonably...

So... once things for ScoobySport fell through with H&S, ScoobySport's main marketing was out the window - and they had to go to a new supplier, which had to produce a different exhaust (marketed as an improvement as it's a way to explain the shift to a new supplier for those 'new to the scene'). They had to produce a different exhaust because H&S owned the rights to the original system, because... oh yes, H&S designed it. Or that appears to be the decision, not only because of a court ruling, but why else would ScoobySport change the design of its main selling point?

(Thought I should add/clarify - Janspeed is doubtless an excellent manufacturer - I have never heard anything to the contrary - but what they were producing from ScoobySport was not what most people would regard as 'the' ScoobySport exhaust: that was - and still is - alive & kicking as the H&S exhaust system)