Groupbuy for US STi short engine
10 February 2004, 10:32 PM
#121
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: 32 cylinders and many cats
Posts: 18,658
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
2.5 will find any gearbox weak points in short order.
My £2000 + build guaranteed Lateral Performance 450 BHP and 400 lbft gearbox broke in only three weeks use at maximum torque of 391 lbft. It was the torque of the motor that revealed its inadequacies so quickly.
A five speed non-STi box would probably last a similar time or slightly longer.
The 2.5 is absolutely brutal on the torque - it hits hard from 2500 to the red line with relentless torque. Even on smooth roads if they are not dry then fourth gear gives the diffs a workout in a straight line and you have to have both hands on the wheel to control it.
My £2000 + build guaranteed Lateral Performance 450 BHP and 400 lbft gearbox broke in only three weeks use at maximum torque of 391 lbft. It was the torque of the motor that revealed its inadequacies so quickly.
A five speed non-STi box would probably last a similar time or slightly longer.
The 2.5 is absolutely brutal on the torque - it hits hard from 2500 to the red line with relentless torque. Even on smooth roads if they are not dry then fourth gear gives the diffs a workout in a straight line and you have to have both hands on the wheel to control it.
11 February 2004, 12:27 PM
#124
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 2,924
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Out of interest is the JDM 5sp considered to be "stronger" because the final drive ratio is better able to deal with a higher torque output? In the same way people state that the STi RA box is "stronger" than either standard WRX or STi.
Mark A
Mark A
11 February 2004, 06:41 PM
#125
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: RIP Moneys Scoob 440bhp/470lbsft 31-07-08
Posts: 6,005
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wrx, it all depends how you push it.
John has 391 torque, but he has the mods behind it to push that far ie turbo, fmic (i think?), injectors etc?
You dont need to push as much torque as this and thus keep your gearbox! lol
Mark YHM
John has 391 torque, but he has the mods behind it to push that far ie turbo, fmic (i think?), injectors etc?
You dont need to push as much torque as this and thus keep your gearbox! lol
Mark YHM
11 February 2004, 07:12 PM
#126
Scooby Newbie
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am running this Shortblock using V6 STI RA heads here in the states on an MY04 WRX Wagon. The stock WRX 5MT is not up to the task at all. I have already destroyed one tranny with this motor and am working on the 2nd one right now.
Count me in for one
15 February 2004, 10:52 AM
#133
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 401
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have a MY98 with piston slap. If you guys are buying new short engines then would it be worth my while rebuilding my engine using your cast offs? How much would you sell your old short engine for?
Cheers,
Andy
Cheers,
Andy
15 February 2004, 05:18 PM
#135
Well, Im still in, but I dunno if it will be fitted in my modded Type R or if ill sell it and buy a standard-ish STI7 to go with it :-)
I could even collect from TW if I need too.
How heavy can a short block be?, 50KG?. If it fits in a boot if you line it with something to spread the weight.
I could even collect from TW if I need too.
How heavy can a short block be?, 50KG?. If it fits in a boot if you line it with something to spread the weight.
Last edited by Hol; 15 February 2004 at 05:20 PM.
19 February 2004, 12:04 AM
#141
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Where age and treachery reins over youthful exuberance
Posts: 5,275
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Seen the Lambo-beater in Autocar this week? They have reviewed a 'Type 25' Impreza created by Ian Litchfield of Litchfield Imports. Basically, this car is a new STi fitted with the USDM 2.5 block as in the Group Buy here, and a lot of nice tweaked bits.
The story is headlined "The Best Impreza on Planet Earth" and compares the car directly to a Lambo Gallardo. Quote: "Not even a 5.0-litre V10 can match the Scooby's initial mid-range and it's the Jap saloon that bolts post-apex that little bit harder." and "they are so evenly matched in every conceivable parameter..."
The Litchfield car puts out 350bhp at 6,900rpm, with 356lbs/ft at 3,650rpm on Power Station's "notoriously pessimistic dyno." It blows 1.4bar at 3,000rpm with an 8.8:1 compression ratio. The only criticism appears to be the Scooby's choice of six-speed gearbox ratios.
It's a rave review by any standards, and the Litchfield T25 is a performance bargain at £33k. Which makes this Group Buy at 1/30th of the cost a real no-brainer
Richard.
The story is headlined "The Best Impreza on Planet Earth" and compares the car directly to a Lambo Gallardo. Quote: "Not even a 5.0-litre V10 can match the Scooby's initial mid-range and it's the Jap saloon that bolts post-apex that little bit harder." and "they are so evenly matched in every conceivable parameter..."
The Litchfield car puts out 350bhp at 6,900rpm, with 356lbs/ft at 3,650rpm on Power Station's "notoriously pessimistic dyno." It blows 1.4bar at 3,000rpm with an 8.8:1 compression ratio. The only criticism appears to be the Scooby's choice of six-speed gearbox ratios.
It's a rave review by any standards, and the Litchfield T25 is a performance bargain at £33k. Which makes this Group Buy at 1/30th of the cost a real no-brainer
Richard.
19 February 2004, 01:14 AM
#142
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: 32 cylinders and many cats
Posts: 18,658
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
My engine on equally pessimistic dyno with a larger turbo and FMIC did 434 BHP at 1.27 bar and 395 lbft at 1.4 bar at Star.
Seems to be holding together doing so so far, has about 5000 miles under its belt now without any issues at all.
Seems to be holding together doing so so far, has about 5000 miles under its belt now without any issues at all.
19 February 2004, 02:41 AM
#143
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Where age and treachery reins over youthful exuberance
Posts: 5,275
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
John, my excuse for being excited about this, is insomnia following the regular post-Exmas detox. What's yours? :
You (and Litchfield) have shown this motor to have majorly impresive performance potential. If only there was an easy gearbox solution for Classic owners. I just don't fancy the 6-speeder - it's only virtue is apparent strength. But if there's no alternative, that's one hell of a strength. Are there any viable alternatives, in your view, now or near future?
Looking forward to joining to 2.5 club, and leaving those sad 2.0 Group N guys in our dust: Especially Floyd 
Richard.
: You (and Litchfield) have shown this motor to have majorly impresive performance potential. If only there was an easy gearbox solution for Classic owners. I just don't fancy the 6-speeder - it's only virtue is apparent strength. But if there's no alternative, that's one hell of a strength. Are there any viable alternatives, in your view, now or near future?
Looking forward to joining to 2.5 club, and leaving those sad 2.0 Group N guys in our dust
: Especially Floyd Richard.
Last edited by Hoppy; 19 February 2004 at 02:46 AM.
19 February 2004, 11:19 AM
#144
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 445
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
its the olny thing thats holding me back from getting the cash now, athough i have been informend that as long as i do not excced 400lb of tourqu or 400bhp i should be okay with the 2.5......does this sound about right.( hoping for an answer from the SN boys )
all th best
jay
all th best
jay
19 February 2004, 12:01 PM
#145
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 2,924
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ok lets get this moving.
I plan to contact the supplier in the USA today and check availability of the short engines, once he confirms this then I will start collecting names (I'll use a new thread may be). This will be Tuesday most likely and I need between 5-20 lucky buyers.
I plan to take a deposit of @ £550 (once the US price is confirmed) from each member and pay for the whole batch on my credit card.
Once the engines are in the UK I would be charged for the shipping, import & VAT. I can then calculate the individual outstanding amounts.
The distribution point is proving slightly problematic. I'm hoping to use my friends warehouse or garage as the store while shipping to the UK is arranged. If the UK shipping is expensive then I'll deliver them myself in a transit van. The cost of this would be the hire & fuel divide by the number of people needing delivery.
Finally, if people participating in this groupbuy agree I would like a small reward or token of thanks for organising this. This would, numbers permitting be, buy 10 get 1 free i.e the US cost of a short engine divide by the number in the groupbuy. I would still pay for my own shipping, import tax and VAT. Using the costs I already have would mean a total price of @ £1035 with only your local UK delivery to pay if needed.
I hope people are happy with this and feel free to e-mail me. I am away for a long weekend sorting out my wedding and will return on Tuesday.
Mark A
I plan to contact the supplier in the USA today and check availability of the short engines, once he confirms this then I will start collecting names (I'll use a new thread may be). This will be Tuesday most likely and I need between 5-20 lucky buyers.
I plan to take a deposit of @ £550 (once the US price is confirmed) from each member and pay for the whole batch on my credit card.
Once the engines are in the UK I would be charged for the shipping, import & VAT. I can then calculate the individual outstanding amounts.
The distribution point is proving slightly problematic. I'm hoping to use my friends warehouse or garage as the store while shipping to the UK is arranged. If the UK shipping is expensive then I'll deliver them myself in a transit van. The cost of this would be the hire & fuel divide by the number of people needing delivery.
Finally, if people participating in this groupbuy agree I would like a small reward or token of thanks for organising this. This would, numbers permitting be, buy 10 get 1 free i.e the US cost of a short engine divide by the number in the groupbuy. I would still pay for my own shipping, import tax and VAT. Using the costs I already have would mean a total price of @ £1035 with only your local UK delivery to pay if needed.
I hope people are happy with this and feel free to e-mail me. I am away for a long weekend sorting out my wedding and will return on Tuesday.
Mark A
19 February 2004, 07:53 PM
#147
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: RIP Moneys Scoob 440bhp/470lbsft 31-07-08
Posts: 6,005
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by ===WRX===
its the olny thing thats holding me back from getting the cash now, athough i have been informend that as long as i do not excced 400lb of tourqu or 400bhp i should be okay with the 2.5......does this sound about right.( hoping for an answer from the SN boys )
all th best
jay
all th best
jay
Try about 350 torque before your gearbox dies
